Ford previews 4-door Mustang hybrid sedan (Mach-4) to dealers

[HoldenSSVandGT350]

look, i hate teslas but i hate this abomination way more because at least teslas are honest.
cope all you like, they're being outsold 7 to 1 and being first loser doesn't fix what the market.

the most hilarious part of all this is how since the mustang stopped being good at mustang-ing the battery powered explorer with a mustangstach actually appears to have outsold it last year.

because every mustang being made right now kind of sucks.

maybe that's why ford is considering selling the 4 door hackjob, typical corporate insanity to avoid fixing the real problem.

this should really drive the point home. this isn't about a set of features on a piece of paper, it is about the essential qualities of the idea of the mustang.

Bro, you’re rooting against the home team.

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[Oakley]

Bro, you’re rooting against the home team.

brand loyalty is for suckers.

 

[sk47]

Bro, you’re rooting against the home team.

brand loyalty is for suckers.

Hello; This thread has wandered around some. I badly wanted a 1967-68 Mustang GT back when I was young. Specifically, a dark blue GT with a 390 V8 & a manual trans. Could not afford such at the time.
Back a few years ago I finally owned a house and had fixed it up to the point of having a place to keep a Mustang inside. To be a bit more accurate this was after I lost faith in the Porsche brand. When the Cayman & Boxter first came out the Cayman became one of my dream cars. Then the IMS bearing fiasco rocked my faith in Porsche. Not so much that they made an engineering error but the way the episode was handled.
By 2009 the bearing issue was fixed in a new engine design. I held faith with Porsche up to 2016 when they dropped the flat six for a turbo four. (I know some few special models can have a six at enormous cost) I slowly lost the desire to have a Cayman. Not that a Cayman is not a great driver's car. It remains a great package. The cost to buy factored in. The flat four just does not do it for me in a Porsche. Oddly the lack of a spare tire was a last straw. I even measured the space under the rear hatch glass to find a road wheel/tire will not fit.

So, around 2018/19 i started looking to a new Base GT Mustang with a Manual. Had three potential buys fall thru for odd reasons I had described in posts before. Then the Covid debacle hit and skewed prices. Now what I found for around $30K has become well over $40 K and a base GT is rare. Still can fit a spare in a Mustang as far as I know.
So, I eventually talked myself into accepting a high $40 K price and started shopping around a year& a half ago when this forum informed me the Mustang Coyote does not have cylinder deactivation. I have tried for a couple of 2025 GT's and one 26.
The 26 has a lot of features I do not like at all. Touch screens, no manual hand brake and the rear end stand out. But I can live with those since the Mustang is essentially the only real choice for such a car.
To the point. I have been pro Ford for a long time. I happen to own a Chevy pickup now because when my F-150 got totaled the ford dealers would not cut me a deal while the Chevy dealer did so. I needed a truck and had only so much to spend. That counts. At least to me.
I hope Ford makes a four door car with a Coyote and a manual option. I hope it is not super expensive as unlike many on this forum cost is an issue to me. I might be able to hold my nose and live with a Mustang styled four-door if the rest of the car is OK.
Things like touch screens and other silly electronic stuff could be hard to overlook. So far, this thread is like arguing about how hairy a bigfoot is. Neither bigfoot nor a four-door Ford sedan with a v8 are known to exist yet. I reserved the right to like or dislike the final product.

 

[ORRadtech]

Hello; This thread has wandered around some.

16 pages of complaining, trolling and name calling. I'm sure Ford is impressed.
It's all just pissing into the wind.

 

[HoldenSSVandGT350]

brand loyalty is for suckers.

View attachment 928926

brand loyalty is for suckers.

brand loyalty is for suckers.

Sure, that’s why I’ve sported GMs and Fords depending on what they offer at any given point in time. And I currently have one of each. Blind loyalty is dumb, sure, but, actively rooting against Ford seems to me to be, in your parlance, exceedingly developmentally challenged.

So, don’t buy a Mach 4 because of its name or because you weren’t going to buy a 4 door anyway. There is an affordable V8 sedan niche to be filled and GM/Ford both know it. The Ecoboost/Powerboost variant will pay the bills in units sold and the V8/Powerboost will be the enthusiast spec. Cross fingers for a manual that starts with TR though….

 

[Oakley]

...actively rooting against Ford seems to me to be...

that's not what this is and your misdiagnosis indicates the real problem here.

 

[RocketGuy3]

you:

"Look at the CT4-V Blackwing. It's based on the Camaro platform, and ... is no heavier than a V8 Camaro. "

some other guy:
"...An extra 125-200lbs..."

also you:

"You're right about one thing. We can prove it, and... I think I just did? Unless you're actually going to quibble about 100 lbs of crumbs in a massive touring car? Especially when the heavier one added luxury and sound deadening."

so it went from no extra weight to 125-200lbs (my claim corroborated by the holden guy) and now you settle on around 100lbs. not only are you wrong but you admitted it and now crawfish to "well its just a little more weight" which is exactly my beef with this retarded nonsense, its always just a little more weight. weight ruins everything.

so, like i said. you are wrong about that. so its not shocking you'd misunderstand the point or maybe you just want to win an internet argument.

your view overly simplistic view is this is a quibble about a name.
I'm saying the name is an indicator of a much more fundamental problem.

you don't understand that. that's fine, but its also not my problem.
i will however happily mock your silliness.

wrong on weight. wrong on deeper philosophical implications of the nameplate designation.



the current mustang is already lame.
the mustang was always a compromise.
my car is about as heavy as I can stand.



if you actually want to know i wrote that out already in this thread.

lol "just want to win an internet argument". The irony is overwhelming coming from the archetypical internet tough guy.

And no, I don't see "proof" that it's 200 lbs heavier. If you compare the lightest spec Camaro to the heaviest spec 4BW? Maybe. But on average, it's around 100 lbs, which is almost nothing in this class of cars. And the stats in the article I linked demonstrate that. Plus, again, one is a luxury car.

Your argument about the name remains incomprehensible. That's fine.

you aren't the only one with special needs family, dude, you can get butthurt about words for no reason all you want but that's still retarded. furthermore, everyone is a little retarded (just gonna leave this door wide open so someone can give the predictable retort) so calm down, you aren't that special.

I was heartened by the fact that at least no one seemed to be on your side as you went on your tantrum, but @Mizicke5273 is quietly even liking the posts where you incoherently defend your school-playground-level use of the word "retard".

That's like saying "you're not the only black person in the world, so you don't get to have a problem with my using the n-word". Yes, it's "just a word". But you're still an ass for using it as a pejorative.

brand loyalty is for suckers.

This is the first thing you've said I agree with.

 

[MAGS1]

lol "just want to win an internet argument". The irony is overwhelming coming from the archetypical internet tough guy.

And no, I don't see "proof" that it's 200 lbs heavier. If you compare the lightest spec Camaro to the heaviest spec 4BW? Maybe. But on average, it's around 100 lbs, which is almost nothing in this class of cars. And the stats in the article I linked demonstrate that. Plus, again, one is a luxury car.

Your argument about the name remains incomprehensible. That's fine.



I was heartened by the fact that at least no one seemed to be on your side as you went on your tantrum, but @Mizicke5273 is quietly even liking the posts where you incoherently defend your school-playground-level use of the word "retard".

That's like saying "you're not the only black person in the world, so you don't get to have a problem with my using the n-word". Yes, it's "just a word". But you're still an ass for using it as a pejorative.



This is the first thing you've said I agree with.

I was going to respond to that bum but he’s not worth the effort anymore. Dude’s life must suck if he has to come to a forum and attempt to put other people down all the time

 

[Oakley]

lol "just want to win an internet argument". The irony is overwhelming coming from the archetypical internet tough guy.

And no, I don't see "proof" that it's 200 lbs heavier. If you compare the lightest spec Camaro to the heaviest spec 4BW? Maybe. But on average, it's around 100 lbs, which is almost nothing in this class of cars. And the stats in the article I linked demonstrate that. Plus, again, one is a luxury car.

Your argument about the name remains incomprehensible. That's fine.

why you actin like i said that? no wonder you think my argument is incomprehensible, you're imagining things. is it really hard to understand that more weight = bad?

 

[Oakley]

I was going to respond to that bum but he’s not worth the effort anymore. Dude’s life must suck if he has to come to a forum and attempt to put other people down all the time

i think you're imagining things, too

 

[RocketGuy3]

why you actin like i said that? no wonder you think my argument is incomprehensible, you're imagining things. is it really hard to understand that more weight = bad?

The point is that "more weight" has subjective implications. Would you care if it was 1 lb more? 5 lbs? Even for the practicality you gain from a proper back seat?

• Honestly it was my mistake for bringing up a flawed example to begin with. With the Blackwing/Camaro, we are still comparing a sports coupe to a luxury sedan
• Even with that example, 100 lbs is not nothing, but it's a ~2.5% difference in what has been a heavy touring car for a long time.
• When you look at strictly apples to apples comparisons, there are even more examples demonstrating that the weight difference is absolutely nothing. G80 M3 vs M4, G37 coupe vs G37 sedan... With some of these examples, the sedan is actually lighter.

Plus, there exist exactly zero other RWD performance sedans today that weigh meaningfully less than the Mustang, let alone with a naturally aspirated V8 and a manual.

 

[Oakley]

neither more nor weight are subjective concepts because both are measurable by empirical standards. weight ruins everything, therefore, more is worse. quit confusing things and then saying i'm being confusing.

also literally all the other stuff i said that you've ignored about essential qualities and ford's complete mishandling of the mustang lately across the board.

 

[RocketGuy3]

neither more nor weight are subjective concepts because both are measurable by empirical standards. weight ruins everything, therefore, more is worse. quit confusing things and then saying i'm being confusing.

also literally all the other stuff i said that you've ignored about essential qualities and ford's complete mishandling of the mustang lately across the board.

You are obstinate. Let me ask you, have you ever found yourself saying the words "that's a good point, maybe I was wrong/I didn't see it that way/you're right", either on the internet or in person? I can assure you, it won't make you look stupid. In fact, it will save you dignity.

I never said weight is subjective. I said the implications of weight are subjective. It is not objective or quantifiable how any given person will perceive any given difference in weight, especially considering other mechanical variables (such as weight distribution).

You think I ignored half of what you said? More irony... You just ignored 90% of what I said, and you have done that consistently. And for obvious reasons.

 

[Oakley]

You are obstinate. Let me ask you, have you ever found yourself saying the words "that's a good point, maybe I was wrong/I didn't see it that way/you're right", either on the internet or in person?

yes. countless times. its actually remarkably easy to do if you bring forth substantive arguments and actual new things to consider instead of regurgitating nonsense and ad hominem fallacies.

I never said weight is subjective. I said the implications of weight are subjective. It is not objective or quantifiable how any given person will perceive any given difference in weight, especially considering other mechanical variables (such as weight distribution).

yes, i did notice that. you've been pretty consistent about ignoring my actual points across the board.

you think I ignored half of what you said? More irony... You just ignored 90% of what I said, and you have done that consistently. And for obvious reasons.

you've missed my principle point by miles. you're arguing about things downstream from bad decisions while I'm concerned with the setup for the bad decisions. everything you're arguing about is an effect of what my actual complaint is.

 

[RocketGuy3]

yes. countless times. its actually remarkably easy to do if you bring forth substantive arguments and actual new things to consider instead of regurgitating nonsense and ad hominem fallacies.



yes, i did notice that. you've been pretty consistent about ignoring my actual points across the board.



you've missed my principle point by miles. you're arguing about things downstream from bad decisions while I'm concerned with the setup for the bad decisions. everything you're arguing about is an effect of what my actual complaint is.

I don't care that you don't like the Mustang. I don't like the S650 very much either, which is why I plan to hold onto my Mach 1 for the foreseeable future. What you haven't made clear is why you think this sedan will be even worse for the Mustang brand.

I'm harping on weight because the first (and only) substantive thing you said criticizing the car specifically for being a sedan was that it would be "heavier and lamer".

If the Mach-4 turns out how it realistically could given the information we have today, it could actually be a great car. In a market that features very few affordable performance sedans, and ZERO sedans with a NA V8 + manual, this has a great place in the market and the car world. And yes, it is also unlikely to weigh meaningfully more than the coupe.

"yes. countless times."

Honestly would love a link to an example. Did I go ad hominem? Absolutely. And it truly blows my mind how you don't see the irony in you pointing that out, too. I'm kind of starting to wonder if you remember what you ate for breakfast this morning.

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