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SheepDog

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TBH, while I'm still on the same page as you when it comes to the DHSC or the GTD, I certainly still see the appeal of a standard Dark Horse over a base C8, even if the C8 is faster... The DH is far more practical (at least a somewhat useable backseat, more trunk space, easier ingress/egress, better touring car), possibly better steering feedback, and most importantly: a manual transmission.

However, the further up in the price spectrum you move up with Mustangs, the less sense they make because the less those differences matter (if the differences even exist, like you can't get a DHSC with a stick, and I'm not sure the DHSC TP even has a backseat).
The conversation in this thread mostly revolved around the performance Delta between the dark horse SC and the GT500. ( if there even is any) and the ridiculous price they’re asking for it. Sure if usability and functionality are also considered the Mustang makes more sense than a base Corvette. But then again, so does a base M3
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Evolvd

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Like I said, I agree there are other things to consider, and normally I hate the magazine racing that's prevalent on these forums. Cars are more than their lap times... but I think the rest of my reply to you might overlap with your other message:



I disagree. They are both performance-oriented American V8 sports cars. They are built differently and have some degree of unique appeal and practicality differences, but especially as you get into the upper trims of the Mustang (Dark Horse+), the likelihood increases of someone cross-shopping the two because they have the same use case (street bragging rights and/or track day fun).

And no one is purely talking about cost, but about value. If a car costs $500K, but is more fun and faster than million dollar hypercars of the day, it might be a great value. I don't see the value in a DHSC Track Pack for any prospective buyer.

Who would prefer a DHSC over a Z06, and why? Is the extra trunk space really that meaningful to people in this income bracket? Will people buy the Mustang just because they think it looks better? Is Ford hoping it's just more fun to drive in some esoteric way that will be exceedingly difficult to convince the masses of?
Well, I would prefer a DHSC over a Z06 because I never liked corvettes and I don’t buy cars based on which one has the best bragging rights at one metric or another. In fact the vast majority of people don’t shop that way either. And since the Mustang has not gone out of production since 1965 I’d say Ford kinda has a pretty good idea of what market they fill.

Or maybe a bunch of randos on an insignificant chat forum know better than them 🤣🤦
 

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Uh A base 911 turbo ( they only have the Turbo S) starts at 270k. A fully loaded CT5V blackwing is around 150k. Price should always be the determining factor when comparing two vehicles. If a Mustang costs as much as a C8, then the Mustang isn’t a good value when the C8 beats it in every metric. Ford is the one who has now entered corvette territory, because thy overpriced their offering. Why would you buy a DarkHorse when a C8 costs the same, looks better, goes faster, stops better, and will smash the Mustang on a track?
1772844571672-n8.webp
Ok well you’ll have to excuse me for not being a Porsche fan…but I could literally pick a dozen other cars in the same price range that have nothing to do with each other.

You missed the forest through the trees by arguing the minutiae of my point.
 

Joe Gonsalves

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The Dark Horse name has done nothing to demand such a high price tag. Does it win races? Nope, still getting spanked by Toyota and Chevy on the NASCAR circuit. People want to feel like they are buying a winner. But there is no reputation for the name plate. So Ford has an identity problem with this car exacerbated by the outlandish price and ugly truckling looks.
 
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Craig Brown

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They aren't trying to market it to you. They are looking to sell it to the Jay Lenos of the world. And they will buy it at any cost.
 

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MAGS1

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Does it win races? Nope, still getting spanked by Toyota and Chevy on the NASCAR circuit. People want to feel like they are buying a winner.
This ain’t the 60’s anymore. You really think people buy Camry’s because they win in NASCAR??
 

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I wouldn't expect the heavier car with quite a bit less power to win on a tight circuit (relative to a 13 mile stretch), would you?
GTD would get smoked even worse with the same drivers in the same conditions on the same day on a 13 mile track. Not enough power to hang.

no sense in comparing times there because of weather, traffic, etc. at least on a smaller closed track you can get good data and control the environment.
 
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MAGS1

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Who would prefer a DHSC over a Z06, and why?
i would. The C8 is one of the most sterile feeling sports cars I’ve ever been in. Granted, I have not driven a Z06, but the C8 is very numb as far as steering feeling and just didn’t make me smile like the Mustang does (or even a C6/C7). The C8 performs, but it’s pretty damn boring IMO.
 
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Joe Gonsalves

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This ain’t the 60’s anymore. You really think people buy Camry’s because they win in NASCAR??
Actually I see plenty of Camrys with deck spoilers and wheels. So yeah, I do. Lol. But the point I was making is DH does not have the reputation of a winning sports car. If Ford wants to sell them they need something to get you in the door.
 

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MAGS1

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Actually I see plenty of Camrys with deck spoilers and wheels. So yeah, I do. Lol. But the point I was making is DH does not have the reputation of a winning sports car. If Ford wants to sell them they need something to get you in the door.
I honestly don’t think it matters. Camaro wasn’t in racing for a period of time, Chevy used the Monte Carlo and the Lumina in NASCAR for quite a while. There is the IMSA Mustang Challenge which is the Dark Horse R. So it is in racing. And I believe the GT3/GT4 cars are technically Dark Horse based.

The people around here that drive around in Camry’s and Corolla’s with picnic tables mounted to the trunk are very likely not watching racing of any kind except for Mexico street races on TikTok and YouTube. Maybe F1. Maybe.
 

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Honest question:

Who is the target consumer for the DH SC? I feel like if a buyer wanted a track weapon at $140k+ then they would get a Porsche GT4 at a minimum. If they preferred an American V8 then a ZR1 or Z06(maybe). Can even get a 458 Challenge car for that price (obviously not street legal).

Is it for those who were denied GTD orders? very curious
 

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Ok well you’ll have to excuse me for not being a Porsche fan…but I could literally pick a dozen other cars in the same price range that have nothing to do with each other.

You missed the forest through the trees by arguing the minutiae of my point.
Pricing is the determining factor when cross shopping. Otherwise, you could cross shop a Civic type R with a Pagani Zonda.

regardless of layout, horsepower, drivetrain, practicality, etc. if the money doesn’t line up within a few grand, it doesn’t make sense to compare them to begin with. So, either Ford has overshot their expectations on value, or GM is providing good value for theirs. the answer is yes and yes.

I think you are trying to argue that a Corvette was and is a higher tier sports car than a Mustang is, right? And therefore should not be in the same category, However, because they cost the same, then by definition they are now in the same category.

shame on Ford, good on GM.
 

SheepDog

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Honest question:

Who is the target consumer for the DH SC? I feel like if a buyer wanted a track weapon at $140k+ then they would get a Porsche GT4 at a minimum. If they preferred an American V8 then a ZR1 or Z06(maybe). Can even get a 458 Challenge car for that price (obviously not street legal).

Is it for those who were denied GTD orders? very curious
New for new, anyone who wants to spend 140k on a sport car, I guess.

the options certainly open up if comparing used options, but that really isn’t a fair comparison.
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