Daytime Running Lights (DRLs) on the S550

[Norm Peterson]

For the most part, you have good arguments. I don't always agree with your opinion, but everyone is entitled to their own point of view. But to say that people get better at anything simply by practicing and that experienced drivers are thus better than younger drivers is a generalization that is far-fetched. First of all, practice in and of itself doesn't make people better at things. The practice must be done correctly, or you simply become better at doing things wrong.

Fair enough. Let's agree that they have to be practicing the right things, and that [all too-common] driver behaviors such as running through stop signs, late yellows and early reds don't fit that definition.

Over time, you do get better at knowing what you and your car can do, and while I can't even begin to explain how this happens - you do get better at anticipating what other drivers might suddenly do . . . at least if you're paying attention to such matters.

Secondly, as time progresses our minds, eye sight, muscles, and reactions tend to deteriorate. Jack Nicklaus has had much more practice and experience hitting golf balls and navigating golf courses than any other player currently playing on the PGA Tour, yet he would not fare well against them. Lastly, regardless of experience, an unexpected situation can lie around any corner, at any time.

Trust me, at 67 I am very much aware of this aging factor and what the future may hold in store. Fortunately for me so far, the edge of having years of experience and the resulting basis for better judgment seems to be keeping ahead of the physical decline. I do know of a couple of very specific things that if I stop noticing them as clearly as I currently do that the "curve" has already peaked and I'll be on the down side. It'll be on me to compensate in the appropriate manner(s), and I know that "sure as I'm sittin' here".

With respect to "unexpected situations", I won't underestimate the value of the autocrossing that I've done at various times starting in my mid-20's. Sometime during this coming year, I'm going to put my 17 y/o granddaughter through one of the local SCCA Region's "Street Survival" schools, which is performed in an environment that mimics autocross in many respects. She's going to get an instructed several year head start on what I basically ended up having to teach myself.


Norm

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[phil1336]

Arguing about any potential downside to DRL`s versus the possibility that it (might) make your Vehicle more easily seen would appear to be an easy assumption. I remember many years ago, my block headed Irish Mother-in-Law when present with proof that her long held beliefs were simply not valid, her response was, well...."I never heard of such a thing". Much the same is arguing about DRL`s to someone who is convinced that their driving skills of "defensive" driving trumps having your Vehicle more easily visible to oncoming traffic. I`m bored.......

 

[Norm Peterson]

What I've been saying all along is that it really is possible to actively turn on lighting as necessary. Me, I'm just evidence that this is possible (as is my wife), not any guarantee from me that it's going to be a good enough approach for you. Whether people today are willing to accept such responsibility is a separate question, and I agree that for them DRLs are as good a solution as any (short of not letting them drive at all).

What I'd like to see would be an arrangement similar to the TC setup on my '08 GT, where it defaults to 'on' at each start-up and gives me a switch to turn it off if that's what I choose to do. Full headlights with the flash function are going to be far better at getting you noticed anyway.


To those arguing the appearance thing. Time was when car shapes were accented using bright trim. Most of that stuff eventually either found its way off my cars or got painted over, so it's not that I'm objecting to the new way manufacturers have found to accent cars these days. Never liked any of it.


Deal?


Norm

 

[phil1336]

Norm;
For the sake of using (your) logic, why not deactivate your Tail Lights too? Being a cautious and safe Driver as you and your Wife obviously are, there is no need to have a Brake Light illuminated either to make Drivers and Vehicles (behind) you aware of your presence. Its (not) about you, DLR`s as well as Tail & Brake Lights are for others to be keenly aware of you and your Car so they don`t make contact with you resulting in a Crash. It should not be all that difficult to comprehend. As far as your analogy of comparing the use of DRL`s with Chrome Trim, that "might" apply to Audi and their over use of Headlamp LED adornment but otherwise, I don`t seen the connection with safety.

 

[Norm Peterson]

Norm;
For the sake of using (your) logic, why not deactivate your Tail Lights too? Being a cautious and safe Driver as you and your Wife obviously are, there is no need to have a Brake Light illuminated either to make Drivers and Vehicles (behind) you aware of your presence. Its (not) about you, DLR`s as well as Tail & Brake Lights are for others to be keenly aware of you and your Car so they don`t make contact with you resulting in a Crash. It should not be all that difficult to comprehend.

Simpler and shorter is sometimes better, so I re-wrote my response to this. But I won't ninja-edit out the original text. See the edited version a couple of posts down.


It isn't the same and I think we both know that. All that forward lights in the daytime do is more or less announce your presence. If you need taillights, which are not (yet) mandated to be continuously lit while driving, it's either not daytime or it is inclement to the point that the wipers are on (FWIW, I hate rain-X, as it smears/streaks under some conditions, so wipers - and full headights lights - it is . . . . there should be plenty of room to bitch at the rain-X guys who aren't using either wipers or lights on a rainy day by standing on the text of the law rather than its spirit).

Brake lights announce more than presence; they tell a following driver that the driver in front of them is actively doing something that directly affects them right now, perhaps suddenly - and these lights should never be lit unless the driver has actively turned them on by stepping on the brake pedal because he intends to slow or stop. The default here must be "off".


It's probably going to sound mighty strange coming from me, but there might be a decent argument for pulsing the brake lights when the rate of deceleration exceeds some value (no, I'm not going to try to define what that should be, though it should probably be at a level slightly below when ABS intervention occurs).

As far as your analogy of comparing the use of DRL`s with Chrome Trim, that "might" apply to Audi and their over use of Headlamp LED adornment

Audi is probably the poster-boy for precisely what I was getting at, and this was only concerned with the appearance aspect as that was mentioned separately from the safety side of all this. I wouldn't care for an "Audi look" set of parking lights/directionals either. Way too 'busy' for me.

Now that I think about the parking lights a bit, I could live with the S550's DRLs wired as parking lights/directionals. Never mind that I might then be able to locate some brake duct inlets where the OE parking lights are now . . .


Norm

 

[oyitsagreen]

Oh man. I saw this post again and thought it had been still going on ! Thank god it's only a couple pages since the last post in January. Still, a thread good for amusement.

 

[Norm Peterson]

The edit.

Norm;
For the sake of using (your) logic, why not deactivate your Tail Lights too? Being a cautious and safe Driver as you and your Wife obviously are, there is no need to have a Brake Light illuminated either to make Drivers and Vehicles (behind) you aware of your presence. Its (not) about you, DLR`s as well as Tail & Brake Lights are for others to be keenly aware of you and your Car so they don`t make contact with you resulting in a Crash. It should not be all that difficult to comprehend.

It isn't the same and I think we both know that.

Brake and taillights already are under driver control only, which is all I really want for any forward lighting.


Norm

 

[phil1336]

If reincarnation was a possibility, I would choose to return as a Golden Retriever in a good home such as the one I provide for both my "fuzzy faced Daughters". If that was not doable, I would like to return as you, Norm. A life so perfectly situated & planned I could dwell endlessly on matters of such importance as Daytime Running Lights. Needless to say, I`m rather envious. Fortunately you were not born in either Western Europe or Canada where you would need to seek relocation in a Country that didn`t take away your "right" to keep your Headlamps off during daylight hours. Your "blessed" indeed!

 

[Norm Peterson]

Well . . . being retired does have its advantages

A little extra "free time" is only one of them.


Norm

 

[Evolvd]

In 15 years nobody is going to be complaining about DRLs because they will be normal. It'll be automation or connectivity that is going to be the sandpaper on everyone's chocolate starfish. There are certainly big things about vehicles to debate....DRLs (IMHO) aren't one of them.

 

[activeGT]

The DRLs really make my car look great. My wife's new Mercedes have cooler ones though. Wish they would do some lighting in the Super Dutys.

 

[Norm Peterson]

In 15 years nobody is going to be complaining about DRLs because they will be normal. It'll be automation or connectivity that is going to be the sandpaper on everyone's chocolate starfish. There are certainly big things about vehicles to debate....DRLs (IMHO) aren't one of them.

And you don't think that accepting the little things without question doesn't smooth the way toward having the bigger "take-aways" forced upon us? Won't delay or suspend them, that's for sure.


Norm

 

[phil1336]

Norm;
Before you and all other conspiracy buffs have all your "Rights" taken away from you in all probability, we will all be taking our promised "dirt nap" and become worm food or elect to go "up the Chimney"! Relax and stop worrying.

 

[Norm Peterson]

I'm not worrying.

I'm objecting to the expectation that I must turn my back on a lifetime of making my own decisions, and that I must replace that experience with new "fixes" for all these things that the real worry-warts don't think I am capable of coping with unless their input is present.


Norm

 

[EcoSnake]

Have you seen the people they give driver's licenses to? Most cant see past their cell phones lol. They don't look bad imo, especially compared with other cars. Get the diode dynamic upgrades.

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