What's the deal with E85

[WildHorse]

Ok.. according to Alejandro Flores " gen1 coyote are way different 26*27* max, gen2 coyotes will go 27*-30* depending on how 'sweet' the 93 pump gas is. ". I wanted the answer, so I went to one of the best tuners out there.

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[Helios]

Ok.. according to Alejandro Flores " gen1 coyote are way different 26*27* max, gen2 coyotes will go 27*-30* depending on how 'sweet' the 93 pump gas is. ". I wanted the answer, so I went to one of the best tuners out there.

How do you get in contact with him directly ?

 

[WildHorse]

How do you get in contact with him directly ?

Got lucky?
Anyways watched his Ngauge in a video running E85. It most certainly does NOT give you all that 30 off a 2100 rpm launch. Holding was 30*, immediately when flooring it it drops to 18* and climbs steadily with RPM till 30 degrees then caries that the rest of the way from around 5500-7000 RPM. This was a N/A engine.

 

[Helios]

Got lucky?
Anyways watched his Ngauge in a video running E85. It most certainly does NOT give you all that 30 off a 2100 rpm launch. Holding was 30*, immediately when flooring it it drops to 18* and climbs steadily with RPM till 30 degrees then caries that the rest of the way from around 5500-7000 RPM. This was a N/A engine.

Well it must be what differencies all those tuners out there, how they adjust timing and vct. How much torque management is left there or everything out. It can get confusing really
But they all leave a safety margin i think, its too unsafe for them to just give you the strongest tune possible and risk your engine and bad rep online

 

[Bluemustang]

Got lucky?
Anyways watched his Ngauge in a video running E85. It most certainly does NOT give you all that 30 off a 2100 rpm launch. Holding was 30*, immediately when flooring it it drops to 18* and climbs steadily with RPM till 30 degrees then caries that the rest of the way from around 5500-7000 RPM. This was a N/A engine.

On my recent datalogs, it showed 27* at 3000 rpm WOT and held all the way up peaking at 30.5*, zero knock. That's pretty good performance to me. That 3000-7500 range is where I get the most average power with the 18 manifold. Didn't see anything like that running pump 93. Mostly I've been seeing about 27.5* maximum on my 93 tune. But at lower rpms timing was much less. On the 93 logs it starts in the low 20s on timing and rises slowly through the rpm range. Although I haven't looked closely at what it does "on the hit" so I can't address that. But getting timing with E85, equivalent to the maximum I typically see on 93 way down low at 3000 rpm is impressive to me. And having no knock to pull timing on me. I definitely felt it.

On 93 I will eventually get positive knock before I can hit the maximum timing (which is 30*). Its real knock, not false as I've used E85 and it won't knock.

If I run ethanol on my flex tune, it won't knock and I will see the max timing, but it runs like a hot 93 tune as opposed to the aggression of the E85 tune. So I won't get as much timing down low. Hope this helps anyone trying to understand the differences.

 

[oncewas]

No prob if you choose to go warranty void and tuning. A must do is your headers you want longtubes catless, the power is in there

Don't do just tune. do it right & only once

Could you point me toward a or a couple of good different headers?

 

[carguy1701]

Unless you run boost, E85 is a waste of time, IMO. It DOES have a higher octane rating, yes (roughly 108, IIRC, which is only matched by leaded race fuel), but the problem is that it has a lower energy content than E10 or E0 (that is to say, it makes a smaller bang). If you've ever looked at the EPA mileage ratings for factory flex-fuel cars and trucks, they're always lower than the regular gasoline numbers.

My parent's 2012 Focus is an E85 car and we've never used the stuff; it's just not worth it.

 

[Bluemustang]

Unless you run boost, E85 is a waste of time, IMO. It DOES have a higher octane rating, yes (roughly 108, IIRC, which is only matched by leaded race fuel), but the problem is that it has a lower energy content than E10 or E0 (that is to say, it makes a smaller bang). If you've ever looked at the EPA mileage ratings for factory flex-fuel cars and trucks, they're always lower than the regular gasoline numbers.

My parent's 2012 Focus is an E85 car and we've never used the stuff; it's just not worth it.

Incorrect. If we were discussing a factory, stock, flex fuel vehicle then yes you'd be right - there'd be no power gain.

For our purposes a Mustang tuned for E85, definitely not a waste of time. Get outta here with that crap, c'mon. There is a difference 100%. Its a fact.

 

[carguy1701]

Incorrect. If we were discussing a factory, stock, flex fuel vehicle then yes you'd be right - there'd be no power gain.

For our purposes a Mustang tuned for E85, definitely not a waste of time. Get outta here with that crap, c'mon. There is a difference 100%. Its a fact.

I'll admit I didn't read the thread; I just assumed OP was soliciting opinions.

 

[jmeiers]

Unless you run boost, E85 is a waste of time, IMO. It DOES have a higher octane rating, yes (roughly 108, IIRC, which is only matched by leaded race fuel), but the problem is that it has a lower energy content than E10 or E0 (that is to say, it makes a smaller bang). If you've ever looked at the EPA mileage ratings for factory flex-fuel cars and trucks, they're always lower than the regular gasoline numbers.

My parent's 2012 Focus is an E85 car and we've never used the stuff; it's just not worth it.

 

[WildHorse]

There is a difference 100%. Its a fact.

Yep. Dedicated E85 tune vs dedicated 93 tune there is a big difference. Even a flex tune makes a difference, once the widebands finish learning after a fillup.

 

[carguy1701]

Yep. Dedicated E85 tune vs dedicated 93 tune there is a big difference. Even a flex tune makes a difference, once the widebands finish learning after a fillup.

Like I said, was assuming a factory stock car or opinion solicitation.

I'll also admit that I didn't know N/A E85 tuning was a thing; I've only ever seen it mentioned in conjunction with boost.

 

[Bluemustang]

Like I said, was assuming a factory stock car or opinion solicitation.

I'll also admit that I didn't know N/A E85 tuning was a thing; I've only ever seen it mentioned in conjunction with boost.

Yes, it is a thing. Definitely way more beneficial for boosted applications though, as I'm sure you already know. But yeah if it's tuned to take advantage of it, N/A applications will still have gains over pump gas.

 

[Kermitz]

E85 is amazing! I gained 41HP/39TQ at the wheels. Same dyno, same day and with no other modifications. Just a tune.
The power it makes is so much fun, after 3K RPM it's a beast.
You will definitely get worse MPG, but E85 here is $1 less gallon than premium. So it doesn't bother me.

 

[WildHorse]

but E85 here is $1 less gallon than premium. So it doesn't bother me.

Those guys that brag about running 87 are having a coronary after reading that haha

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