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Gt vs 350

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Zooks527

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OP, if I were you, I'd be more concerned about GT350 engines guzzling oil. I read on here today one member's car was using a quart of oil in 350 miles.
IIRC, that was the most notable gripe in C&D's 40,000 mile test of a GT350. They loved the car, but made a big point about putting something like 22 quarts in on top of the oil changes and made mention of Ford talking about up to a quart every 500 miles being "normal" in some circumstances.
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Lorne34

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Not to beat a dead horse... (pun intended...:giggle:) but the oil consumption issues with the GT350 have been heavily documented in the GT350 section of this forum. I have done a lot of research on this topic as I have contemplated upgrading to the 350 myself several times...
The bottom line is that the 350 does consume oil and you need to check it regularly. Just like you would any other high performance engine (GT included).
The amount of oil is effected a lot by how you drive the car. The C&D team really flogged that car and did some extreme driving which increased oil consumption. Track use will do this as well. I believe the quart per 500 miles would be more common with track use then normal street driving.
Anyone who was experiencing extreme oil consumption under normal driving addressed it with a Ford Dealer and an oil consumption test was done to determine whether this was abnormal. In most cases the engine was replaced under warranty.
This is outside of the few that experienced catastrophic engine failure (threw a rod on the track etc..) which I believe is a low percentage.
There are a lot of happy GT 350 owners out there who understand the additional care needed with the Voodoo engine and take the necessary steps to maintain proper oil levels during normal use.
Everyone's tolerances are different; I am still trying to decide myself whether I want to deal with the extra expense and care of a Shelby vs a regular GT.
Right now there has been a wave of hysteria over the "ticking" and some failures of the updated 2018-19 DI coyote engine. Some have been unfortunate to run into issues others have not. I think it's the same way with the Shelby.
I will say that no matter how much you mod or wish for the standard GT to be like the Shelby GT350 in terms of handling, suspension, etc.. they are 2 totally different cars that provide different experiences for the driver. My 2016 GT felt front end heavy and I did not like the MT82 transmission in it... that is why I decided to look at the 350. In the interim I purchased a 2017 GT Vert just to see if I'd like the experience.
The 2018-19 GT's have improved greatly on the original S550 platform and fixed just about every gripe I had with the vehicle. I just don't like the looks of the front end, but it's growing on me. The 2019 GT is also an option for me.
Enjoy your new GT, they are all special/unique cars and we should be grateful to be able to drive and enjoy them.
 

jake_zx2

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I will say that no matter how much you mod or wish for the standard GT to be like the Shelby GT350 in terms of handling, suspension, etc.. they are 2 totally different cars that provide different experiences for the driver.
This is not true. The only significant difference between the cars in terms of suspension is the ball joint/lower control arm, which is required if you do a GT350 brake swap. Otherwise, the suspension is nearly identical, and can very easily be matched in the aftermarket
 

Houston Kid

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Mine was horrible. It was bad in my GT as well until I did the Steeda Stop the Hop kit. Now zero issues as this 11.679 run shows.
Question for all you gt 350 owners, how bad is the wheel hop? My gt pp was like a bucking bronco before all the bmr mods. I really dont wan't to have to deal with that again?
 

Lorne34

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This is not true. The only significant difference between the cars in terms of suspension is the ball joint/lower control arm, which is required if you do a GT350 brake swap. Otherwise, the suspension is nearly identical, and can very easily be matched in the aftermarket
ok, so I was using "general" terms in my description. But the bottom line is that the GT350 handles better, is nimbler, more planted and in a different dimension than a GT. Throw all of the BMR and other parts you want at it, it will still never be equal to a GT350. It doesn't mean it's the clear cut car for everyone, but it is superior to a GT in every way. I've driven both and there is a difference.... iEven owners of the PP2 GT's will admit the 350 is better.
 

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jake_zx2

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But the bottom line is that the GT350 handles better, is nimbler, more planted and in a different dimension than a GT. Throw all of the BMR and other parts you want at it, it will still never be equal to a GT350.
And again, this is not true. The cars are not "in a different dimension", they are actually EXTREMELY similar. The "handles better, is nimbler, more planted" is extremely miniscule and, to be frank, mostly in your head. The car has ever so slightly better steering feel due to the change in ball joints/control arms and the use of lightweight materials in suspension components, but even that is a minute difference and is not necessarily translated to real world numbers. As previously stated, it's actually quite easy to make a GT (specifically a PP2) a similar or better performer than the GT350, as all the suspension components are extremely similar, and after doing simply the GT350 brake swap from FP, makes the suspensions nearly identical aside from powertrain. There is nothing that makes the GT350 inherently and infinitely better than the GT like you seem to think
 

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And again, this is not true. The cars are not "in a different dimension", they are actually EXTREMELY similar. The "handles better, is nimbler, more planted" is extremely miniscule and, to be frank, mostly in your head. The car has ever so slightly better steering feel due to the change in ball joints/control arms and the use of lightweight materials in suspension components, but even that is a minute difference and is not necessarily translated to real world numbers. As previously stated, it's actually quite easy to make a GT (specifically a PP2) a similar or better performer than the GT350, as all the suspension components are extremely similar, and after doing simply the GT350 brake swap from FP, makes the suspensions nearly identical aside from powertrain. There is nothing that makes the GT350 inherently and infinitely better than the GT like you seem to think
They feel very different. I went from a GT to a GT350 and it's a big difference in my opinion. They are both driven nearly every day 3 seasons of the year, so I feel I have a good basis for comparison. Not just a test drive or two. Now, my opinion is dated because my comparison is between a 2015 GT and a 2016 GT350. There are newer GTs with upgrades that I'm sure bring them closer to the GT350.

I understand your feelings are hurt and you will argue to the end about this. But there is a noticeable and significant difference. Both are great cars though, and there's nothing wrong with Mustang GTs. They are definitely a better performance bargain in my opinion. I paid low 30s for the GT and over 60 for the GT350. I don't think they are worth that difference in money. However, I was bored with my GT after a year and I'm still not bored with the GT350 3 years later. The GT350 is just a better fit for me personally.
 

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A base GT vs a GT350 are in different leagues. I too had both and currently have a GT. Now that I’ve done all suspension upgrades they are now playing on the same field. The Magneride being the only major difference due to the ability to change the firmness of the shocks. As far as overall handling now, they are not that far apart. Minimal actually but slight edge to the GT350.

I would say same driver on same road course it might be a toss up on which car is faster due to the GT being faster on the straights on e85. I also upgraded to the Brembo so braking is equal.
So I’m saying if you throw about $5-6K at a base GT like mine, you can hang with a GT350 but there is no comparison between a base GT and a GT350.

I cannot comment on a PP car because I have no expierence in one.
 
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Erik427

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The Voodoo with a CPC conversion is a far better engine.
Oil consumption is greatly lowered
Cost is far cheaper than replacing the FPC.
Overall powerband is greatly improved.
 

Lorne34

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The Voodoo with a CPC conversion is a far better engine.
Oil consumption is greatly lowered
Cost is far cheaper than replacing the FPC.
Overall powerband is greatly improved.
Can you really do this? Have you seen it done?
 

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Lorne34

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A base GT vs a GT350 are in different leagues. I too had both and currently have a GT. Now that I’ve done all suspension upgrades they are now playing on the same field. The Magneride being the only major difference due to the ability to change the firmness of the shocks. As far as overall handling now, they are not that far apart. Minimal actually but slight edge to the GT350.

I would say same driver on same road course it might be a toss up on which car is faster due to the GT being faster on the straights on e85. I also upgraded to the Brembo so braking is equal.
So I’m saying if you throw about $5-6K at a base GT like mine, you can hang with a GT350 but there is no comparison between a base GT and a GT350.

I cannot comment on a PP car because I have no experience in one.
Hey Houston, Thanks for you input. I know you have owned both. My opinion is coming from a 2016 GT premium (non pp) and a 2017 GT Vert (non pp).
I know that the 2018-19 have closed the gap; it seems the engine and uniqueness of the 350- and some sort of intangible (8500 + sound?) make it a more engaging ride vs a modded GT. I'm not going to win the argument with Jake, nor do I want to. If you watch the FP video on the construction of the 350 it is a very unique and special car and has bits that cannot be replicated in the GT. The GT is getting better and better though....
 

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No doubt and I completely agree on the GT350 feeling special (subjective I know) when driving the car. The combo of the engine note, rowing the gears, and the feel of the car cannot be replicated in a GT no matter what you do.
If that’s what you are looking for, GT350 all day. If you want to mod your car and get it close in overall performance then a GT is a good choice due to the way lower initial price point on a base GT.

The GT350 is a special car but for me the mods of a base ended up being more appealing.
 
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foxcoupefan

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This is not true. The only significant difference between the cars in terms of suspension is the ball joint/lower control arm, which is required if you do a GT350 brake swap. Otherwise, the suspension is nearly identical, and can very easily be matched in the aftermarket
Most if not all people do not realize, the 18-19 Magneride GTs and PP2 cars use the same heavy duty hub assembly as a GT350 which is actually a Lincoln parts bin piece used on MKS limos. I just did a bunch to my PP2 including springs, CC plates and now 3" studs and learned this fr ol m a forum freind. It's a major thing that nobody seems to mention that is another cool thing about the PP2.

As for all the MT82 issues; this is because 90% of the people on this forum beat the living shit out of them every day drag racing stop light to stop light. Most of the open track HPDE guys that run a MGW or Barton shifter NEVER experience any issues. If it ever becomes an issue there are Tremecs and now heavy duty MT82 builds that are not very expensive. I have to say one thing, the MT shifts so nice no matter what anyone says.

So a PP2 for 40k or so with warranty, MGW shifter, a FTB diff cooler, a set of pads, and stainless lines and you are saving 10k over even a GOOD used GT350 and 20k plus over a new!!!! Rarity on the two cars is similar as well as resale as I did a comparison earlier in this thread. Just don't over pay for either and you will be happy.

With a proper driver a PP2 car is turning better documented times on the track than a GT350 and not too far off of the R.

I love the GT350 as it's an awesome car that doesn't need a lot of upgrades to have a ton of fun in. Again, it was a consideration and I almost pulled the trigger on one. However, I really like to tinker and do upgrades and much of the items I would change out on a 350 are just too nice to take off and replace (like those beautiful Recaros). I felt I was paying for stuff I wouldn't use. The flat plane sounds great but there is a reason ALL of the FP350s and GT4 cars use a cross plane crank. I think the Coyote sounds amazing as well with the correct exhaust and getting over 500 at the wheels on one is a piece of cake with minor upgrades. Voodoo and Coyote both have issues but neither are really much to worry about unlike many of the chicken littles on this forum try to make you believe.

Both are great cars and anyone trying to decide which one to go with just needs to go with their heart and pocket book.
 
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Hack

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The Voodoo with a CPC conversion is a far better engine.
Oil consumption is greatly lowered
Cost is far cheaper than replacing the FPC.
Overall powerband is greatly improved.
I realize that there are books worth of posts out there about GT350 oil consumption. My personal experience is zero oil consumption. I use it like a car and I take it to the track. Oil consumption is not about the crankshaft. It's pistons/rings/valves/valve lift/valve seals, etc.

IMO the GT350 works great.

No doubt and I completely agree on the GT350 feeling special (subjective I know) when driving the car. The combo of the engine note, rowing the gears, and the feel of the car cannot be replicated in a GT no matter what you do.
If that’s what you are looking for, GT350 all day. If you want to mod your car and get it close in overall performance then a GT is a good choice due to the way lower initial price point on a base GT.

The GT350 is a special car but for me the mods of a base ended up being more appealing.
I've considered selling or trading the GT350 at some point, but then I would have to do the mods to whatever GT I buy for track use. I had to retrofit parts onto my tech pack car, but it's really nice having the factory integrated cooling solutions for diff and transmission cooling. With handling of the GTs getting better and better - tires, magneride, etc. the track cooling and brakes are really the most significant differences (if you ignore the engine and the Tremec box). All stuff you can add, I realize. I guess I'm too lazy to want to go through those mods after getting the mods on the GT350 completed.
 

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