EB pro cal tune with downpipe

[floydbanks28]

I recently bought a used 2016 EB manual trans premium with 16k miles (car doesn't even feel broken in at all) put 3.73's in it (only because they didn't make 4.10's for it ) with the ford procal tune and intake. I'm still looking for a bit more power. Got iridium plugs on the way, and looking at intercoolers. My question is for the downpipe.

The procal can't tune for an off road down pipe as far as check engine lights and all that jazz, so my only option is to pair a catted one with the procal. Again the tune is meant for a stock car so I'm wondering if my car will run right or even make a difference in power with a high flow downpipe paired with the procal.

I'm honestly almost to the point of saying screw it and taking a loss on my warranty and money I spent on the procal to get a tuner and off road down pipe. :doh: which would be like $500 wasted.

I put an off road midpipe on my 98 gt without a tune (mil eliminators) and it runs good and gained a lot of power but obviously that's a completely different situation all together.

Anybody know if it would be worth it? or should I just get a new tune with an off road down pipe?

Also I live in Michigan so we don't have to worry about emissions.

Sponsored

 

[Spykexx]

You'll probably see some gains but not as much as with a custom tune. If you are going to go with a downpipe I'd probably just say screw it and get a tune. Then you can go ahead and get rid of the cat, which is the biggest restriction anyways.

 

[jbailer]

From your comments, I think you already know the answer and it's not what you want to hear. First of all, even a good O/R DP with full bolt ons will only get you maybe 30 more HP so it's not that significant. It doesn't sound like the Ford Performance tune really suits your needs, will not give you what you're looking for. I'd recommend deciding what your real goal for the car is and then start planning your mods accordingly. You could add a catted DP and it might be ok with the tune. The FP tune like just about any canned tune has some slop (elasticity) in it vs pro tunes which are typically pushed closer to the limits based on your specific car. That slop will allow it to adjust to work for many catted DPs. However, the more free flowing the DP is, eliminating restriction which will allow for more power, is more likely you will need a tune for it. So basically the safer the DP with the tune, the less power benefit you're going to see from it.

 

[floydbanks28]

First of all, even a good O/R DP with full bolt ons will only get you maybe 30 more HP so it's not that significant.

Yeah I was mostly hoping to improve the power drop off in the higher RPM range, based on reviews it seems a downpipe is the best way to do this. I was thinking about going with the CPe o/r DP since it has the o2 sensor simulator which will keep me from throwing codes. I'm just unsure how the procal tune will act with this.

Like you said the more restriction you remove, the more you need a tune, but would it still help my current set up to run better? I guess the only way to tell for sure is to do it

 

[jbailer]

Yeah I was mostly hoping to improve the power drop off in the higher RPM range, based on reviews it seems a downpipe is the best way to do this. I was thinking about going with the CPe o/r DP since it has the o2 sensor simulator which will keep me from throwing codes. I'm just unsure how the procal tune will act with this.

Like you said the more restriction you remove, the more you need a tune, but would it still help my current set up to run better? I guess the only way to tell for sure is to do it

I wouldn't do that. Many that got O/R DPs when the platform was new started having smoking issues. I believe damaging turbo seals but not sure. I just remember hearing you really need a tune for an O/R DP. Sure you can go ahead and do it but then you are repairing and enhancing. Just do it the right way from the start. In short, no the FP tune will not be sufficient for an O/R DP, it wasn't setup for it.

 

[Spykexx]

Yeah I was mostly hoping to improve the power drop off in the higher RPM range, based on reviews it seems a downpipe is the best way to do this. I was thinking about going with the CPe o/r DP since it has the o2 sensor simulator which will keep me from throwing codes. I'm just unsure how the procal tune will act with this.

Like you said the more restriction you remove, the more you need a tune, but would it still help my current set up to run better? I guess the only way to tell for sure is to do it

As far as I know there are two main concerns when it comes to High End power drop off. A) Need a larger turbo that fits that bill. The small stocker is meant to provide all of it's grunt low down in the rpm range. A larger turbo would be the biggest help with keeping high power later in the RPM's. A custom tune can help stretch this out, but I've seen the Vargas kits are really improving this area. B) New heads. I hear the FP independent valve heads help with this, but you're talking much larger monies. The stock head/manifold is pretty restrictive.

These are the two main points I have seen the big tuners talk about when it comes to high rpm power. Both of these are going to help with upper RPM ranges much more than a downpipe will

 

[floydbanks28]

I wouldn't do that. Many that got O/R DPs when the platform was new started having smoking issues. I believe damaging turbo seals but not sure. I just remember hearing you really need a tune for an O/R DP. Sure you can go ahead and do it but then you are repairing and enhancing. Just do it the right way from the start. In short, no the FP tune will not be sufficient for an O/R DP, it wasn't setup for it.

I'm still getting used to my turbo engine, thanks for the input

As far as I know there are two main concerns when it comes to High End power drop off. A) Need a larger turbo that fits that bill. The small stocker is meant to provide all of it's grunt low down in the rpm range. A larger turbo would be the biggest help with keeping high power later in the RPM's. A custom tune can help stretch this out, but I've seen the Vargas kits are really improving this area. B) New heads. I hear the FP independent valve heads help with this, but you're talking much larger monies. The stock head/manifold is pretty restrictive.

These are the two main points I have seen the big tuners talk about when it comes to high rpm power. Both of these are going to help with upper RPM ranges much more than a downpipe will

Yeah the turbo kits are like 3 grand plus installation plus the tune and you get like 500hp, Possibly something down the road for sure. A mustang gt is about 12 more grand and pushes 410hp with a decent curve, for about $5500 you can have a ecoboost pushin 500 at the crank, haven't looked into the heads tho, I wonder if you can do both at the same time.

 

[metalhead79]

You need a built motor to handle 500hp for long. That's another $4k-8k. So, say around $10k to make/handle 500hp.

I *think* it costs roughly the same to get a GT to 500hp NA as it does to get an EB to 500hp+ with a built block.

 

[Spykexx]

You need a built motor to handle 500hp for long. That's another $4k-8k. So, say around $10k to make/handle 500hp.

I *think* it costs roughly the same to get a GT to 500hp NA as it does to get an EB to 500hp+ with a built block.

Yea you'll need some serious money to get big numbers like that for any kind of duration safely. There's a few that are doing full sleeve blocks that can handle 600 probably, but they are going to set you back quite a bit. You're then talking GT range price wise. Anything is possible with money. Hell even with full internals I'd probably still keep it around 500.

 

[metalhead79]

I'd like to see 450-500rwhp for my daily driving. Why? I don't know. Because.


Paying her off soon and then the real work will begin...

 

[jbailer]

I'd like to see 450-500rwhp for my daily driving. Why? I don't know. Because.


Paying her off soon and then the real work will begin...

That sounds nice! I had a more conservative goal but gave up on it. My original goal for the car was to get it to 400 whp/ 400 wtq. When I realized that wasn't going to happen without auxiliary fueling, I couldn't just do bolt ons and a tune, I gave up. Now I'll just drive it until I need more.

 

[metalhead79]

I bought the EB over the GT with the intention of going all the way with the motor. I wasn't as informed as I should have been, but I knew enough to have an idea of what I was getting into. I think, lol.
It's going to be interesting to see if 450rwhp is even possible outside of a huge turbo given my altitude. WMI will fix the octane issue, I think. But there's nothing to be done about the thin air.

 

[jbailer]

I bought the EB over the GT with the intention of going all the way with the motor. I wasn't as informed as I should have been, but I knew enough to have an idea of what I was getting into. I think, lol.
It's going to be interesting to see if 450rwhp is even possible outside of a huge turbo given my altitude. WMI will fix the octane issue, I think. But there's nothing to be done about the thin air.

I bought it when it was brand new and we were still waiting for tunes and upgrade parts. I came from the V8 world where you just slapped a big supercharger on it, some big injectors and a bigger MAF and away you go! I doubled the hp of my 06 GT without blinking an eye and running pump gas. I'm new to 4 cylinders AND turbos. Somehow, I thought it was going to be easy. :headbonk:

 

[metalhead79]

Ha, yeah, so did I. I still miss my old GT. These little turbo 4's are super fun but seem sooooo finicky compared to V8's.

 

[ForYourOwnGood]

I knew full well this wasn't going to be a powerful platform. Having come from the MS3 which is the same basic motor and has all of the same problems I knew big numbers were never going to come from this thing reliably without lots of money involved. It has enough power for me right now, although I'm dying for a sunroof.

Sponsored