Juggernaut outed

[Angrey]

I can attest to that. I've received good service from them. A sample of 1, but a sample nonetheless.

I bought a blower system from you, and it was a good experience.

I would still buy from either of you based on the above, but you still all look like whiny women with an ax to grind.

Allow me to retort. I too am a sample of 1.

I purchased a flex tune, E85 Race tune (and was given a complimentary cam file) from them in a package with a JLT and Ngauge when I was Naturally aspirated.

I ran the Flex tune for several months and it worked great. I got around to wanting to run the E85 tune and as soon as I loaded it, the car would intermittently go into limp mode. After an exchange with Lund I was basically told "it's your car not our tune." Rather than ice skate uphill, I simply loaded the flex tune and the issue went away. I'll let you draw your own conclusions as to the likelihood that it was a mechanical issue or a tune issue.

Fast forward a year and I'm planning my boosted build. I planned (and ultimately DID) put together a very one off, custom, in tank brushless pump system. Admittedly, it was very groundbreaking and pioneered stuff.

After emailing (because Lund won't speak to you over the phone, which is incredibly frustrating when trying to discuss ANYTHING complicated) Lund several times, and getting asked the SAME GODDAMNED QUESTIONS MULTIPLE TIMES, I was told "we won't tune it unless you run the fuel system of our choosing."

Firstly, the problem I have with no voice contact is you can't CLAIM to be a custom tuner who operates through a ticket system. It works for many people but ultimately, it's crazy inefficient to try to have a complicated exchange through email.

Secondly, as a systems/process guy, I could piece together what was happening with the "ticket" system where a different tuner (or even the same tuner) would pull up my request/entry and then instead of READING through the previous history, they would ask me the SAME questions again. This is what happens when you treat PEOPLE like a ticket instead of a client. So I got to type and reply several times "YES, FOR THE FOURTH TIME, IT WILL BE A FULLY BUILT MOTOR."

I had every intention of using Lund for my blown setup tuning. But between them basically trying to dictate to me what I have to run on my car and the brain damage with trying to do ANYTHING other than a cookie cutter/everyone does the same thing setup, I went with a local tuner.

By the way, my fuel system works great and has currently tested up to 1100rwhp.

Lund is just fine IF, IF, IF, IF you don't have ANY problems or challenges. If you have ANY issues, trying to resolve it with them can be PAINFUL. As Terry pointed out above, he's giving them MILLIONS in business and they played the "it's your car, not our tune." Imagine what life is like for those customers who aren't race teams or recognizable names in the industry.

Lund successfully tunes a shit ton of cars. But if you want to do ANYTHING that's outside of what they dictate, OR if you have ANY issues, the customer service is woeful.

Of course, they'll pull the SAME bunk argument that MMR pulls when someone criticizes them. "We've built 6 second cars, we know what we're doing, you just STFU and know your place." The problem is, us amateur level retail customers do NOT receive the same amount of attention and effort that someone receives who has a 6 second sponsored car/name in the industry.

If I was doing it all over again, i'd probably still use Lund if I was N/A or if I had a very common blown setup. I would NOT use them if you want any sort of custom experience. And I'd probably go into it knowing that if there IS a problem with their tune, I'm going to spend time and money chasing ghost mechanical problems because they're too lazy or egocentric to admit their tunes aren't perfect or infallible.

In summary, with Lund you're good to go. Until you're not. If you're unlucky to be one of the latter group. Best of luck to you. Choose accordingly.

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[Angrey]

we prefer 5/50 on boosted setups

You missed my attempt at humor Terry. We could read thousands of pages of debates about motor oil ranging from weight/blend to brand.

 

[beefcake]

You missed my attempt at humor Terry. We could read thousands of pages of debates about motor oil ranging from weight/blend to brand.

I did, that was my attempt as well lol

 

[fiveoboy01]

LOL and some clown shoe wearing jack wagon had the nerve to call me out about my opinion of Flores. Don’t take it from me, take it from the horse’s mouth. Thanks Terry for dropping some truth bombs on the Lund nut swingers.

Your opinion isn’t based on any actual experience, therefore it’s irrelevant. You’re simply parroting what you’ve heard. And all you have in rebuttal is insults which reveal your mental acuity. Clown indeed.

 

[fiveoboy01]

Allow me to retort. I too am a sample of 1.

I purchased a flex tune, E85 Race tune (and was given a complimentary cam file) from them in a package with a JLT and Ngauge when I was Naturally aspirated.

I ran the Flex tune for several months and it worked great. I got around to wanting to run the E85 tune and as soon as I loaded it, the car would intermittently go into limp mode. After an exchange with Lund I was basically told "it's your car not our tune." Rather than ice skate uphill, I simply loaded the flex tune and the issue went away. I'll let you draw your own conclusions as to the likelihood that it was a mechanical issue or a tune issue.

Fast forward a year and I'm planning my boosted build. I planned (and ultimately DID) put together a very one off, custom, in tank brushless pump system. Admittedly, it was very groundbreaking and pioneered stuff.

After emailing (because Lund won't speak to you over the phone, which is incredibly frustrating when trying to discuss ANYTHING complicated) Lund several times, and getting asked the SAME GODDAMNED QUESTIONS MULTIPLE TIMES, I was told "we won't tune it unless you run the fuel system of our choosing."

Firstly, the problem I have with no voice contact is you can't CLAIM to be a custom tuner who operates through a ticket system. It works for many people but ultimately, it's crazy inefficient to try to have a complicated exchange through email.

Secondly, as a systems/process guy, I could piece together what was happening with the "ticket" system where a different tuner (or even the same tuner) would pull up my request/entry and then instead of READING through the previous history, they would ask me the SAME questions again. This is what happens when you treat PEOPLE like a ticket instead of a client. So I got to type and reply several times "YES, FOR THE FOURTH TIME, IT WILL BE A FULLY BUILT MOTOR."

I had every intention of using Lund for my blown setup tuning. But between them basically trying to dictate to me what I have to run on my car and the brain damage with trying to do ANYTHING other than a cookie cutter/everyone does the same thing setup, I went with a local tuner.

By the way, my fuel system works great and has currently tested up to 1100rwhp.

Lund is just fine IF, IF, IF, IF you don't have ANY problems or challenges. If you have ANY issues, trying to resolve it with them can be PAINFUL. As Terry pointed out above, he's giving them MILLIONS in business and they played the "it's your car, not our tune." Imagine what life is like for those customers who aren't race teams or recognizable names in the industry.

Lund successfully tunes a shit ton of cars. But if you want to do ANYTHING that's outside of what they dictate, OR if you have ANY issues, the customer service is woeful.

Of course, they'll pull the SAME bunk argument that MMR pulls when someone criticizes them. "We've built 6 second cars, we know what we're doing, you just STFU and know your place." The problem is, us amateur level retail customers do NOT receive the same amount of attention and effort that someone receives who has a 6 second sponsored car/name in the industry.

If I was doing it all over again, i'd probably still use Lund if I was N/A or if I had a very common blown setup. I would NOT use them if you want any sort of custom experience. And I'd probably go into it knowing that if there IS a problem with their tune, I'm going to spend time and money chasing ghost mechanical problems because they're too lazy or egocentric to admit their tunes aren't perfect or infallible.

In summary, with Lund you're good to go. Until you're not. If you're unlucky to be one of the latter group. Best of luck to you. Choose accordingly.

That’s a fair enough rebuttal and reasonably written.

I suppose everyone has a client out there with a bad experience. Of course yours is one side of it… Can’t please everyone, all the time. Not excusing their actions or writing off your bad experience, but things happen is what I’m trying to say. You’re unhappy and it’s perfectly reasonable and expected that you’d leave and not have much good to say. My post was more of an answer to Terry asking how they treat the little guy, as I am as “little guy” as they come

The one thing I will argue against is the “email only” correspondence. That is a tactic I use exclusively with my business as it leaves a tangible paper trail in case of a “he said, she said” situation. I do however, do phone calls with well established clients. But the email thing works quite well IMO. It’s not for everyone.

 

[geep81]

Other tuners are doing a better job than you Lund, maybe pick your game up instead of making YouTube videos trashing your competition.

I have 0 respect for a company throwing a hissy fit like this. It's always a bad look and makes me suspect things are not going well behind the scenes at Lund.

 

[Angrey]

That’s a fair enough rebuttal and reasonably written.

I suppose everyone has a client out there with a bad experience. Of course yours is one side of it… Can’t please everyone, all the time. Not excusing their actions or writing off your bad experience, but things happen is what I’m trying to say. You’re unhappy and it’s perfectly reasonable and expected that you’d leave and not have much good to say. My post was more of an answer to Terry asking how they treat the little guy, as I am as “little guy” as they come

The one thing I will argue against is the “email only” correspondence. That is a tactic I use exclusively with my business as it leaves a tangible paper trail in case of a “he said, she said” situation. I do however, do phone calls with well established clients. But the email thing works quite well IMO. It’s not for everyone.

I'm all about documenting to manage expectations. But that's where a follow up "per our conversation" email comes in. There are simply some things that are way too extensive or complicated to try to exchange through email. I understand Lund's dilemma here and I'm sure if they put their number out there they were getting swamped with phone calls. But again, it just comes down to a custom experience vs a number.

If you have something that's not complex or new and it's been done a hundred times before, email only works. But when trying to discuss something new or different, OR trying to resolve a problem, it just falls short.

Again, I'm not trashing Lund saying no one should use them. They have great tunes and it works for a shit ton of people. I'm saying if you're outside of the cookie cutter tune world, they're probably not the best choice. And if you happen to be one of the unlucky few who do have issues, just be prepared for their almost rehearsed response "mechanical." Their are MANY other testimonials of Lund customers chasing fictional mechanical issues for weeks (and spending money replacing parts). One of the more famous is the cross fire some get into over the PBH 4R200. The trans component vendor says it's tune. The tuner says it's trans. The poor customer is caught in between not knowing who to believe.

Lund works great. Until they don't. Then it's about as pleasurable as trying to file an insurance claim and get past the initial rejection.

 

[cidthekid]

This has been entertaining to read. Dont know Alex's work but he is a complete jackass on his channel and its just off-putting.

All I know if that Beefcake got me a killer on a whipple two months ago and a nice discount of suspension parts two months before that. I always go to them to price match and have never failed. Customer only cares about good service, good prices, and good products. Everything else is just noise.

 

[MR2Aaron]

Lol. It matters if you do the work or someone else does it and you pass it off as your own...

Learn that part.

So, question from a software developer in a different field.

Are these "tunes" that everyone seems to be (understandably) quite possessive of actually software in a programming sense, where you delete the original Ford engine program, and totally write your own, with its own unique implementation of the fuel injection/spark advance/cam timing /emissions control algorithms, plus whatever extra behaviors you want to add, or are they just editing the original lookup tables to adjust for differences created by aftermarket exhaust/intake/headers/cams, et cetera, but leaving the executable code the same?

I can imagine this might matter in the sense that, if everyone is starting from the same original lookup tables, and those lookup tables are the only part of the software they can change, then most likely, everyone's results are going to be similar, regardless of whether they peeked at someone else's work or not.

 

[geep81]

Are these "tunes" that everyone seems to be (understandably) quite possessive of actually software in a programming sense, where you delete the original Ford engine program

Everyone is just tweaking and modifying the Ford parameters/code.

 

[K4fxd]

just editing the original lookup tables to adjust for differences created by aftermarket exhaust/intake/headers/cams, et cetera, but leaving the executable code the same?

This is how 99% do it. There are a few like Matt who Terry referenced, who can and do coding.

 

[bankyf]

Wow the Lund hate is real sorry guys, that gentleman’s “tools” belong to Lund. Ya’ll can scream and should all you want but at the end of the day he used software that wasn’t his to modify a file that he didn’t develop into lunds customer. I love how the excuse is the customer is a “gotta have it now” type. I know some of Ya’ll aren’t tuned by Lund therefore waiting for revisions might be an issue. But If this person wrote to Lund and said he/she needed some changes, he/she Would have a reply typically within an hour or 2.

Why do you believe the "tools" belong to Lund? HPtuners software is available to anyone as a free download.

 

[fiveoboy01]

I'm all about documenting to manage expectations. But that's where a follow up "per our conversation" email comes in. There are simply some things that are way too extensive or complicated to try to exchange through email. I understand Lund's dilemma here and I'm sure if they put their number out there they were getting swamped with phone calls. But again, it just comes down to a custom experience vs a number.

If you have something that's not complex or new and it's been done a hundred times before, email only works. But when trying to discuss something new or different, OR trying to resolve a problem, it just falls short.

Again, I'm not trashing Lund saying no one should use them. They have great tunes and it works for a shit ton of people. I'm saying if you're outside of the cookie cutter tune world, they're probably not the best choice. And if you happen to be one of the unlucky few who do have issues, just be prepared for their almost rehearsed response "mechanical." Their are MANY other testimonials of Lund customers chasing fictional mechanical issues for weeks (and spending money replacing parts). One of the more famous is the cross fire some get into over the PBH 4R200. The trans component vendor says it's tune. The tuner says it's trans. The poor customer is caught in between not knowing who to believe.

Lund works great. Until they don't. Then it's about as pleasurable as trying to file an insurance claim and get past the initial rejection.

Undersood. I think you’re being reasonable based on your own experience. And to be fair, maybe your combo is just something they couldn’t figure out, in that case it would be best to say “I just don’t know” instead of blaming it on the car. Or, maybe it was the car. Who knows. You vs. them, etc ad nauseam, a story that will continue till the end of time in the tuning world. I respect that you can articulate your issue without trashing them, others might take note.

It’s the “Lund sucks but I don’t have any actual experience” talkers I have the most issue with. They contribute to the issue and the internet exacerbates the problem. People read that kind of BS and draw unfair conclusions from it. Based on your story, I would have to do some thinking about who I’d use with a weird or true custom setup.

 

[SolarFlare]

Why do you believe the "tools" belong to Lund? HPtuners software is available to anyone as a free download.

Lund racing nguage isnt HP tuners software....its lund racings. Thats why its called "lund racing Nguage"

 

[bankyf]

This is how 99% do it. There are a few like Matt who Terry referenced, who can and do coding.

Meh, I don't believe he is doing "coding". I think he is just using a different software package. Still a nice accomplishment, but not really coding.

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