Why Spend Money On Return Fuel System

[bluebeastsrt]

Sorry you did mention that. Ok one last question? What's the DA you race at? (Your set up would be a low 10 second car where I race.) A 1.60 sixty isnt bad. You could probably get a 10th or two better with the wipple. The way your car sits. I run a 4c converter. And get 1.4-1.5 sixties on a basically stock suspension. But I have a centri. Trying to cut 8/10ths of a second is probably going to require more power.

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[ugstang17]

Weld Racing Wheels,17x10 rear 17x5 front
Stock Springs

BMR drag springs will really help...or the minimun drop general purpose spring they offer if you don't want to drop the traditional 1.5" that BMR offers. An adjustable front strut will also allow better weight transfer for a better bite........all of this assuming you may be spinning a bit while chasing that sub 1.6 60. But the bigger help IMHO and from what I have learned will be a stall converter as I mentioned. I see the wheel setup and aside from going to an all out slick you're ahead of the game there.

Give Circle D a ring and tell them your setup. They can make a reccommendation.I am guessing that they would suggest a 258mm 2C or possibly a 3C though it may be too lose for a 650RWHP or higher setup.

And as bluebeast mentions your DA and the altitude you are racing at will also have a factor in your ET. If you are running at 3000 ft in a DA of 4500 then 10.80 is a pretty good time. at sea level in 1200 feet of air you would be blowing through the traps at least at 10.5X (guestimate) assuming you were running that 10.80 at high altitude and in poor air.

 

[Bald Menace]

Why spend money for return fuel system to run E85 when you can buy race gas?
What is the advantage?
You can buy a lot of race gas for $2000+

David.
E85 is non existent in our area. so E85 not really an option.

 

[DavidHuff]

Just returned from Woodburn Raceway in Woodburn,Oregon and did manage 1.59 sixty foot times.Ran two 10.80ET at 132MPH

 

[DavidHuff]

David.
E85 is non existent in our area. so E85 not really an option.

Thanks,do you test at Woodburn Raceway?

 

[DavidHuff]

Sorry you did mention that. Ok one last question? What's the DA you race at? (Your set up would be a low 10 second car where I race.) A 1.60 sixty isnt bad. You could probably get a 10th or two better with the wipple. The way your car sits. I run a 4c converter. And get 1.4-1.5 sixties on a basically stock suspension. But I have a centri. Trying to cut 8/10ths of a second is probably going to require more power.

Thanks for the great information.
I think Woodburn Raceway Elevation is 154 feet above sea level

 

[ugstang17]

For those wanting to know Woodburn is virtually at sealevel - altitude 177ft. Da there this evening according to the DA website is 1641 - 662 between 5pm and 11pm tonight. Uncorrectected Hg is 29.9". Air temps 70-73F and Humidity 40-50%. Pretty decent air given this time of year at my local track if I could get that lucky. DA yesterday was 2000-1000 See link and enter date to see history

https://airdensityonline.com/track-history/Woodburn_Dragstrip/2019-08-25/

You need to revisit your tune in my humble opinion. Guessing that you are either pulling timing somewhere for some unknown reason or the tune is just soft. That car with 630 RWHP (and it certainly is making more I would assume on a good tune by Lund that has been dialed in) should easily run 10.6x @ 13x if not better.

If you are blowing the tires off to get that 1.6 then you need to retune your suspension or make corrections as needed to improve that. A 1.5 under the same conditions will yield you a 10.70-10.6x.

My 2.3L TVS at 10.5-11 psi on 93 runs 18degrees WOT with no knock and without any whoopy water additives. Just pure SU2000 Shell. Your setup may be in the same general area. What you should not be seeing is the car pulling timing on the big end due to knock or high IAT temps. that will kill your ET's. So datalog and put some effort into learning how to read them or at least send them back to your tuner and have them review them so you know where to go next.

 

[Bald Menace]

Thanks,do you test at Woodburn Raceway?

thats where I go but I haven't been there in a while.

 

[DavidHuff]

For those wanting to know Woodburn is virtually at sealevel - altitude 177ft. Da there this evening according to the DA website is 1641 - 662 between 5pm and 11pm tonight. Uncorrectected Hg is 29.9". Air temps 70-73F and Humidity 40-50%. Pretty decent air given this time of year at my local track if I could get that lucky. DA yesterday was 2000-1000 See link and enter date to see history

https://airdensityonline.com/track-history/Woodburn_Dragstrip/2019-08-25/

You need to revisit your tune in my humble opinion. Guessing that you are either pulling timing somewhere for some unknown reason or the tune is just soft. That car with 630 RWHP (and it certainly is making more I would assume on a good tune by Lund that has been dialed in) should easily run 10.6x @ 13x if not better.

If you are blowing the tires off to get that 1.6 then you need to retune your suspension or make corrections as needed to improve that. A 1.5 under the same conditions will yield you a 10.70-10.6x.

My 2.3L TVS at 10.5-11 psi on 93 runs 18degrees WOT with no knock and without any whoopy water additives. Just pure SU2000 Shell. Your setup may be in the same general area. What you should not be seeing is the car pulling timing on the big end due to knock or high IAT temps. that will kill your ET's. So datalog and put some effort into learning how to read them or at least send them back to your tuner and have them review them so you know where to go next.

I have no control of my tune because it is a Whipple can 91 octane tune that comes with the Whipple Stage 2 Kit and I am sure it is a soft tune, but I do run 92 octane fuel with Boostane for a little protection .I guess a after market tune and race gas is the way to go?
Thanks for the information!

 

[ugstang17]

I have no control of my tune because it is a Whipple can 91 octane tune that comes with the Whipple Stage 2 Kit and I am sure it is a soft tune, but I do run 92 octane fuel with Boostane for a little protection .I guess a after market tune and race gas is the way to go?
Thanks for the information!

No prob. Datalogging will tell you what you have going on and where the timing is at. It will also help determine what kind of nanny strategy is active as well. Many of the turn key packages have very conservative tunes. Whipple from what I understand is not as weak as a Roush tune, but there is likely a lot more to be had from a tune by Lund, VMP, AED, or PBD. You could always datalog and send to one of the four and get their feedback. Just keep in mind that with a remote tune you have to datalog and work with the tuner to get it dialed in. They aren't one tune fits all. They may require you to make some upgrades such as FI's, colder plugs, and/or the tune will need you to run a booster additive (because you don't have 93 in your area), so be prepared for that.

Also inspect for oil build up in the intercooler and/or plenum areas as well if you aren't running a catch can. And if you aren't running a catch can on the passenger side at mininum you should invest in one. Oil migration under boost into the intake area and head unit can cause detonation which will be detected by the knock sensors and cause timing to be pulled. Here again a datalog of your pass would reveal a lot. Best of luck.

 

[bluebeastsrt]

I guess a after market tune and race gas is the way to go?

The canned tune stinks. Give Lund a call. And watch that ET drop.

 

[DavidHuff]

No prob. Datalogging will tell you what you have going on and where the timing is at. It will also help determine what kind of nanny strategy is active as well. Many of the turn key packages have very conservative tunes. Whipple from what I understand is not as weak as a Roush tune, but there is likely a lot more to be had from a tune by Lund, VMP, AED, or PBD. You could always datalog and send to one of the four and get their feedback. Just keep in mind that with a remote tune you have to datalog and work with the tuner to get it dialed in. They aren't one tune fits all. They may require you to make some upgrades such as FI's, colder plugs, and/or the tune will need you to run a booster additive (because you don't have 93 in your area), so be prepared for that.

Also inspect for oil build up in the intercooler and/or plenum areas as well if you aren't running a catch can. And if you aren't running a catch can on the passenger side at mininum you should invest in one. Oil migration under boost into the intake area and head unit can cause detonation which will be detected by the knock sensors and cause timing to be pulled. Here again a datalog of your pass would reveal a lot. Best of luck.

I guess to Datalog I would need to buy a used or new NGauge and I did install a oil catch can on the passenger side when I installed the Whipple Kit.
Thanks

 

[Stephen@lethal]

Why spend money for return fuel system to run E85 when you can buy race gas?
What is the advantage?
You can buy a lot of race gas for $2000+

Its not just about the Octane of the fuel, a fuel kit is used to provide a larger quantity of fuel as well with larger pumps, larger fuel lines and rails. Race gas is really expensive as well and E85 has been proven to provide great detonation protection. Hit me up at Lethalperformance.com if you are interested in seeing what we can do for you.

 

[ugstang17]

I guess to Datalog I would need to buy a used or new NGauge and I did install a oil catch can on the passenger side when I installed the Whipple Kit.
Thanks

The package came without a tuner/flash device? I thought only Roush was that obtuse. If you plan on going with an aftermarket tune keep in mind that LUND's Ngauge is proprietary to their tune only. You cannot use an Ngauge other than theirs to load their tunes. Other tuners have their preference as well so choose first and then obtain the device. If the Whipple came wit ha flash device such as an SCT or HPtuner device it can be used to datalog.

 

[ramirj2]

Its not just about the Octane of the fuel, a fuel kit is used to provide a larger quantity of fuel as well with larger pumps, larger fuel lines and rails. Race gas is really expensive as well and E85 has been proven to provide great detonation protection. Hit me up at Lethalperformance.com if you are interested in seeing what we can do for you.

I have been debating the same for some time now.

Since there is no pump E85 here in Puerto Rico, I either run race gas or Race E85, yet everybody here is going for the E.

I got 22 degrees of timing from MS109 and cost me $90 (5 gallons)
C85 would cost me $70 (5 gallons ) so roughly the same as I would use more C85

So, what other benefits can I get from going for a fuel system for E85?
Would it make more power? or provide better safety margins?

C85 is a lot more oxygenated and has a cooling effect due to the volume, but I have 0 experience with this.

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