Why is oil level such a PITA to determine?

[drought_buster]

In a previous life, I was a design/release engineer for an automotive company. I released oil filters/oil level indicators / indicator tubes / among other components.
When I had to calibrate the oil level in an engine. I would have the engine factory weight the oil at a specific gravity to get an accurate volume that is poured into the engine. I would idle that engine in a dyno cell until the oil temp reached 200F, then I shut it down and start the stop watch for 5 minutes. While the timer is running, I move the engine into the vehicle attitude. Sometimes the engine is tilted front to back and/or side to side within the engine bay. After 5 minutes, the measurement is taken and this sets the fill line on the oil level indicator. Then I am given the acceptable amount of oil consumption between an oil change interval. Drain that amount of oil and this sets the low indicator mark.

Sponsored

 

[C-WOODS-70]

But only as long as the dipstick works like it's supposed to!

Who or what are you referring to with this sentence.

 

[GTthree50]

In a previous life, I was a design/release engineer for an automotive company. I released oil filters/oil level indicators / indicator tubes / among other components.
When I had to calibrate the oil level in an engine. I would have the engine factory weight the oil at a specific gravity to get an accurate volume that is poured into the engine. I would idle that engine in a dyno cell until the oil temp reached 200F, then I shut it down and start the stop watch for 5 minutes. While the timer is running, I move the engine into the vehicle attitude. Sometimes the engine is tilted front to back and/or side to side within the engine bay. After 5 minutes, the measurement is taken and this sets the fill line on the oil level indicator. Then I am given the acceptable amount of oil consumption between an oil change interval. Drain that amount of oil and this sets the low indicator mark.

Considering the overall completeness of sensors throughout the car I so very much would have liked it if Ford had included oil quantity indication. Does not make the dipstick irrelevant but is very useful once the relationship between what the gauge readings and actual dip reading.

 

[Rapid Red]

 

[Tomster]

Checking it when it's still warm is a PITA. That's why I check it cold.

 

[galaxy]

This. Thread. And. Topic. Makes. My. Head. Hurt. I attempted to stay away, but alas, I've had a few beers and cannot. I can't belive this is a topic...again! I've said this before in the same threads...you realise when you sit here and debate the oil quantity between the hash marks, your're debating ounces of oil...single digit ounces...in a two and a half f&$#ing gallon fluid system?!?!?! You're fine. Sorry your dipstick is soooo daggum difficult to get out. OMG. The struggle is real, right?!??!

 

[Tomster]

This. Thread. And. Topic. Makes. My. Head. Hurt. I attempted to stay away, but alas, I've had a few beers and cannot. I can't belive this is a topic...again! I've said this before in the same threads...you realise when you sit here and debate the oil quantity between the hash marks, your're debating ounces of oil...single digit ounces...in a two and a half f&$#ing gallon fluid system?!?!?! You're fine. Sorry your dipstick is soooo daggum difficult to get out. OMG. The struggle is real, right?!??!

Don't hold back! Let it out man.....

 

[CANTWN4LSN]

OP's main complaint is the smear and I agree it's a PITA. What works for me is to remove the dipstick, wipe it clean, then leave it out and wait 5-10 minutes for the oil in the tube to drain back into the engine. Then reinsert the dipstick and remove to check level. Most of the time this resolves the smear issue.

 

[C-WOODS-70]

This thread makes me realize that the dipstick got its name from the person using it, not vice versa.

 

[Rapid Red]

Checking it when it's still warm is a PITA. That's why I check it cold.

Frankly, I do the same, still warm when the oil is fresh yeah PIA.

Color changing as it ages helps, and to me is a better indicator of its life anyway.

 

[galaxy]

Color changing as it ages helps, and to me is a better indicator of its life anyway.

100% incorrect. Color/visual inspection of the oil tells you nothing. Go change the oil in a diesel, drive 100 miles, and then look at the oil.

 

[Rapid Red]

100% incorrect. Color/visual inspection of the oil tells you nothing. Go change the oil in a diesel, drive 100 miles, and then look at the oil.

Yeah well, friend tell ya what, you go drive 100 miles, in a diesel, and look at the oil.

To dumb it down all I'm saying is clear fresh oil is harder to read on the DS...and the reason for the holes.

As it ages too black it is easier to see, so simple even a Karren could understand.

"Color/visual inspection of the oil tells you nothing" NEWS FLASH correct.

 

[DougS550]

Still getting acquainted with the new mistress and, for the life of me, I've never encountered such a mystery when it comes to determining where the oil level is on the dipstick.

I have read a bunch here about waiting 15 min after shutdown on a warmed up engine, that the bottom of the dipstick is 8.5 qts, remove dipstick from aft of strut tower brace, that there is about a 5% expansion from cold to warm and not all dipsticks are calibrated the same (mark what 10 qts looks like at next oil change and that is the new 'full' mark). All that said, still a few questions:

1. After cleaning and reinserting the dipstick (letting it rest for 5 sec) then removing, one side will have a clean horizontal mark while the other side is totally smeared. Does anybody rotate the dipstick 180 and reinsert to try and get an 'equal read' on both sides?

2. Can anybody answer at what point the engine gets starved? i.e. if the dipstick is dry, so are the rod bearings....

3. Surmising that the hash marked area on the dipstick is about a quart's worth of volume. Sound about right? And if the 5% expansion is accurate, then a warm engine showing at mid hashmark should be just below the hashmarks when cold...how many of y'all have a notion for what a cold engine would show vice a warmed engine?

I'll add my $.02 on just why in the hell Ford didn't come up with an electronic oil level display but I'd still take a dipstick over an electronic readout any day. But only as long as the dipstick works like it's supposed to!

And I've also come to the conclusion that these engines are plain old oil eaters. Like my wife's 2018 Audi SQ5 that consumes a quart every 4000 miles and has done so since new (currently at 50k). Though for the smiles per mile ratio, I'd gladly keep her fed with 5W-50 in exchange for that glorious sound of +500 ponies ready to rumble at a moment's notice (as long as she's showing 190F).

Appreciate some thoughts here.

~John

I check my engine oil when cold or after engine shut down a few minutes later.

 

[TeamGomez]

Who or what are you referring to with this sentence.

Generally speaking, that when you pull it out, it doesn't take a contorted double-jointed appendage to access it and that it will replicate indications on repeated efforts.

This thread makes me realize that the dipstick got its name from the person using it, not vice versa.

'You're killing me, Smalls'...while I may not have achieved Master Mech status in all 9 ASE skill categories, my 59 years on the planet rebuilding engines, 2 stroke race motors, setting up race cars, driving other people's race cars and somehow surviving 378 arrested landings on a 'portable runway', I would consider my dipstick qualifications to definitely be above the 'add oil' hole although likely most comparable to that of Helen Keller (the holes are for braille after all, aren't they?) after a night of whiskey and cigars...

New idea for '24- maybe the admins could add a new 'dipstick rating' to our profiles .

 

[TeamGomez]

It's already taken into account for the Northern Hemisphere. For the Southern Hemisphere, Ford moves the lower hole up to where the upper hole is, and then moves the upper hole goes down to where the bottom hole used to be. Because you're upside down in the Southern Hemisphere, swapping the two holes up and down ensures that the dipstick measure is still reliable.

Dammit. Just when I thought I had it all figured out. But how does the oil stay in when the folks down under are upside down? Ahhhh now I follow. Just hold the dipstick upside down and look at it in a mirror.

Sponsored