Suggested mods... lets hear it...

[pmillerusa]

Looking for some guidance on track improvements (safety/reliability/performance, in that order) for my daily driven 2016 Whippled GT. I take Angeles Crest to work almost daily, so any mods below would be valuable off the track as well.

I daily the car about 120 miles round trip and have 105k on it now. I've done a few autocross and smaller course events, and will be taking the car to Big Willow on 4/15. I'd like to have a good/safe day with solid, reliable performance, knowing I won’t be the quickest car on the track (not trying to be). I plan more track events, but likely 3-5 a year, some smaller, some like this at Willow.

I want to share my current mods, and then ask suggestions on where I should invest before the event on 4/15.

Current setup (track relevant mods):

• Suspension - Ford Track and Handling Pack
• Brakes - Brembo PP calipers up front, Baer Eradispeed rotors on all 4 corners, Hawk PC (yellow) pads.
• Seats - Braum Komodo Sport Seats, Planted brackets/rails
• Safety - Braum 4pt harness (no submarine belt) and harness-bar
• Wheels - 19x10 19x11 Forged Project6gr 10 spoke
• Tires - Nitto NT01 285/35-19 325/30-19
• Drivetrain - Whipple Stage 2, etc etc... about 680 rwhp, Whipple intercooler, added dual fans
• Exhaust - Kooks headers, Borla s-type quad tip
• Other - Cowl/heat extractor hood

Observations, possible mods-

• Safety - In reading, seems there is a lot of to be said to consider a roll bar / cage since I have a harness/harness-bar
• Cooling - Being Supercharged, adding an oil cooler and/or an upgraded radiator.
• Other cooling - Rear differential cooler
• Chassis/suspension - Rear bushings/stiffness (BMR goodies, stop the hop etc)

Okay, so using the above as a starter, where would you suggest investing prior to 4/15…?

Thanks,

Paul
@_famlymn

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[johnson.ba]

I wouldn't start throwing money at problems that you don't have yet. I'd maybe consider a dedicated oil cooler or larger radiator. I'd recommend flushing brake fluid with a motul/castrol. Enjoy your track day and after, decide what weak points your car has and address them then.

 

[pmillerusa]

I wouldn't start throwing money at problems that you don't have yet. I'd maybe consider a dedicated oil cooler or larger radiator. I'd recommend flushing brake fluid with a motul/castrol. Enjoy your track day and after, decide what weak points your car has and address them then.

Understood and thanks for that...

I am just as interested (more so actually) in reliability and safety as any additional "performance" mods specifically. I certainly know the car at this point is much more capable than the driver. What I didn't want is day being cut short by over-temps, or any kind of safety violations/concerns.

 

[Yareen1]

are you a manual? if so a mgw or barton shifter might be a really solid mod to do.

 

[pmillerusa]

are you a manual? if so a mgw or barton shifter might be a really solid mod to do.

Thanks... yes, I forgot to mention I have the MGW RaceSpec

 

[ddozier]

Some Thoughts....

TIRES - Based on the tire sizes alone you will have a very understeering front end and will be hard pressed to find a balance as the speeds increase. You simply do not have enough front tire to overcome the grip potential of the rear tire size. For my track tire setup I would look at a 305 square setup as it adds a lot to the feel of the car both at turn in and mid corner. NT-01 like a lot of camber so as your corner speeds increase keep an eye on tire temps and the outer edges rolling on the tire, you can ruin a set of NT-01 quite quickly if the camber is more street friendly than track friendly.

ENGINE COOLING - This will be the major issue as you use more of the cars potential, with the added TQ from the Whipple you can short shift and take advantage of the gear to keep revs down, if you plan on road course duty with the Whipple I would avoid anything above 6k RPM to try and control heat. The N/A motors with no mods can get quite warm if you are tuned and use the 7k rpm range a lot. If you have not already, swap in the Reische Performance 170* thermostat and that will buy you some track time but even then I would limit myself to 20 min or less sessions with as long of a cool down lap as you can. I would consider changing the oil pan to the new FP Road Race pan from the FP350S it is baffled and holds 12 or 13 qts of oil and that will also help with oil temps. If you want to use the RPMs into the 7K+ range and you keep the motor on point throughout the session you will exceed then ability of the stock oil cooler and oil temps will easily be above 260* not where you want to be and have a reliable engine. Oil temp is the key to keeping the valve train and bearings alive in the Coyote. Another quick note about heat and headers, they are insanely close to the starter, close enough that after a 20 min high RPM session the headers will be glowing red hot and if you come back to the pits and shut off the motor right away you will cook the life out of your starter. Best practices are to cool the car down on track as best you can, come to the pits, open the hood and idle until the fans stop or engine CHT is below 200*. Also its not a bad idea to add a starter heat shield to reflect as much heat away from the starter. Another thing to look at closely is how the Water to Air heat exchanger was installed from the Whipple kit, a lot of installers hack up the plastic cooling shrouds from the bumper to the radiator in order to install the heat exchanger and lines. This will allow air to bypass the radiator and limit the ability for the radiator to do its job. Not a bad idea to look at hood vents as well to help get the heat out. The Cowl hood will not help you at speed and may actually make under hood venting worse, as speeds increase so does a high pressure zone at the base of the windshield, it can actually force air back under the hood instead of drawing it away from the engine bay. This can increase the under hood pressure enough to stall the air going through the radiator and reduce cooling capacity. Most effective heat extractor hoods vent the area of the hood much closer to the front bumper as the air is moving much faster over these vents and it will draw air out from under the hood as the air passes over the vents. Drawing air out of the engine bay will reduce the pressure under the hood and allow the air to move through the radiator more efficiently.

DIFF COOLING - Upgrade the diff fluid to a heavier weight full synthetic fluid, add a heat shield to the exhaust between the diff housing and the exhaust. Having a reflective heat shield and an air gap will be better than wrapping the exhaust pipes. See where that gets you, but if you use all of that Whipple on long high speed tracks the diff will need a dedicated cooler added.

SAFETY - Do not put a full cage in the car and drive it on the street unless you plan on wearing the harnesses and a helmet every time you drive the car. Partial cages and bolt in cages are there to make you feel warm and fuzzy, they do little to effect the roll over strength of the car from the B pillar forward and that is where your head is. A fire system or fire extinguisher is always a good idea. Fuel pump cut off switch within reach of the driver is not a bad idea either. Also all the new AN fuel lines that came with your Whipple kit should be inspected before each event and replaced every 3-5 years. I know it seems excessive but so is a fire under the hood.

BRAKES - The PP front brakes are fantastic and hold up quite well with the addition of some cooling ducts and backing plates, a quality pad will be needed for road course use. You could be carrying a lot of speed at the ends of the straights that will need to be scrubbed off and that means lots of rotor and pad heat to get rid of.

Dave

 

[5.4dreams]

Like the above did, it's your first track day don't spend money not needed yet. Good set of track pads and motul 600 or 660 or Castrol srf brake fluid. Imani and dj both have your same whipple setup and track often

 

[pmillerusa]

Some Thoughts....

TIRES - Based on the tire sizes alone you will have a very understeering front end and will be hard pressed to find a balance as the speeds increase. You simply do not have enough front tire to overcome the grip potential of the rear tire size. For my track tire setup I would look at a 305 square setup as it adds a lot to the feel of the car both at turn in and mid corner. NT-01 like a lot of camber so as your corner speeds increase keep an eye on tire temps and the outer edges rolling on the tire, you can ruin a set of NT-01 quite quickly if the camber is more street friendly than track friendly.

ENGINE COOLING - This will be the major issue as you use more of the cars potential, with the added TQ from the Whipple you can short shift and take advantage of the gear to keep revs down, if you plan on road course duty with the Whipple I would avoid anything above 6k RPM to try and control heat. The N/A motors with no mods can get quite warm if you are tuned and use the 7k rpm range a lot. If you have not already, swap in the Reische Performance 170* thermostat and that will buy you some track time but even then I would limit myself to 20 min or less sessions with as long of a cool down lap as you can. I would consider changing the oil pan to the new FP Road Race pan from the FP350S it is baffled and holds 12 or 13 qts of oil and that will also help with oil temps. If you want to use the RPMs into the 7K+ range and you keep the motor on point throughout the session you will exceed then ability of the stock oil cooler and oil temps will easily be above 260* not where you want to be and have a reliable engine. Oil temp is the key to keeping the valve train and bearings alive in the Coyote. Another quick note about heat and headers, they are insanely close to the starter, close enough that after a 20 min high RPM session the headers will be glowing red hot and if you come back to the pits and shut off the motor right away you will cook the life out of your starter. Best practices are to cool the car down on track as best you can, come to the pits, open the hood and idle until the fans stop or engine CHT is below 200*. Also its not a bad idea to add a starter heat shield to reflect as much heat away from the starter. Another thing to look at closely is how the Water to Air heat exchanger was installed from the Whipple kit, a lot of installers hack up the plastic cooling shrouds from the bumper to the radiator in order to install the heat exchanger and lines. This will allow air to bypass the radiator and limit the ability for the radiator to do its job. Not a bad idea to look at hood vents as well to help get the heat out. The Cowl hood will not help you at speed and may actually make under hood venting worse, as speeds increase so does a high pressure zone at the base of the windshield, it can actually force air back under the hood instead of drawing it away from the engine bay. This can increase the under hood pressure enough to stall the air going through the radiator and reduce cooling capacity. Most effective heat extractor hoods vent the area of the hood much closer to the front bumper as the air is moving much faster over these vents and it will draw air out from under the hood as the air passes over the vents. Drawing air out of the engine bay will reduce the pressure under the hood and allow the air to move through the radiator more efficiently.

DIFF COOLING - Upgrade the diff fluid to a heavier weight full synthetic fluid, add a heat shield to the exhaust between the diff housing and the exhaust. Having a reflective heat shield and an air gap will be better than wrapping the exhaust pipes. See where that gets you, but if you use all of that Whipple on long high speed tracks the diff will need a dedicated cooler added.

SAFETY - Do not put a full cage in the car and drive it on the street unless you plan on wearing the harnesses and a helmet every time you drive the car. Partial cages and bolt in cages are there to make you feel warm and fuzzy, they do little to effect the roll over strength of the car from the B pillar forward and that is where your head is. A fire system or fire extinguisher is always a good idea. Fuel pump cut off switch within reach of the driver is not a bad idea either. Also all the new AN fuel lines that came with your Whipple kit should be inspected before each event and replaced every 3-5 years. I know it seems excessive but so is a fire under the hood.

BRAKES - The PP front brakes are fantastic and hold up quite well with the addition of some cooling ducts and backing plates, a quality pad will be needed for road course use. You could be carrying a lot of speed at the ends of the straights that will need to be scrubbed off and that means lots of rotor and pad heat to get rid of.

Dave

Dave,

Thanks for the insight and specific suggestions...

This set of tires will have to do this time around, and agreed, I've had understeer with similar NT05 stagger setup on AutoX courses. I need to look at a dedicated track set of wheels and square setup; today, both sets of wheels I have are 19x10 and 11 and 20x10 and 11. Without camber plates, I think I am stuck in terms of adding more/enough negative camber; correct me if I am mistaken.

I did the Whipple install myself and left the shrouds all intact, just notching them for the intercooler lines. I do need to pull the front bumper cover off as I am planning to add a Mishimoto oil cooler, the Reische 170 thermostat and possibly the Mishimoto performance radiator... I occasionally see higher CHT's when commuting and getting stuck in traffic, so these would all help off-track as well. The FP350S pan looks really nice, but $$ will wait to see what my oil temps are... hopefully the increased capacity with the cooler will offset this a bit.

I am due for a brake fluid flush/before the event, so I was going to put SS lines up front and go with Mutol 660. I've been happy with the noise and performance of the Hawk PC Yellow pads off the track, so we'll see how they do (they are pretty new still) and adjust for future events if needed.

With regards to the hood, I still have a steel hood and a second cowl hood... I may look at a heat extractor option for one of those prior to the event.

I'm not seeing any off the shelf options to shield the diff as you mentioned; any advise/articles here would be appreciated.

Thanks for the advice on safety as well... I am due for all the 100,000 miles consumables and new fuel lines would be good piece of mind (I did have one leak early after the install and replaced the line), I do have an in car fire extinguisher for such a case; off track as well.

Thanks again!

~ Paul

@_famlymn

 

[pmillerusa]

Like the above did, it's your first track day don't spend money not needed yet. Good set of track pads and motul 600 or 660 or Castrol srf brake fluid. Imani and dj both have your same whipple setup and track often

yessir.... some upgrades were already being considered, some may come with time based on feedback at the track and interest to keep doing it. All my prior events have been short courses, so quite a change to start a big track at Willow. We'll see you there.

 

[ddozier]

I did the Whipple install myself and left the shrouds all intact, just notching them for the intercooler lines. I do need to pull the front bumper cover off as I am planning to add a Mishimoto oil cooler, the Reische 170 thermostat and possibly the Mishimoto performance radiator... I occasionally see higher CHT's when commuting and getting stuck in traffic, so these would all help off-track as well. The FP350S pan looks really nice, but $$ will wait to see what my oil temps are... hopefully the increased capacity with the cooler will offset this a bit.

I'm not seeing any off the shelf options to shield the diff as you mentioned; any advise/articles here would be appreciated.

~ Paul

@_famlymn

I would hold off on the Mishi oil cooler, if you like tracking the car on the big tracks it may not be enough. On my builds with N/A cars that use the 7K+ RPM range a 60 row narrow cooler from Setrab is barely enough if that is the only cooler in place and that has a lot more cooling capacity than the Mishi and we are only at the 500hp range, you are going to need enough oil cooling to deal with the 800+ crank HP you have. Looking at the space left up front it is going to be hard to make one fit but the Setrab 50-172-7612 76 Row narrow cooler should fit above the bumper in the upper grill opening, you could also place a 50-660-7612 60 row mid width cooler behind the radiator since you have the front fans. It is going to be tight. Both of these coolers are quite big and still are rated to just over 600hp. The Mishi also gets rid of the factory coolant to oil cooler, that is not a bad idea if you have enough cooler, if you do not I would add the cooler in addition to the OEM unit.

To cover the exhaust pipe either make something or buy something like this to go between the pipe and the diff.
http://designengineering.com/titanium-pipe-shield/

yessir.... some upgrades were already being considered, some may come with time based on feedback at the track and interest to keep doing it. All my prior events have been short courses, so quite a change to start a big track at Willow. We'll see you there.

Get ready, I started much the same as you a few autocross events then a track day with a few buddies, 25 years later and I have a dedicated caged track car and I am on my 3rd one. It is a very slippery slope.

Dave

 

[Eritas]

Seat time & coaching

 

[HeelToeHero]

Cooling is going to be a big issue. It is on factory cars so a supercharger isn't going to help things one bit!

 

[pmillerusa]

Thanks all for the hints, pointers, warnings and experience... no pride to tarnish here, all feedback welcome, thank you!

A few cooling mods are on the way, and we'll see where that gets me. (thanks @ddozier for the details - a few DEI goodies, a Mishi Rad and 170 thermostat are inbound) Since I daily the car, not going to go too crazy, but want to limit any heat damage and make it an enjoyable day. My wife will be actually driving half the sessions, so we'll both get some seat time, hopefully with an instructor onboard for as many laps as possible.

Good times ahead.

~ Paul

 

[pmillerusa]

Also.. whats the consensus on fluids..?

In the engine I've run Royal Purple Full Syth since I bought the car. Ford/Motorcraft orange coolant with RedLine Water Wetter, same in the SC intercooler.

I have Motul 660 for the brakes to flush when I install the SS lines and brake cooling ducts.

Thoughts on Transmission (MT-82) and rear diff...?

Thanks!

 

[HeelToeHero]

I'm happy with BG fluid in the diff and trans.

Be careful with 2 drivers. The car needs time to cool off so if you're doubling the amount of time the car is on track. If the 2 people are only driving the amount one person would then that's a better situation (ie if you would normally get 10 sessions in a day she's driving 5 and you're driving 5 versus both of you running 10).

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