SC vs TT, need advice.

[bbrilli]

Hi all. I am going to go FI in the next 6 months or so. Can you please give me your opinions on which direction I should go?

My goals....
550-600 RWHP.
Probably will not take the car to a drag strip.
Probably will do some auto crossing.
No tracks, I have a track car.

My concerns....
I live in sunny FLA so heat will be a near constant battle.
I want reliability. Maybe 80,0000 miles worth.

I'm considering a pro charger with intercooler up grade and boostworks intake. I like the pro charger because I won't have to hack anything up.

I'm also considering a bottom mount twin turbo system. From what I understand they will have fewer heat problems.

If I go pro charger I will get a Beefcake package. Not sure about the TT's.

I will get at least a damper (ATI) and maybe OPG and TG.

I am liking Raceing Integration in Tampa for the install.

Words of wisdom?

Thanks.

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[olaosunt]

I was going to start another thread to explain my decision to switch from the on3 TT on my M6 to a KB .
Since I put the on3 Kit up for sale I have had several pm's asking why.
I though I would post my response to one of the PM's publicly and this seems an appropriate thread (I hope OP does not mind but he asked for opinions .lol)

"To give you some perspective I have always had supercharged mustangs.

I started with a 2006 GT /Roush M90,then a 2012 GT/built motor,snake bite TVS making 850 rwhp and 800 lb/ft torque from 3000 rpm(just traded for GT350) and 2011 GT500/2.3 TVS making 750/750.

I went from a TVS on my 12 to a 2.9 whipple/10 rib but then back to the TVS/snake bite after the whipple broke the crank of my alluiminator

I decided on TT this time around since I had some belt issues on my 12 GT with the VMP 8 rib.

I also have a couple of cars with OEM turbo's/ automatic-M235 with single twin scroll/in line 6 and wife's explorer sport-ecoboost and my experience with those cars-low rpm grunt, almost no lag convinced me(the aftermarket turbo's did not come close).

To be honest I have been kind of disappointed. My auto car with Hellion TT is fast-(10.0@141 on race gas )but does not feel like it on the street because of some lag despite the 55's.
I am switching to E85 and car should run easy 9's then if the back pressure is not an issue like my tuner suggests(Hellion says it should not be).

If it is ,I will have to upgrade the valve springs which is an expensive install on top of the cost of the valve springs.
If I could order the turbos again I would definitely be getting the 62's.

The on3 TT/manual/3.31 with the ball bearing 6l's aspooled up real quick(I will look for a video I made of the boost/rpm ramp I can text you if want) and was actually more fun on the street . I had the down pipes routed to the exhaust as it was too loud in boost. I also had resonators added to my Gibson exhaust midpipe as it was loud as hell.
It sounded better after that but when I opened the cut outs just before the chambered mufflers it sounded like a truck.
The car was better balanced because of the position of the turbo's as compared to the Helion car which was nose heavy(also base vs premium) and handled like it was on rails with the Steeda springs and IRS stuff I had on it.
I only had it at the strip once and it was hard to launch since it wont make boost off the line(not sure it would even with a 2 step).It ran 11.3 @137 with a crappy 1.9 60 ft on drag radials but then .....I think spun a rod bearing on my second attempt.
It was never going to be able to run as fast as the autocar/Hellion TT but it was more fun on the street. I loved the sound the blow off valve made-"whoosh"-but was also dead give away.
But.......although it spooled real quick(3500 rpm) I still missed the immediate low rpm torque you get from a PD blower.-I posted the dyno with 14 and 15 psi on E85 (made 815 rwhp and 760 lb/ft)
I have just rebuilt the engine in that car(sleeve supports/Manley piston/rods/OPG/crank sprocket) and I am switching to a 3.2 KB/long tube headers(I also miss the sound of long tube headers and never had a KB).

I don't regret "trying" the kit( especially as it was free, lol) and even though I was unlikely to have ever been able to run it as fast as my auto car at the strip I feel it was still more fun on the street.

The short story is ,it was plenty fun on the street but if you are used to the immediate/instant gratification(torque) of a PD car(or an OEM turbo car) you may be disappointed (like I was)

Try to get a test drive in one if you can.(obviously I cant offer you one since I am switching)"

 

[Excelerater]

so far I have had no issues with my Whipple,even in traffic where I have seen air temps 150+ but water never went above 215 it still ran fine and cooled right down after I was cruising again.
It will get high 90s here in a few weeks and ill know for sure where this thing stands
but as of now its been great and still gets 20-21MPG if you throttle lightly

Never owned a Turbo,so I cant comment on it but they are fast and have loads of
room for big HP esp in race apps

 

[beefcake]

any power adder works on these cars. the centris are the best bang for the buck imo, and we do a ton with them. we also do some really nice packages with the hellion twin kit too.

hit us up with any questions you have

 

[HELLION TURBO]

Hi all. I am going to go FI in the next 6 months or so. Can you please give me your opinions on which direction I should go?

My goals....
550-600 RWHP.
Probably will not take the car to a drag strip.
Probably will do some auto crossing.
No tracks, I have a track car.

My concerns....
I live in sunny FLA so heat will be a near constant battle.
I want reliability. Maybe 80,0000 miles worth.

I'm considering a pro charger with intercooler up grade and boostworks intake. I like the pro charger because I won't have to hack anything up.

I'm also considering a bottom mount twin turbo system. From what I understand they will have fewer heat problems.

If I go pro charger I will get a Beefcake package. Not sure about the TT's.

I will get at least a damper (ATI) and maybe OPG and TG.

I am liking Raceing Integration in Tampa for the install.

Words of wisdom?

Thanks.

Hello.

Just a couple of points to remember when choosing.

-for a final HP number desired, remember that "when" the power is made is very important. Most superchargers peak at say 550, but at lower rpm the power is much lower, and that is where most driving is done. A turbocharger by comparison, makes much more average and total power.

-When weather gets hot, a supercharger will have a set boost and it will be fixed as it is attached to the crank. So when the weather is bad the power will diminish. With a turbo and a boost controller, you can just simply reach over and add a lb or two to make up for that hot weather. A controller will also let you program a curve if you want to personalize your kit.

Good luck!

 

[ben@fatfab]

We have done multiple supercharger and turbo applications on these cars.

First off I am a turbo guy, through and through!

However anytime a customer tells me that they want around 600hp as a final goal I push them towards a supercharger. We prefer the VMP, Roush type superchargers over the centri style ones. IMO the centri's spool slower "like a turbo" and you still have a belt driven power adder. Its sort of the worst of both worlds, again my opinion.

My personal car had a VMP kit on it for a full summer. Made 620 to the tires and I floored it everywhere I went and enjoyed the hell out of it.

Now my car has a big single on it that we did. Its spools really fast but doesnt have that instant tq hit like the blower did. I actually like it this way. A proper turbo setup spools fast and is a ton of fun but you need something making 700+ to make the switch worth it. If you arent spinning the turbo/turbos enough to get a hard smack when boost hits the power curve "feels" to linear.

Good luck with your build!

 

[pilot0987]

I have had the Kenne Bell 3.2LC on my car and loved it. I had stock internals and a very conservative tune and the power and torque where unbelievable. I live in Houston where it is hot and muggy a lot of the summer and never saw my IAT above 130 while sitting in traffic. It has power when you needed it and stock drivability when your just cruising. It was always cool to watch your temps right before you hit the throttle and then right after your done with a pull to watch the IATs go straight to ambient. One of the biggest selling points for me on the Kenne Bell product was the ability to be able to swap the cases if I wanted a bigger supercharger without buying anything else. 80 percent of the base kit like the 2.8L, which is the smallest, will be used on the largest supercharger they sell like the 4.7L. There product support and knowledge was another selling point for me. If you have any more questions just ask or pm me.

 

[daltron]

Hi all. I am going to go FI in the next 6 months or so. Can you please give me your opinions on which direction I should go?

My goals....
550-600 RWHP.
Probably will not take the car to a drag strip.
Probably will do some auto crossing.
No tracks, I have a track car.

My concerns....
I live in sunny FLA so heat will be a near constant battle.
I want reliability. Maybe 80,0000 miles worth.

I'm considering a pro charger with intercooler up grade and boostworks intake. I like the pro charger because I won't have to hack anything up.

I'm also considering a bottom mount twin turbo system. From what I understand they will have fewer heat problems.

If I go pro charger I will get a Beefcake package. Not sure about the TT's.

I will get at least a damper (ATI) and maybe OPG and TG.

I am liking Raceing Integration in Tampa for the install.

Words of wisdom?

Thanks.

I just keep thinking Paxton from Beefcake for you. Granted, I am about as much an expert on FI as Clinton is a good liar, but the Paxton will not only be the cheapest by far but will easily hit your goals and comes with a great intercooler. [MENTION=17985]zaquhree[/MENTION] can comment a lot more for ya.

 

[daltron]

-When weather gets hot, a supercharger will have a set boost and it will be fixed as it is attached to the crank. So when the weather is bad the power will diminish. With a turbo and a boost controller, you can just simply reach over and add a lb or two to make up for that hot weather. A controller will also let you program a curve if you want to personalize your kit.

Good luck!

Is it as simple as just upping or lowering the boost on the fly or is there also going to need to be a tune revision to compensate? Always looking to learn more about FI!

Those turbos are sick btw.

 

[Phoenix]

kenne bell.

 

[evo8904]

Hi all. I am going to go FI in the next 6 months or so. Can you please give me your opinions on which direction I should go?

My goals....
550-600 RWHP.
Probably will not take the car to a drag strip.
Probably will do some auto crossing.
No tracks, I have a track car.

My concerns....
I live in sunny FLA so heat will be a near constant battle.
I want reliability. Maybe 80,0000 miles worth.

I'm considering a pro charger with intercooler up grade and boostworks intake. I like the pro charger because I won't have to hack anything up.

I'm also considering a bottom mount twin turbo system. From what I understand they will have fewer heat problems.

If I go pro charger I will get a Beefcake package. Not sure about the TT's.

I will get at least a damper (ATI) and maybe OPG and TG.

I am liking Raceing Integration in Tampa for the install.

Words of wisdom?

Thanks.

What is your budget?

I live in the Tampa area too and haven't have any issues with the heat. My whipple never goes above 116 degrees at my IAT2. A centri will run cooler however, for a PD supercharger, I have yet to see logs that have lower IATs than a whipple.

Another thing to consider is the tuning. I've seen numerous logs from Lund, Ken and Whipple. All of the tunes from them are safe but Whipple's is absolutely amazing. Whipple has one of the best tunes that I have seen.

 

[HELLION TURBO]

Is it as simple as just upping or lowering the boost on the fly or is there also going to need to be a tune revision to compensate? Always looking to learn more about FI!

Those turbos are sick btw.

Thank you.

The tune will compensate without changing the file. You can have a base setting of 7lb lets say, and on a hot day it will feel slower because of the weather (as it would with a supercharger or any other setup). With a turbo, you can go to your boost controller mounted in the dash, and simply up the boost a pound or two, and you have the power back;)

 

[bbrilli]

What is your budget?

I live in the Tampa area too and haven't have any issues with the heat. My whipple never goes above 116 degrees at my IAT2. A centri will run cooler however, for a PD supercharger, I have yet to see logs that have lower IATs than a whipple.

Another thing to consider is the tuning. I've seen numerous logs from Lund, Ken and Whipple. All of the tunes from them are safe but Whipple's is absolutely amazing. Whipple has one of the best tunes that I have seen.

I'd really like to keep it around 10 grand. Do you have Flight Control? That is attractive but I'm thinking it will be on the higher end of my budget.

 

[pilot0987]

What is your budget?

I live in the Tampa area too and haven't have any issues with the heat. My whipple never goes above 116 degrees at my IAT2. A centri will run cooler however, for a PD supercharger, I have yet to see logs that have lower IATs than a whipple.

Another thing to consider is the tuning. I've seen numerous logs from Lund, Ken and Whipple. All of the tunes from them are safe but Whipple's is absolutely amazing. Whipple has one of the best tunes that I have seen.

I can send you some KB logs if you send me some of your Whipple logs

 

[FATHERFORD]

Is it as simple as just upping or lowering the boost on the fly or is there also going to need to be a tune revision to compensate? Always looking to learn more about FI!

Those turbos are sick btw.

On my Twin Turbo car, I can go from 600rwhp to 1100rwhp just by pressing the "up" button a few times on my Eboost 2...

With that said, if you want a fun reliable daily driver, hard to go wrong with a KB package from boostworks.

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