OPG, Crankshaft Sprocket & Head Cooling

[ATTFighter]

I had a #8 cylinder fail on a completely stock 2012 so don't believe anyone saying it wasn't an issue! I was completely stock. Motor gave a 4,200rpm and destroyed the block and head.

Exactly, I remember it happening on stock motors

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[SVTFreak]

OPG, Crankshaft Sprocket & Head Cooling

I had a #8 cylinder fail on a completely stock 2012 so don't believe anyone saying it wasn't an issue! I was completely stock. Motor gave a 4,200rpm and destroyed the block and head.

Then you are the first person I have seen or heard of that it happened to stock. And I've chased down many "stock" rumors to only find out something was not stock, usually tune. "Well it was stock when I brought it in" was not uncommon.

Exactly, I remember it happening on stock motors

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Don't always believe what you read and hear.


Thankfully, the 15 motor seems to be doing well. I haven't seen a single unexplainable grenade. But I haven't been looking for one either.

 

[Process]

I'm not saying OPG and sprocket isnt worth it. I'm just saying my stuff is still in tact from the abuse I put it through.

 

[RubyRedBoost]

Then you are the first person I have seen or heard of that it happened to stock. And I've chased down many "stock" rumors to only find out something was not stock, usually tune. "Well it was stock when I brought it in" was not uncommon.




Don't always believe what you read and hear.


Thankfully, the 15 motor seems to be doing well. I haven't seen a single unexplainable grenade. But I haven't been looking for one either.

Must I go to Ford and post service records. Facts are facts. My car was 100% stock. I even had to sign for a $900 teardown so 2 Ford engineers could try a deny my claim. It was paid and warrantied by Ford. You can bullshit all you want. Fact is it has and did happen to a few people without tunes. So stop running your mouth.

 

[UPRSteve]

I have seen over 10 stock coyotes pop. not just number 8. But 4 , 6, and 7.

YES... TUNING WAS A HUGE PART OF IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


But the 4v engine has had Number 4 and 8 issues since the beginning in the 90s. The water jackets do no flow enough. Now with high rpm / heat, on a ring land that is 6thousands (which was good to Ford specs) which is thinner then a piece of paper... when they crack, they are going to break either up or down thus oil getting by and now causing detonation.

Late 13 they started using larger rings which did help a lot.

This is confirmed by some of the best coyote builders out there like MPR


I recommend anything to cool the motor down as much as possible. Most people see a good 15* cooler temps. From what I'm being told, the weak point on these motors are now the chains which are a little smaller then 11-14s.


Dean, you don't have to do any of them but I would recommend any of them.

 

[Process]

I can share some tuning parameters to prevent the #8 issue.

 

[mustang_guy]

I would do all three of those mods, its not like any of them are very expensive.

 

[TheHydro]

I've been working on cars for quite a while but don't feel confident installing the oil pump gear myself and it won't be cheap to install. I was quoted $800+ for labor to install longtubes and that seems like an easier install.

 

[Barrel]

I was quoted 8 hours to install the OPG and crank gear together.

 

[SVTFreak]

OPG, Crankshaft Sprocket & Head Cooling

Must I go to Ford and post service records. Facts are facts. My car was 100% stock. I even had to sign for a $900 teardown so 2 Ford engineers could try a deny my claim. It was paid and warrantied by Ford. You can bullshit all you want. Fact is it has and did happen to a few people without tunes. So stop running your mouth.

Haha! Sorry for you but do your research. You're one of the exception, not the rule.

Someone in the business says it all:

I have seen over 10 stock coyotes pop. not just number 8. But 4 , 6, and 7.

YES... TUNING WAS A HUGE PART OF IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[RubyRedBoost]

Haha! Sorry for you but do your research. You're one of the exception, not the rule.

Someone in the business says it all:

You only posted the part of his statement that pertained to your argument. Everything else he said proves my point. You said it wasnt an issue. The 11s and 12s had smaller ringlands that tweaked. This is fact and has been stated numerous times. Their were quite a few stock motors that had issues. Granted more were caused by crappy tunes and I totally agree with you there. My whole issue was you is telling the OP that the MMR cooling mod is useless. Based on your so called Facts. Which were apparently not the case if I had the issue. It only takes one exception to create cause for concern.

 

[SVTFreak]

OPG, Crankshaft Sprocket & Head Cooling

You only posted the part of his statement that pertained to your argument. Everything else he said proves my point. You said it wasnt an issue. The 11s and 12s had smaller ringlands that tweaked. This is fact and has been stated numerous times. Their were quite a few stock motors that had issues. Granted more were caused by crappy tunes and I totally agree with you there. My whole issue was you is telling the OP that the MMR cooling mod is useless. Based on your so called Facts. Which were apparently not the case if I had the issue. It only takes one exception to create cause for concern.

Glad we mostly agree, but I wanna point out that even the vendors here aren't recommending the cooling mod for 15's. It's simply not needed. Whatever the reason, better tunes, ring lands, whatever, it's not needed. A good tune, however, is necessary (as opposed to a bad one). That's never changed. Maybe the ring lands make the new ones able to stand a little more detonation or heat, but I guarantee if people tried to tune the 15 like the 05-10 (like the initial 11 tunes where from some places), you would see failures and I would put good money that #8 would still drop first.

As far as the ring lands, I don't think that had much to do with it. Yeah, it makes for stronger Pistons but on 11-12, cars with superchargers where making lots more power with no failures than tune only cars that where popping (and tuned incorrectly). I personally chased down 9 "stock" cars that popped #8 and after a little digging, all 8 of them had shitty aftermarket tunes. The last one was nitrous. All 9 owners claimed they where "stock". I'm not making any judgments on yours, and, really no longer care about those and won't be going try to verify yours cause it doesn't matter anymore. I'll take your world for it, I'm just saying I couldn't find one then is all. Sorry if I offended you. The sample size now is a lot larger than it was. And, why don't you hear about it happening any more now? Shouldn't it still be a problem?

If you wanna turn off the knock sensors and jack up the timing on a 2015, then a cooling mod might be beneficial. I wouldn't recommend that though.

 

[S550 KID]

I'm procharged since Feb and don't have any of those 7400rpm redline

 

[esacteksab]

I can share some tuning parameters to prevent the #8 issue.

Please do!

 

[UPRSteve]

Glad we mostly agree, but I wanna point out that even the vendors here aren't recommending the cooling mod for 15's. It's simply not needed. Whatever the reason, better tunes, ring lands, whatever, it's not needed. A good tune, however, is necessary (as opposed to a bad one). That's never changed. Maybe the ring lands make the new ones able to stand a little more detonation or heat, but I guarantee if people tried to tune the 15 like the 05-10 (like the initial 11 tunes where from some places), you would see failures and I would put good money that #8 would still drop first.

As far as the ring lands, I don't think that had much to do with it. Yeah, it makes for stronger Pistons but on 11-12, cars with superchargers where making lots more power with no failures than tune only cars that where popping (and tuned incorrectly). I personally chased down 9 "stock" cars that popped #8 and after a little digging, all 8 of them had shitty aftermarket tunes. The last one was nitrous. All 9 owners claimed they where "stock". I'm not making any judgments on yours, and, really no longer care about those and won't be going try to verify yours cause it doesn't matter anymore. I'll take your world for it, I'm just saying I couldn't find one then is all. Sorry if I offended you. The sample size now is a lot larger than it was. And, why don't you hear about it happening any more now? Shouldn't it still be a problem?

If you wanna turn off the knock sensors and jack up the timing on a 2015, then a cooling mod might be beneficial. I wouldn't recommend that though.

Tuning will add to issues BUT I have SEEN WELL OVER 10 COYOTES POP ON STOCK SET UPS.

The ring lands HAVE a lot to do with it. Ask any machine shop that builds coyotes. They see it all the time. 6thousands is again thinner then a piece of paper. They WILL crack with heat and rpm. If you add bad tuning, it will only hurt you more so.

Adding anything to cool the motor is 100% good. You want head in the cylinders but cool elsewhere. If your added a flow to allow a cooling affect, then do it.

People use to think that if you boost them, then your fine.. No That is when we started seeing other cylinders fail. And again.... a bad tune will affect and push this along quicker but along with the ring issue... It's going to happen.


Ford has since mid 13 changed the ring lands to a thicker one along with removing the oil squirters. They have since brought the squirters back but kept the rings larger. The set up on the BOSS was thicker as well. I have seen more BOSS's break #7 then 8 btw.

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