OPG, Crankshaft Sprocket & Head Cooling

[Travis@boostworks]

The ring lands are not .006" (6 thousanths). Attached is a pic of a 2011 Coyote piston.

The reason people were breaking stock pistons early on is because they didn't understand how to tune them. Ford uses an adaptive knock strategy, and leans heavily on the knock sensors to decide timing. People were turning them off. Number 7 and 8 ran the hottest and were the usual culprits, but we've seen others fail, too.

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[SVTFreak]

I see there is still tons of disagreement about what really was happening hehe.

 

[UPRSteve]

The ring lands are not .006" (6 thousanths). Attached is a pic of a 2011 Coyote piston.

The reason people were breaking stock pistons early on is because they didn't understand how to tune them. Ford uses an adaptive knock strategy, and leans heavily on the knock sensors to decide timing. People were turning them off. Number 7 and 8 ran the hottest and were the usual culprits, but we've seen others fail, too.

You will see 6-9thousands on the older coyotes. Even been confirmed by a Ford tech who built them. His actual words were "eh.. it's with spec"

And its 3, 4 , 7, and 8 that run the hottest. It's not just the driver side. Same on all 4v motors.

I know of multiple shops that have seen this. It's not new.

Tuning is an issue but NOT the issue.

 

[Travis@boostworks]

.006" to .009" where? PTW? You were saying the thickness of the ring land was .006". The ring lands are around .180" to .210", depending on where you measure.

If you meant to say PTW clearance, then that's a different story. Also, there was a lot of variance in the cylinder liners back in the early blocks. This caused some of the bores to go out of round, comprising ring seal, introducing oil into the combustion chamber, and effectively lowering the net octane of the fuel mixture. I've built some very high hp Coyotes, and Mike at L&M is one of the most knowledgeable people that I know of in regards to Coyote development. Ford sends him problems for consulting work and to help solve issues. He handles all of our block sleeving and machine work.

 

[mustang_guy]

.006" to .009" where? PTW? You were saying the thickness of the ring land was .006". The ring lands are around .180" to .210", depending on where you measure.

If you meant to say PTW clearance, then that's a different story. Also, there was a lot of variance in the cylinder liners back in the early blocks. This caused some of the bores to go out of round, comprising ring seal, introducing oil into the combustion chamber, and effectively lowering the net octane of the fuel mixture. I've built some very high hp Coyotes, and Mike at L&M is one of the most knowledgeable people that I know of in regards to Coyote development. Ford sends him problems for consulting work and to help solve issues. He handles all of our block sleeving and machine work.

I feel this has to be said. I respect what you do for our community travis. With that said I disagree about L&M, they are crooks as is evolution performance. As a former member of the gt500 community, their reputations has been greatly hurt by how they both did a customer that spent 40-50g. I think being you do a lot of business with them you should see what happened. Ive read all 27 pages and even posted in the thread myself. I encourage anyone considering L&M or evolution motorsports as a shop to think otherwise.

ugh its blocked. The thread on svt performance is called "how little boost does it take to build 1000+rwhp"

Anyone that wants a direct link, please pm me.

 

[beefcake]

I feel this has to be said. I respect what you do for our community travis. With that said I disagree about L&M, they are crooks as is evolution performance. As a former member of the gt500 community, their reputations has been greatly hurt by how they both did a customer that spent 40-50g. I think being you do a lot of business with them you should see what happened. Ive read all 27 pages and even posted in the thread myself. I encourage anyone considering L&M or evolution motorsports as a shop to think otherwise.

ugh its blocked. The thread on svt performance is called "how little boost does it take to build 1000+rwhp"

Anyone that wants a direct link, please pm me.

I've read some of the issue.

If I'm not mistaken though, didn't evolution contract the work to l&m and l&m provided what they were contracted to do? It wasn't what the customer wanted, but the customer didn't deal direct with them?

 

[mustang_guy]

I've read some of the issue.

If I'm not mistaken though, didn't evolution contract the work to l&m and l&m provided what they were contracted to do? It wasn't what the customer wanted, but the customer didn't deal direct with them?

to be honest, I don't remember every exact detail, I would have to refresh up on it. its been 6 months since I read the start of the thread. Its worth the full read, id put money on that. Its actually what caused me to sell my 14gt500 after I saw how much it costs for built trinity motors. 25-30 grand including a bare short block. Im glad I hadn't gotten into modding it yet. Especially seeing 800-850rwhp on the stock motor is really on borrowed time. :(

with all that said, the owner works on earth movers or something for a living, he chose to tear into the block after his suspension that it wasn't put together right, the owner of L&M called him a liar. owner of gt500 later proves it wasn't assembled correctly and some of the parts he paid for were not used. The whole thing is a huge mess.

 

[Travis@boostworks]

That was contracted through Evolution. Fred Cook has a questionable history to say the least, and I say that from personal experience. 2 years ago, he built my business partner a 2010 GT. Overcharged him, took a year to build it, and in the end, delivered a car with the wrong parts, and a busted up 3 valve. Mike @ L&M has a very long history of building great engines, and is a great guy to deal with.

 

[Travis@boostworks]

I feel this has to be said. I respect what you do for our community travis. With that said I disagree about L&M, they are crooks as is evolution performance. As a former member of the gt500 community, their reputations has been greatly hurt by how they both did a customer that spent 40-50g. I think being you do a lot of business with them you should see what happened. Ive read all 27 pages and even posted in the thread myself. I encourage anyone considering L&M or evolution motorsports as a shop to think otherwise.

ugh its blocked. The thread on svt performance is called "how little boost does it take to build 1000+rwhp"

Anyone that wants a direct link, please pm me.

I hear you, and trust me.. I looked at this whole ordeal very closely. Mike did what Evolution paid him to do. Evolution is the one that ripped off the customer. He did this exact same thing to my business partner a few years ago. Mike is a stand-up guy.

 

[mustang_guy]

I encourage you to look again and not just speak with mike. The owner proved in the thread that it wasnt assembled correctly either, not just not getting parts that he paid evo for. Mike offered no compensation. Basically told the owner he was lying and washed his hands of him. The owner proved what mike said happened, completely wrong.

The only people to build any mod motors for me will be accufab, bes, mpr, livernois or mmr.

 

[Travis@boostworks]

I'll look back at it again..

We assemble our own engines in house. Always have. L&M does our sleeve work. Miho is a good choice, too. He assembles our buddy Mark's Ford GT engine that propels his car to 278mph at the Texas Mile.

Mike @ L&M is one of the most knowledgeable modular Ford builders out there. But, sometimes things go sideways. I'll take a second look.

 

[mustang_guy]

I know hes supposed to be one of the best. But when the best acts too proud to admit he messed up and didn't make it right. its a problem. our hobby costs too much to trust him and possibly have it happen to ones self. He has a lot of people on yellowbullet that find him unfit to use now.

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