Need help with a 19x11 +50 squared setup

[S550MG]

So I'm in the market for a new wheel and tire setup. I'm currently running SVE 19x10 +35's with Michelin PS4's and -1.8* camber on the front. This setup handles great and I don't have any excessive camber wear.

My plan is to run the 19x11 setup with extended studs and a 20mm spacer up front. Based on my research it looks like I'll need to run about -2* camber, maybe a little more to keep the top of the tire from poking but will that cause camber wear on the front with the wider tire?

The car serves double duty as my daily and weekend track warrior. My average is about 700 miles per week and I'm hoping to get about 6-10 track days in this year. So for those purposes I'll be going back with the Michelin PS4's on my new setup.

I know its somewhat of a compromise for track and overkill for a street setup but I can't afford a separate set of track wheels and tires so I have decided on the 19x11 setup. The main purpose for upgrading the size is to gain more grip on the track.

Can anyone give me any feedback? Thanks.

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[draconis123]

I've been told by several people and tire places that the most significant part of tire wear is toe. As long as you can get that in check you should be fine. My current camber in the front is -2.4/-2.6 (no camber plates yet) and I haven't had any issues with wear despite mine being a daily as well. I've had several long trips including a 3000 mile road trip and haven't had any significant tire wear on both summer and winter tires.

That's not to say that there isn't more wear running this much camber compared to a more conservative number.

 

[NightmareMoon]

2 degrees may be a bit too little to even out track wear, which can kill tires fast. I'd prefer to have closer to 2.5 or so if I was running hard on the track.

2.0 may also a be a bit too much for street use, and we've seen a number that cord on the very edge of the inside tread. Personally, I had to toss some 20k mile MPSS tires that were not yet on the wear bars, but cording at that inside edge and I've seen pics more than a couple times with the same wear. I usually ask for 0 toe in the front, with ~-.15 to 0.2 toe in rear, so if toe was a factor, it wasn't much of one.

So for a dual-threat car (without camber plates) 2.0 is maybe as good of a middle ground as you can get, and if you're tracking the MP4s, they probably won't last anywhere near the 20k of street miles you'd need to actually see the effects of camber wear from accumulated street miles.

TD;DR, you're probably ok with 2 degrees (or slightly more) camber for starters. Camber plates (and different settings for track days vs street use) would be better.

 

[wildcatgoal]

-2.4 front; 1/16 total toe in
-1.8/ rear; 0 toe

That is what I run with 19x11 305 tire square wheels. Works fine. No odd wear on street tires, either. You also don't need 19x11 to do well on track. 19x10 and 275/285 tires is fine.

 

[Paul@PKAUTODESIGN]

When we did Rocketmans setup we did it at -2.3 degree front sir.
[MENTION=21494]wildcatgoal[/MENTION] knows his stuff also !

 

[S550MG]

2 degrees may be a bit too little to even out track wear, which can kill tires fast. I'd prefer to have closer to 2.5 or so if I was running hard on the track.

2.0 may also a be a bit too much for street use, and we've seen a number that cord on the very edge of the inside tread. Personally, I had to toss some 20k mile MPSS tires that were not yet on the wear bars, but cording at that inside edge and I've seen pics more than a couple times with the same wear. I usually ask for 0 toe in the front, with ~-.15 to 0.2 toe in rear, so if toe was a factor, it wasn't much of one.

So for a dual-threat car (without camber plates) 2.0 is maybe as good of a middle ground as you can get, and if you're tracking the MP4s, they probably won't last anywhere near the 20k of street miles you'd need to actually see the effects of camber wear from accumulated street miles.

TD;DR, you're probably ok with 2 degrees (or slightly more) camber for starters. Camber plates (and different settings for track days vs street use) would be better.

I should have clarified. I have camber plates currently and I’ll be running different settings for street and track. My question was geared towards my daily street camber setting.

-2.4 front; 1/16 total toe in
-1.8/ rear; 0 toe

That is what I run with 19x11 305 tire square wheels. Works fine. No odd wear on street tires, either. You also don't need 19x11 to do well on track. 19x10 and 275/285 tires is fine.

My desire for 19x11 squared is two fold. First reason is extra grip at the track, the second reason is to go with a deep concave wheel on all four corners. Do you notice excessive tram lining with the 305’s up front?

 

[Digital_Synapse]

I should have clarified. I have camber plates currently and I’ll be running different settings for street and track. My question was geared towards my daily street camber setting.



My desire for 19x11 squared is two fold. First reason is extra grip at the track, the second reason is to go with a deep concave wheel on all four corners. Do you notice excessive tram lining with the 305’s up front?

I notice excessive tramlining with 295s up front. I still want to go 305s on my next tires.

 

[S550MG]

Does anyone else have experience with 305's up front for daily use? I'm currently on 285's, just wondering how much more tramlining there will be.

 

[AlbertD]

I run 19x11 squared on 295/30 MPS4S... tram lining is minimal or at least not significant enough to bother me at all and I daily the car.

I run the following on both street and track, wear is within 1/32 deviation across the tire...

Front
-2.5
0.00
Rear
-1.5
0.11 (total toe 0.22)

 

[S550MG]

I run 19x11 squared on 295/30 MPS4S... tram lining is minimal or at least not significant enough to bother me at all and I daily the car.

I run the following on both street and track, wear is within 1/32 deviation across the tire...

Front
-2.5
0.00
Rear
-1.5
0.11 (total toe 0.22)

Thanks man. This is exactly the info I'm needing. How are your Michelins holding up to HPDE use? How many miles and how many track days will get out of that set?

 

[AlbertD]

I generally do 10-12 track days a year consisting of 4-5 20 min sessions each. Average around 12k miles street driving a year. The tires hold up surprisingly well on track. No chunking and the tires are fairly consistent throughout the day as long as you aren’t overdriving them. Predictable break away and audible warnings at the limit. These were so good for dual purpose duty that I chose to buy a second set. My first set were 285/35s on 19x10s. You won’t set any track records with these tires, but... if you want a tire that has great grip, can take track abuse and have excellent street manners then I highly recommend these MPS4S. These run a bit wide so that is why I run the 295s... they give 11.1 in thread width which is perfect on a 19x11.

 

[Digital_Synapse]

I run 19x11 squared on 295/30 MPS4S... tram lining is minimal or at least not significant enough to bother me at all and I daily the car.

I guess the quality of the roads has something to do with it as well. There are serious grooves now.

 

[S550MG]

I generally do 10-12 track days a year consisting of 4-5 20 min sessions each. Average around 12k miles street driving a year. The tires hold up surprisingly well on track. No chunking and the tires are fairly consistent throughout the day as long as you aren’t overdriving them. Predictable break away and audible warnings at the limit. These were so good for dual purpose duty that I chose to buy a second set. My first set were 285/35s on 19x10s. You won’t set any track records with these tires, but... if you want a tire that has great grip, can take track abuse and have excellent street manners then I highly recommend these MPS4S. These run a bit wide so that is why I run the 295s... they give 11.1 in thread width which is perfect on a 19x11.

Thanks again brother!! I currently have a set of the PS4’s in 285 and they were phenomenal for my single track outing. It was wet so I can’t speak to the dry grip but I definitely had the most wet grip out of anyone in the novice group and they gave me tons of confidence.

How many miles and track days did you get from your first set?

 

[AlbertD]

The first set lasted about a year. The key to making them last is getting enough camber (for me -2.5 was the sweet spot) so you don't eat up the outer shoulders and ensure the toe is within spec.

 

[Flyhalf]

-2.4 front; 1/16 total toe in
-1.8/ rear; 0 toe

That is what I run with 19x11 305 tire square wheels. Works fine. No odd wear on street tires, either. You also don't need 19x11 to do well on track. 19x10 and 275/285 tires is fine.

Let me ask you few questions please.
dO YOU USE A SPACER?
WHAT 19X11 Wheels DO YOU USE?
Did you change the studs?

please let me know!

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