More hp or less weight?

[WestRace]

Either going for more hp or get rid of some weight.

A 5.2L producing 500hp is very doable and will probably save cost. The next step will be getting rid of a few dead weight.

Carbon hood, roof, trunk, dashboard, intakes.
Carbon front strut brace.
Carbon front/rear brakes.
All aluminum suspension/control arms.
Get rid of a bunch of surround sound speakers.
Rear seats delete
Light weight front seats.
Light weight battery.
Adding a few more aluminum components on the body shell.
Maybe all aluminum body panels except for hood, roof, trunk which are already carbon fiber.
Carbon fiber drive shaft.
Carbon fiber engine cover.

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[TampaBear67]

I assume these are things that you are proposing to do to your car, because Ford, Realistically isn't going to do them for such a limited production car.

 

[Grimace427]

Lightweight non-adjustable front seats can save about 100lbs all by themsleves. Add lighter wheels, driveshaft, and exhaust and that could be 200lbs total right there without having to strip out the interior.

 

[Thed]

Lightweight non-adjustable front seats can save about 100lbs all by themsleves. Add lighter wheels, driveshaft, and exhaust and that could be 200lbs total right there without having to strip out the interior.

THIS

 

[DBCooper]

For most of us, the "seat to steering wheel interface" could lose about 20lbs too.

 

[thePill]

Something worth contimplating... My 2011 Brembo GT with 401a interior weighed 3555lbs with all fluids, fix a flat/air pump, floor mats and on 50 miles to E. The Brembo GT was the heaviest, with the exception of an E-Pack and Glass roof.

The curb weights are based on a percentage for mass produced vehicles. Most times it's standard equipment but, I have seen options that exceed 55% of units sold have that weight figured in to the curb weight.

There is specific guidance on this somewhere, I'll look if I get time.

 

[Grimace427]

For most of us, the "seat to steering wheel interface" could lose about 20lbs too.

Apparently 5 pounts of steel weighs more than 5 mounds of fat to some people. I'm 7.8% bodyfat so I'm happy.

Something worth contimplating... My 2011 Brembo GT with 401a interior weighed 3555lbs with all fluids, fix a flat/air pump, floor mats and on 50 miles to E. The Brembo GT was the heaviest, with the exception of an E-Pack and Glass roof.

Vorshlag and a few other shops weighed their 400A Brembo 5.0's at 3,605lbs with 1/2 tank of fuel.

 

[Dirk McGurck]

...Yes

 

[thePill]

Apparently 5 pounts of steel weighs more than 5 mounds of fat to some people. I'm 7.8% bodyfat so I'm happy.




Vorshlag and a few other shops weighed their 400A Brembo 5.0's at 3,605lbs with 1/2 tank of fuel.

Holy sh!t man, I'm at almost 8% flat. I got into strength training after my retirement. We have quite a few similarities.

16 gallons of gas weighs exactly 100lbs so, that's the spread were looking at. Probably 3640 to 3540... Seems about right.

For Am racing, or heat racing in general, 50 miles to E is a nice little function. Although, that's 75lbs gone from the rear. Did anyone else notice the ability to rotate increase as the weight distribution changed and tires got hot?

I'm keeping my fingers crossed that Ford pulls weight from the Mustang. Their track record on weight reduction on new platforms is nearly unmatched. I have a feeling we might get both

 

[Grimace427]

Holy sh!t man, I'm at almost 8% flat. I got into strength training after my retirement. We have quite a few similarities.

16 gallons of gas weighs exactly 100lbs so, that's the spread were looking at. Probably 3640 to 3540... Seems about right.

For Am racing, or heat racing in general, 50 miles to E is a nice little function. Although, that's 75lbs gone from the rear. Did anyone else notice the ability to rotate increase as the weight distribution changed and tires got hot?

I'm keeping my fingers crossed that Ford pulls weight from the Mustang. Their track record on weight reduction on new platforms is nearly unmatched. I have a feeling we might get both

Vorshlag intentionally runs at or close to half tank due to an issue they were having with fuel starvation. I recall a few people having FP issues so theirs' might have been affected.

If Ford doesn't pull significant weight out of the car stock I'm not really too worried. The Mustang is one of the easiest cars to remove weight from(as I mentioned in my previous post about seats and exhaust) and it isn't like the racers aren't going to mod the car anyway. Obviously if it was lower to start then any further weight reduction is icing on the cake but let's be realistic, we are looking at street cars here and not racecars. People build racecars, not buy them(shameless poke at the Z/28 :lol.


As for the original topic I'm hoping for a combination of both but realistically admit the platform will be the same between the GT and hi-po. They aren't going to change the chassis/body between the models for weight reduction, only the options and ancillary body components. So if you took the same mods to both cars they will likely end up the same weight.

 

[WestRace]

Vorshlag intentionally runs at or close to half tank due to an issue they were having with fuel starvation. I recall a few people having FP issues so theirs' might have been affected.

If Ford doesn't pull significant weight out of the car stock I'm not really too worried. The Mustang is one of the easiest cars to remove weight from(as I mentioned in my previous post about seats and exhaust) and it isn't like the racers aren't going to mod the car anyway. Obviously if it was lower to start then any further weight reduction is icing on the cake but let's be realistic, we are looking at street cars here and not racecars. People build racecars, not buy them(shameless poke at the Z/28 :lol.


As for the original topic I'm hoping for a combination of both but realistically admit the platform will be the same between the GT and hi-po. They aren't going to change the chassis/body between the models for weight reduction, only the options and ancillary body components. So if you took the same mods to both cars they will likely end up the same weight.

I think we here are making fun of Camaro but I think GM has done a amazing job with the car given its weight. The reason the Mustang could not compete with the ZL1 was because the live axle not able to run wider offset wheels and stiffer springs otherwise the car would be too harsh on the street.
The Camaro Z28 is basically the 911 GT3 for half the price and much lower maintenance cost, but too bad it looks just too weird for me. And to be honest, the GT350 would be a great achievement if it has the same performance number as the Z28 (hopefully for only 52K ).

 

[Grimace427]

I think we here are making fun of Camaro but I think GM has done a amazing job with the car given its weight.

Surprisingly I wasn't actually making fun of the Camaro itself but rather the idea of buying a pseudo racecar and calling it a racecar. I guess there are two kinds of track cars, those for people with money to burn and those who like to know each and every aspect of their vehicle and put it together to function exactly how they want it to. I enjoy taking an imperfect vehicle and performing upgrades to exactly where I think they should be.

The reason the Mustang could not compete with the ZL1 was because the live axle not able to run wider offset wheels and stiffer springs otherwise the car would be too harsh on the street.

Mustang could not compete with the ZL1? Where is the Mustang with 285/305 tires from the factory?

Your jab at the live rear axle does not make any sense whatsoever. Wider offset wheels? Offset is the measurement that dictates how far inboard or outboard of the fenders the wheel sits. +42mm(stock Brembo example) means the hub bolts to the wheel 42mm closer to the outside face of the wheel from centerline. This does not dictate the performance of the car.

If you were trying to say just wider wheels and accidentally put offset, I'd ask you to check out the many MANY racecars built with the S197's SRA running crazy wide wheels and tires within the stock fenders. Vorshlag has 12" wheels with 335mm tires under the stock fenders(345 tires began to rub).

I have no idea where you were going with the stiffer springs part so you can clarify that later.

The Camaro Z28 is basically the 911 GT3 for half the price and much lower maintenance cost, but too bad it looks just too weird for me.

Lower maintenance cost? It has $550+ Pirelli Trofeo tires on all 4 corners that will wear out twice as fast as the Porsche because of it's massive weight. It also has the same style carbon ceramic brakes as a Porsche so that is a wash.

And to be honest, the GT350 would be a great achievement if it has the same performance number as the Z28 (hopefully for only 52K ).

All that the next hi-performance Mustang needs to do is offer a track package with serious r-compound tires and well sorted chassis and it will hand the ZL1/Z/28 its ass on the racetrack. No fancy MRC or DSSV shocks necessary.

I apologize if I sounded harsh at all but parts of your post confused me so I wasn't sure how to respond. No disrespect intended.

 

[c3po]

Given the Z28's extra weight, I'd say the break pads/rotors will wear faster and be more costly to maintain than on the 911 GT3.

 

[WestRace]

Surprisingly I wasn't actually making fun of the Camaro itself but rather the idea of buying a pseudo racecar and calling it a racecar. I guess there are two kinds of track cars, those for people with money to burn and those who like to know each and every aspect of their vehicle and put it together to function exactly how they want it to. I enjoy taking an imperfect vehicle and performing upgrades to exactly where I think they should be.




Mustang could not compete with the ZL1? Where is the Mustang with 285/305 tires from the factory?

Your jab at the live rear axle does not make any sense whatsoever. Wider offset wheels? Offset is the measurement that dictates how far inboard or outboard of the fenders the wheel sits. +42mm(stock Brembo example) means the hub bolts to the wheel 42mm closer to the outside face of the wheel from centerline. This does not dictate the performance of the car.

If you were trying to say just wider wheels and accidentally put offset, I'd ask you to check out the many MANY racecars built with the S197's SRA running crazy wide wheels and tires within the stock fenders. Vorshlag has 12" wheels with 335mm tires under the stock fenders(345 tires began to rub).

I have no idea where you were going with the stiffer springs part so you can clarify that later.




Lower maintenance cost? It has $550+ Pirelli Trofeo tires on all 4 corners that will wear out twice as fast as the Porsche because of it's massive weight. It also has the same style carbon ceramic brakes as a Porsche so that is a wash.




All that the next hi-performance Mustang needs to do is offer a track package with serious r-compound tires and well sorted chassis and it will hand the ZL1/Z/28 its ass on the racetrack. No fancy MRC or DSSV shocks necessary.

I apologize if I sounded harsh at all but parts of your post confused me so I wasn't sure how to respond. No disrespect intended.

The live-axle has a lot of unsprung weight. Running stiffer spring/damper will make the ride too harsh for everyday driving. Running wider offset wheels (don't bother me with semantics) will just make the ride that much harsher. Both the Boss and GT500 will probably get another 2 secs per lap with just wider and better favorable offset wheels but Ford knows that it's probably not a good compromise for street use.
For race car, my best guess is that they don't really care about competing with Lexus for ride quality.

Your post is not harsh. It's just weird.

 

[WestRace]

Given the Z28's extra weight, I'd say the break pads/rotors will wear faster and be more costly to maintain than on the 911 GT3.

If you think maintaining a 911 GT3 is cheaper than the Camaro Z28, I got some desert real estate I want you to buy.

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