1. Coolmanfoo

    Coolmanfoo Well-Known Member

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    Idk what happened in my brain today but I really , really want the new mustang inspired ev crossover. Especially if it has the rumored 370 mile range. What an awesome daily. Then id have my loud, gas drinking beast for the weekend.

    Yeah I like that future.
     
  2. Cardude99

    Cardude99 Well-Known Member

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    Don't feel bad, lately I have really been considering getting a Tesla model 3. Something about paying $3 to fill the tank and having a car nearly as quick as a mustang gt just makes sense.
     
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  3. Rock&Roll

    Rock&Roll Well-Known Member

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    My buddy has a Tesla 3 Dual Motor AWD.

    Holy crap that thing is fast :rockon:
     
  4. Cardude99

    Cardude99 Well-Known Member

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    Ya I bet. I was looking at a used long range, thinking of getting rid of the truck for that. Hardly use the truck for it's intended purpose anyway
     
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  5. OP
    OP
    Coolmanfoo

    Coolmanfoo Well-Known Member

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    Well I'm not sold on current evs. Something about a sub 300 mile charge worries me.

    But if we had a great mustang branded 370 range car? I don't care if it has 2, 4 or 6 doors I just want it. Plus I imagine it'll look great sitting next to a "real" mustang in the garage!
     
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  6. Sivi70980

    Sivi70980 Well-Known Member

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    I watched a youtube video of a guy mathing out the first year of model 3 ownership. Using that, I did my own math just before purchasing my mustang and would have been nearly the same investment for the super base bare bones model 3 as my GT PP1, including home charger and all you need to own a model 3. Then it's the gas vs. charging per mile and I would only save $1200 a year....for a much less fun car imo and base trim level, just wasn't for me. I love the idea of EVs and want them to take off but the ones I've test driven are so plain and boring and when you want the actually fast ones, open up that wallet. I drove a model S with all the bells and whistles (130k car!) and yes it was a rocket ship but it didn't even have a jack in the back to charge a device. I think they're (EVs) are the cusp of something great but just not there yet. Unfortunately to take off, they need us to buy them. The other thing to consider is if our current power plants can even handle millions of EVs charging every night and if they ramp up production of power, is it actually saving fossil fuels? Sorry, early morning rant mode.
     
  7. Prokiller

    Prokiller Well-Known Member

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    i got walked by a dual motor tesla 3 the other night. was really impressed with the speed it was able to just throwdown
     
  8. 2017GBGTPP

    2017GBGTPP Well-Known Member

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    You don't need a home charger to own a Model 3. You can trickle charge from a 120V outlet overnight and be fine unless you drive 200+ miles every day.

    And most power plants don't use fossil fuels anymore. All of my electricity comes from nuclear. Most that do still use fossil fuels are gas/oil plants, which are still far more efficient then gas engines.

    There are still a lot of myths about electrical cars that need to be dispelled, and while the technology is still improving it's already at the point of being worth it for most people.
     
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  9. Ebm

    Ebm Well-Known Member

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    Couple things that keep me away from EVs right now.

    1) Charging speed. Still takes too long
    2) Initial cost
    3) Range in extreme temperatures
    4) Not completely necessary, but I'm sure I would miss the sound. That exhaust note :)

    Interesting enough, earlier today I saw a Tesla go through a flooded area with ease.

     
  10. ctandc72

    ctandc72 Well-Known Member

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    There are other issues that it seems almost never get discussed.
    Battery life.
    Disposal + Cost of said batteries when they reach the end of their life.

    In the U.S:

    A tick over 19% of all electricity generated by Nuclear power
    Coal 27%
    Natural Gas 35%
    Hydro 7%
    Wind 6%

    See here:

    https://www.eia.gov/tools/faqs/faq.php?id=427&t=3

    The Palo Verde plant in AZ is the largest producing nuclear plant in the U.S.

    Nuclear power is the only common sense choice for producing electricity in the United States - but years of EPA legislation and grants and programs designed to make solar and wind "competitive" (hint - they aren't and wind will never be for the vast majority of the U.S and solar is hampered by location and battery storage technology)

    The trust cost of an EV has to take in account the subsidies and tax deductions given to boost sales of these vehicles. Taxpayer funds have propped up the industry in the U.S. - see all those Tesla charging stations being installed across the country?

    Tesla motors has come along way - but the entire car business for Musk loses money. His other interests make the money (plus subsidies and loans from the government) that drives Tesla motors.

    The issues of how to dispose and recycle all these batteries is still in flux.
     
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  11. Sivi70980

    Sivi70980 Well-Known Member

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    Nice to know about the trickle charger, my car is strictly for work commute so that would totally work for me. Couldn't agree more on the myths either. I know my parents ( both retired) are looking at an EV in the near future. My dad isn't giving up his 69 Nova though lol.
     
  12. HoosierDaddy

    HoosierDaddy Well-Known Member

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    Did it leave a trail like this?

     
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  13. VooDooDaddy

    VooDooDaddy Well-Known Member

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    If people think they are "saving the planet" by buying electric cars, they are either ignorant of the full reality of electric cars, or chose to live in denial.

    Without going into extreme detail because I have no interest in sitting at my computer for two hours typing let me put it in very, very simple terms below:

    If the entire first-world (U.S./Canada/Europe/Australia) somehow stopped using gasoline/diesel, then the demand would drop on a massive, massive scale. Well, what happens to the price of something when the demand bottoms out? Yes, the price drops accordingly. Which means if the price of gasoline/diesel dropped to say 1/3 the price it is now, then gasoline/diesel become affordable to people living in undeveloped/underdeveloped areas of the planet such as Africa/SE Asia; and THEY will burn it.

    If you don't think that we as a species won't burn every last drop of petroleum that we can get our grubby, little hands on; well you are living in a fantasy land.

    And if we as a species are going to burn it all, then please let me joint in on the party!
     
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  14. ctandc72

    ctandc72 Well-Known Member

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    Easier explained than that. Recent studies showed that if the U.S. immediately stopped ALL fossil fuel use / carbon output, worldwide figures would not go down. See China and India.
     
  15. HoosierDaddy

    HoosierDaddy Well-Known Member

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    Yep. That's why I assume the details of the green new deal include nuking the rest of the world into the stone age before we do anything else in the plan. Shouldn't get much blow-back. Surely, they can understand we are doing it for their own good.
     
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  16. EVL-S550

    EVL-S550 Well-Known Member

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    Amen.
     
  17. 2017GBGTPP

    2017GBGTPP Well-Known Member

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    Who cares what China and India are doing? Using a global warming argument to say there's nothing we can do globally so we might as well pollute our country is a dangerous (and common) belief. Just because we can't stop global warming doesn't mean we should be living with poisoned air and water.

    I am baffled at how many people have been convinced that poisoning our environment is a good thing. I challenge anybody to travel to New Delhi and tell me that's the kind of environment they want here.
     
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  18. ctandc72

    ctandc72 Well-Known Member

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    I"m baffled how I use facts - and you somehow morph that into I'm "convinced poisoning our environment is a good thing". Travel to India? You mean the place where capitalism is lifting MILLIONS out of poverty? Problem is you compare YOUR life and YOUR surroundings to New Delhi. Why? Do you know the history behind India? Do you know what they've come from to get where they are now? On the flipside I've been to places where gasoline powered generators / pumps are the only affordable way for people to have clean water without lugging it by hand. The difference in their life with clean water versus contaminated water literally can be life and death.

    That's one of the biggest problems with many people in our country. They look at other countries / people and view them through their own perspective / life and experiences. Like the people in the U.S. years ago who were outraged at a major manufacturer paying people $5 a day for working in a "sweat shop". That $5 a day was enough for these people to feed their family. Instead of a little research and looking at what the cost of living is in other places, they just automatically compared to what $5 a day would buy them here in the U.S.

    So far in the U.S. almost the entire "Green" energy movement has done nothing but drive the cost of electricity up, cost the taxpayers billions of dollars - but some people "Feel better". We're "doing something". Solar is not a practical large scale solution for power production. Wind? The cost vs generation factor is ridiculous when you look at actual costs (installation / maintenance / use of real estate / land versus cost not to mention the effect on the local wildlife and environment). Do I have to mention ethanol? BILLIONS Spent on a faulty energy production scheme - where it LITERALLY took MORE than 1 gallon of gasoline to generate 1 gallon of ethanol, especially when the BTU from one gallon ethanol is quite a bit less than 1 gallon of gasoline.

    What about the problem of the thousand of batteries from EVs that have to be recycled / disposed of? As of 2015 there was ONE plant that could recycle these batteries effectively in any kind of large scale environment.

    Good intentions are great. But unintended consequences are still consequences. And making it some kind of moral issue is disingenuous at best.

    Are we even going to talk about the huge amount of rare earth minerals needed for all this EV technology and what the mining process is doing to the very environment that this process is meant to improve?
     
  19. BlackandBlue

    BlackandBlue Well-Known Member

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    A few points.

    The cost of green energy is directly related to cost of electricity.

    50% green = ~50% increase in cost.
    This is due to idling on demand station for peak demand. Upkeep Cost stays the while profitability plunges.

    The power grid is runs near capacity for profitability purposes. Imagine taking out all the gasoline that is pumped everyday. This would take huge investment in power in infrastructure since the gasoline would now be overhead. There could also be huge peak dam and around holidays that cause brownouts.

    Electric cars are more harmful to the environment from a pure gas vs eletric standpoint. Lithium, converting from ac to dc back to ac is inefficient. Lithium alone is terrible and non recyclable in bulk.

    Tesla is a bankrupt company. They don’t make money. They won’t be around in current form in 5 years. Competition Is coming. Need a fender or motor? Good
    Luck.

    Eletric will one day be a viable alternative in mass. It is not at this point. We need much better batteries that are not completely toxic to put environment.

    They however will change the drag racing world at some
    Point.
     
  20. Biggus Dickus

    Biggus Dickus Well-Known Member

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    I love some of the arguments here - "Since we can't do anything about destroying the Earth, let's do nothing and let's just burn it to the ground until it becomes uninhabitable, because, well, it is simply a human fait accompli". How convenient.
     
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