GEN 5 whipple 60-130 dragy ?

[1Mean22]

Did exactly 695whp on the dyno.

Thanks for the Information man I’m really stuck between twin turbos and a whipple I’m not sure what I want

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[1Mean22]

Car ran 143.8mph on the same pulley and E85

Could you say you would be able to beat a twin turbo In a roll? And a drag? How’s the heat soaks as well? How many WOT pills are you able to do before needing to wait for it to cool down?

 

[Platinum_5.0]

Could you say you would be able to beat a twin turbo In a roll? And a drag? How’s the heat soaks as well? How many WOT pills are you able to do before needing to wait for it to cool down?

I mean turbos will always be a little faster at same boost. There is lots of factors involved there but that's just in general. Depends on your goal I guess. I have beat a big single turbo on pump vs my pump. As for heat soak? I get none. I've done 6 back to back pulls and IAT2 is always perfect.

 

[1Mean22]

I mean turbos will always be a little faster at same boost. There is lots of factors involved there but that's just in general. Depends on your goal I guess. I have beat a big single turbo on pump vs my pump. As for heat soak? I get none. I've done 6 back to back pulls and IAT2 is always perfect.

I’m fairly new into the cars scene but do you think twin turbos are high maintenance and if so is it worth it in your opinion? Are the whipple high maintenance aswell?

I want to be able to keep a stock trans as well and I could slowly have a built motor for when it’s needed of course “I have a 10r80”

My goal is to really just be able to put up a good fight against vettes gtr etc I’m not going to a track anytime soon more likely on a drag strip but mainly races in Mexico of course

 

[engineermike]

3.5 pulley on 93? Isn't that risky? You are in crazy hero DA as well so you aren't losing boost that's for sure.

Maybe I am crazy but I’m running a 3.25” pulley on 93 octane.

 

[Platinum_5.0]

Maybe I am crazy but I’m running a 3.25” pulley on 93 octane.

Wow.. I'm sure there has to be some very careful tuning involved...lol.. Isn't that 15-16psi?

 

[mejohn50]

3.5 pulley on 93? Isn't that risky? You are in crazy hero DA as well so you aren't losing boost that's for sure.

I‘m running ~16-17° of timing on this pulley depending on ambient conditions. I think I’m 0.5-1° away from knock, so I‘m not sure it’s too risky. None of the tuners will tune for this combo. They‘ve all pretty well got the community convinced you need E85 and a $3000 fuel system to run more than 11-12psi of boost.

Yesterday morning I did another pull and saw 14.8psi and over 1.8 load, but it was -1400’ DA. The car didn’t really get any faster but I was spinning MT drag radials in 3rd gear. 14-15psi and >1.8 load is 3.375” pulley territory in “normal” conditions, so I could probably drop one more size from late spring to early fall.

And as you can see what @engineermike is doing with the XDi pump and tons of other tweaks gives even more head room on 93.

Edited to add this pull in +200’ DA.

 

[SolarFlare]

If you’re not sure if you want turbos or whipple then you shouldn’t be buying a turbo kit. Only people who understand turbos and know what they’re getting into should buy turbo kits. If you’re newly into cars don’t get turbos. Buy a whipple. Common misconception that you hear “this coyote has turbos” and people automatically assume it runs low 8s at 160mph. There are plenty of slow turbo cars.

 

[TX-Ripper]

S

If you’re not sure if you want turbos or whipple then you shouldn’t be buying a turbo kit. Only people who understand turbos and know what they’re getting into should buy turbo kits. If you’re newly into cars don’t get turbos. Buy a whipple. Common misconception that you hear “this coyote has turbos” and people automatically assume it runs low 8s at 160mph. There are plenty of slow turbo cars.

solid advice

 

[engineermike]

Wow.. I'm sure there has to be some very careful tuning involved...lol.. Isn't that 15-16psi?

Oh yea, lots of tuning and logging. I can still hit 17 deg timing in the right conditions though. In the wrong conditions it might be 12-14. Just remember that boost level and charge temp have a proportional effect on knock, compression ratio is squared, but timing is cubed (simplifying, but you get the point). So you can get away with a lot of boost (assuming you have sufficient fuel system) as long as your timing is well controlled. I can make half a dozen passes and never pick up a single knock event, which is more than you can say for stock on 93.

I’m with @mejohn50 ….think about it from bigtuner’s standpoint; a) it takes them a lot more time to really optimize for pump gas, b) there’s increased liability if your fuel system or gas quality isnt up to snuff, and c) they can’t sell you more upgrade parts. Pushing pump gas limits isn’t in their best interest even if it is possible, and everyone seems to take what they say as gospel.

 

[Platinum_5.0]

Oh yea, lots of tuning and logging. I can still hit 17 deg timing in the right conditions though. In the wrong conditions it might be 12-14. Just remember that boost level and charge temp have a proportional effect on knock, compression ratio is squared, but timing is cubed (simplifying, but you get the point). So you can get away with a lot of boost (assuming you have sufficient fuel system) as long as your timing is well controlled. I can make half a dozen passes and never pick up a single knock event, which is more than you can say for stock on 93.

I’m with @mejohn50 ….think about it from bigtuner’s standpoint; a) it takes them a lot more time to really optimize for pump gas, b) there’s increased liability if your fuel system or gas quality isnt up to snuff, and c) they can’t sell you more upgrade parts. Pushing pump gas limits isn’t in their best interest even if it is possible, and everyone seems to take what they say as gospel.

Well it all makes sense to me and yeah, I've been convinced that pump gas is a very delicate thing on these cars and, well, I'm no tuner so who am I to question...lol...thanks for the insight

 

[Platinum_5.0]

I‘m running ~16-17° of timing on this pulley depending on ambient conditions. I think I’m 0.5-1° away from knock, so I‘m not sure it’s too risky. None of the tuners will tune for this combo. They‘ve all pretty well got the community convinced you need E85 and a $3000 fuel system to run more than 11-12psi of boost.

Yesterday morning I did another pull and saw 14.8psi and over 1.8 load, but it was -1400’ DA. The car didn’t really get any faster but I was spinning MT drag radials in 3rd gear. 14-15psi and >1.8 load is 3.375” pulley territory in “normal” conditions, so I could probably drop one more size from late spring to early fall.

And as you can see what @engineermike is doing with the XDi pump and tons of other tweaks gives even more head room on 93.

Edited to add this pull in +200’ DA.

That is awesome and yeah, they had me convinced...lol

 

[mejohn50]

That is awesome and yeah, they had me convinced...lol

The issue though is that they control access to changes inside the PCM for the most part. So if they won’t tune for a specific combo, then it really isn’t possible to run it unless you’re willing to figure out how to tune it yourself or you find someone willing to take the “risk”.

I was never planning to go to this small of a pulley on pump gas. I didn’t think it was possible. Now I see it’s possible to go even smaller than the 3.5” on the stock DI pump and smaller yet with a bigger DI pump and a few other optimizations.

 

[mejohn50]

Thought I would share this comparison for anyone who is interested.

Both runs were taken on the same day within about 3 hours of one another. The left run was earlier in the day so the DA was a hair better, but similar enough conditions for this comparison. Both runs starting in 3rd gear, though I can start in 2nd. I didn't start in 2nd to eliminate the wheel spin variable, but in my experience starting in 2nd rather than 3rd is worth about 0.15-0.2 second improvement. Both runs on pure pump 93 octane. No booster, no splash of race gas, just regular old 93 from the gas station in my small town.

Left run is 3.75" pulley and right run is 3.25" pulley with a load limiter in place at 1.8 air load to make sure I didn't run out of fuel or spark (and also to keep the pistons and connecting rods happy). I could have removed the limiter and made another run since I wasn't out of fuel or spark, but this is already pushing harder than I had ever expected on pump gas. I was holding right at 1.8 air load in the data log and it was hitting 16 degrees of timing at 7500rpm, which is also where it was shifting. Saw no knock other than one event on one cylinder on the 4>5 and 5>6 shifts.

Based on this data I am very confident a mid to low 5.x is possible on just pump gas at full weight.

 

[Torinate]

Very nice! 4 10ths with basically just a pully change!! And safe to boot! Well done!

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