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EvilMerlin

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Agreed and great point with respect to doubling the MSRP for this car.

In addition to your detailed description on the 2000 Cobra R I particulary like some additional items that John Colleti and his SVT of engineers added or deleted from this very cool car.

AC delete
Radio delete
Sound deadener delete
Borla side exhaust exiting in front of the rear wheels
Front brake cooling ducts
Independent rear end
21 Gallon Fuel Cell
Curb weight of 3,610#
Black Book Build Provenance & History
Assigned Chassis Number

Interesting to note that many of the above characteristics that we both listed for the 2000 Cobra R can also be seen in the 2015 to 2018 GT350R Base R Model with the curb weight of both models being within ~10# of each other.:wink:

Based on all of the above items which includes a low build number of just 300 cars I suggest that anyone that can find a low mileage, great condition 2000 Cobra R which comes with a lot of provenance for less than $75,000 in todays market place I suggest that is a terrific deal.

Thanks again for posting as this car brings back a lot of terrific memories for me! :like::like:
ITs just too bad they won't be on the road. They will be in some richy-riches' garage under plastic.
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dom418

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I have followed these cars very closely and almost bought one back in 2000 but the dealership in Augusta, Georgia wanted $75,000 for their car which was ~$20,000 over MSRP at the time therefore I passed.

Been very fortunate to have driven these cool cars and in fact a friend of mine who bought a 2000 Cobra R brand new out of Florida back in the day and never received his "Black Book" and in fact he did not even know that they existed until I brought it to his attention during a get together when viewing his car collection.

After many discussions this individual asked for my help in order to hopefully locate his Black Book which was a long shot to say the least as he had already owned his Cobra R some 17 years therefore the chances were very slim in order to locate.

I called an individual that I knew at FP (2017) after which time he also suggested that it was a long shot to locate this important provenance as SVT, FR and FP had moved at least 4 times since the launch and build of the 2000 Cobra R in Dearborn but said that he would do his best.

Long story short it was pretty much a miracle that my friend at FP was able to locate the Black Book after 2 weeks of looking as he found it sitting in a dusty old box in the back room as it had been shuffled from one location to another after the numerous moves all those years.

Never say never when it comes situations such as this and the same for the selling price for this car.

As mentioned I follow these cars very closely as a 2,500 mile example sold just 2 months ago for $98,000 therefore this price is not out of line based on the low miles, condition and provenance and no question that these 2 seat and spartan Mustang R models are on the move in terms of pricing.

:wink:
if you look at the history of this car on BAT I would say with exception of the last 2 auctions, these cars were selling in the $60,000 range. In fact as recently as March. Not quite convinced these will trading hands at the $100,000 mark as a norm. Just my opinion though
 

DrumReaper

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Agreed and great point with respect to doubling the MSRP for this car.

In addition to your detailed description on the 2000 Cobra R I particulary like some additional items that John Colleti and his SVT of engineers added or deleted from this very cool car.

AC delete
Radio delete
Sound deadener delete
Borla side exhaust exiting in front of the rear wheels
Front brake cooling ducts
Independent rear end
21 Gallon Fuel Cell
Curb weight of 3,610#
Black Book Build Provenance & History
Assigned Chassis Number

Interesting to note that many of the above characteristics that we both listed for the 2000 Cobra R can also be seen in the 2015 to 2018 GT350R Base R Model with the curb weight of both models being within ~10# of each other.:wink:

Based on all of the above items which includes a low build number of just 300 cars I suggest that anyone that can find a low mileage, great condition 2000 Cobra R which comes with a lot of provenance for less than $75,000 in todays market place I suggest that is a terrific deal.

Thanks again for posting as this car brings back a lot of terrific memories for me! :like::like:
In relation to the 18 Base R, the 12 LS302 and the 2000R... exhaust-wise, which sounds the best to you?

I never heard the modular 5.4L in those 2000R’s but assume with the side-exhaust, it had to sound wonderful.
 

DrumReaper

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if you look at the history of this car on BAT I would say with exception of the last 2 auctions, these cars were selling in the $60,000 range. In fact as recently as March. Not quite convinced these will trading hands at the $100,000 mark as a norm. Just my opinion though
Does it really matter?.. and if they do get to high 5, low 6 figures, what’s wrong with that?... isn’t that great news for potential R value in the future?

20 years to double an MSRP of a domestic car... how many domestics can you name that have done that since 2000?

Besides, even amongst Mustangs, these 2000R’s will retain a level and uniqueness that no other Mustang will attain due to the 5.4L and the many deletions, @PP0001 noted above, alone.

Couple that with crazy-stupid 2012-14 GT500 (another 5.4L) and you have some serious values in the Mustang world.

It’s a great time to be a Mustang fan!
 

PP0001

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if you look at the history of this car on BAT I would say with exception of the last 2 auctions, these cars were selling in the $60,000 range. In fact as recently as March. Not quite convinced these will trading hands at the $100,000 mark as a norm. Just my opinion though
Dom, with all due respect what does the past selling price/history for the 2000 Cobra R have to do with today's present market place for any Limited Edition High Performance Mustang which we all know is on fire?

We both know that the very limited production numbers for the 2000 Cobra R are really not that much different from the 2020 GT350 HEP R limited production numbers therefore suggest that both models are somewhat equally rare from a total volume standpoint.

With that being the case I find it interesting that you could sell your 2020 HEP R for ~25% more than Ford's suggested MSRP after owning it for only ~2 months and here you are questioning someone selling a 2000 Cobra R for ~100% over MSRP that is a Limited Production 2 seat R Model Mustang that was produced some 21 years ago!

Just as the 3 GT350R models that you presently own have increased in value in recent times I wonder why you would question the increased value of the 2000 Cobra R during that same timeline?

Certainly makes complete sense to me unless I am missing something?

:sunglasses:
 

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dom418

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Dom, with all due respect what does the past selling price/history for the 2000 Cobra R have to do with today's present market place for any Limited Edition High Performance Mustang which we all know is on fire?

We both know that the very limited production numbers for the 2000 Cobra R are really not that much different from the 2020 GT350 HEP R limited production numbers therefore suggest that both models are somewhat equally rare from a total volume standpoint.

With that being the case I find it interesting that you could sell your 2020 HEP R for ~25% more than Ford's suggested MSRP after owning it for only ~2 months and here you are questioning someone selling a 2000 Cobra R for ~100% over MSRP that is a Limited Production 2 seat R Model Mustang that was produced some 21 years ago!

Just as the 3 GT350R models that you presently own have increased in value in recent times I wonder why you would question the increased value of the 2000 Cobra R during that same timeline?

Certainly makes complete sense to me unless I am missing something?

:sunglasses:
The 2000Rs never brought the big money is why I am questioning it. Could six figures be the new norm or is it related to the current hyper inflation our economy is in? I think everything is overvalued at the moment, including my Rs. As a die hard blue oval fan, I hope these specialty vehicles continue to do well.
 

PP0001

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In relation to the 18 Base R, the 12 LS302 and the 2000R... exhaust-wise, which sounds the best to you?

I never heard the modular 5.4L in those 2000R’s but assume with the side-exhaust, it had to sound wonderful.
Fred, great question and obviously it is all subjective therefore it comes down to the following:

* Coyote engine makes more low end torque therefore sounds much better early on.
* Quad exhaust on the Boss 302/LS cars sounds outstanding when baffle plates are removed.
* GT350R models come with resonator delete therefore has a big aural sound advantage.
* Boss 302 TracKey helps especially with the exhaust note with the baffle plates removed.
* GT350/R's come with active exhaust therefore a definite advantage over the Boss 302 cars.
* Voodoo engine versus the Coyote engine is completely different in scope and sound.
* Redline on the Coyote engine is 7,500 RPM VS the 8,250 RPM redline on the Voodoo engine.

To answer your question it is all subjective but here is my personal opinion.

#1. Voodoo engine (GT350R) in Sport Mode at ~5,000 RPM and up to the 8,250 RPM redline.
#2. Coyote engine (Boss 302) with side exhaust baffle plates removed from ~3,500 RPM to 7,500 redline is a very close second place.
#3. 2000 Cobra R with Borla exhaust from ~3,500 RPM to 6,500 redline.

Note: I would suggest that the 1965 Shelby GT350 with the HiPo K code engine and side exhaust with very little exhaust restrictions could easily replace the 2000 Cobra R as my #3 choice.

:sunglasses:
 

newmoon

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Dom, with all due respect what does the past selling price/history for the 2000 Cobra R have to do with today's present market place for any Limited Edition High Performance Mustang which we all know is on fire?

We both know that the very limited production numbers for the 2000 Cobra R are really not that much different from the 2020 GT350 HEP R limited production numbers therefore suggest that both models are somewhat equally rare from a total volume standpoint.

With that being the case I find it interesting that you could sell your 2020 HEP R for ~25% more than Ford's suggested MSRP after owning it for only ~2 months and here you are questioning someone selling a 2000 Cobra R for ~100% over MSRP that is a Limited Production 2 seat R Model Mustang that was produced some 21 years ago!

Just as the 3 GT350R models that you presently own have increased in value in recent times I wonder why you would question the increased value of the 2000 Cobra R during that same timeline?

Certainly makes complete sense to me unless I am missing something?

:sunglasses:
The HEP has nothing in common with the 2000R, its just a decal and color package! The 2000 R was a complete package, only offered on that model in extremely low production numbers. Don't be confused.
 

DrumReaper

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The HEP has nothing in common with the 2000R, its just a decal and color package! The 2000 R was a complete package, only offered on that model in extremely low production numbers. Don't be confused.
Hmmm... you’re mistaken, but that’s ok. You may consider it to be as superficial as a stickers package, but you’re wrong.

The color and stripes are a tribute to the heritage of the 65-66 GT350s. No other GT350 can make that claim. In addition to Wimbledon White and Guardsman blue stripes, only attainable in the HEP package, the package comes with its specific chassis registry. Some may argue it’s trivial to claim a special chassis designation, despite sharing the same chassis # with other 2020 GT350Rs, but it’s not merely that... it has its own particular blue chassis plate.

The HEP R’s have the old school R seats, which are, IMHO, less ostentatious than the standard R seats.

Only 280 HEP R’s were created. To my knowledge, every one of them have been claimed, in some fashion or another, whereas, some of the 2000R’s sat at dealerships for cold minute, likely due to some unfortunate reasons like the lack of dealer knowledge of product, and the inability to sell the product for what it really was despite the awesome car it was/is. We’ve seen this occur recently with dealerships selling Base R’s and PP GT350R’s, unaware of the legacy of those cars.

But, regardless of whatever a car is, some will only see certain cars as sticker packages, and that’s ok, as there’s enough of us around to realize and appreciate something for what it really is. Thankfully, Ford did more right by the new Mach 1 to actually give it the ability to be a street car with racing guts rather than the aesthetics packages they have done in the past when transforming a GT into a Mach 1.

Lastly, to my knowledge, the HEP R’s that have resold after original purchase, have commanded a price above that of standard GT350R’s, which tells me that some buyers feel the package is justifiably worth some extra cash.
 
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stanglife

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Let’s see...
2-seat Mustang
Has its own particular aero and wheels
One-off engine
Manual tranny
One-off exhaust
Essentially a streetable racer.

if I hadn’t posted a pic of a 2000R, you may think I was talking about a 2016-2020R. It goes to show the rarer, street-racer Mustangs are doing well with value.

it took the 2000R a little while to make it to “double MSRP”. Not many domestic cars do that in 20 years.
My point was - I don't think that's very good, considering inflation. It has held great value and appreciated slightly but to say it actualyl doubled it's "value" is a little of a stretch.

1623072668266.png
 

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JR369

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Fred, great question and obviously it is all subjective therefore it comes down to the following:

* Coyote engine makes more low end torque therefore sounds much better early on.
* Quad exhaust on the Boss 302/LS cars sounds outstanding when baffle plates are removed.
* GT350R models come with resonator delete therefore has a big aural sound advantage.
* Boss 302 TracKey helps especially with the exhaust note with the baffle plates removed.
* GT350/R's come with active exhaust therefore a definite advantage over the Boss 302 cars.
* Voodoo engine versus the Coyote engine is completely different in scope and sound.
* Redline on the Coyote engine is 7,500 RPM VS the 8,250 RPM redline on the Voodoo engine.

To answer your question it is all subjective but here is my personal opinion.

#1. Voodoo engine (GT350R) in Sport Mode at ~5,000 RPM and up to the 8,250 RPM redline.
#2. Road Runner engine (Boss 302) with side exhaust baffle plates removed from ~3,500 RPM to 7,500 redline is a very close second place.
#3. 2000 Cobra R with Borla exhaust from ~3,500 RPM to 6,500 redline.

Note: I would suggest that the 1965 Shelby GT350 with the HiPo K code engine and side exhaust with very little exhaust restrictions could easily replace the 2000 Cobra R as my #3 choice.

:sunglasses:
The 5.0L "Road Runner" V-8 is the modern version of Ford's HiPo 302. It can be found in the 2012 and 2013 model year Boss 302 Mustang, where 10 lb-ft of torque is compromised for marginally greater horsepower and an outlandish 7,400 rpm redline. A forged steel crankshaft, forged aluminum pistons, and CNC ported cylinder heads are amongst the engine's improvements over Ford's standard 5.0L V-8. It's relatively high compression ratio also contributes to its enhanced performance characteristics. The high revving Boss 302 was rated at 444 horsepower at 7,400 rpm and 380 lb-ft of torque at 4,500 rpm.

The two engines are NOT the same but only similar. IE, the one in the GT (Coyote) and the one in the boss (Road Runner) are TWO different animals based of the same 302 base engine platform.
 

CANTWN4LSN

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To echo the alternate perspective, I guess I'm not quite sure of the value of this thread other than to make people feel good. Given the variables leading to this used car price inflation lately, there is nothing intrinsic to these automobiles accounting for it as percentage wise they are likely up only what other vehicles are. As an example my 3500HD Silverado was worth more on a trade for a new one than I paid two years ago new.
Rarer vehicles are worth more than non-rare, so in times of inflation they go up more and seem like a good investment but unless you sell, pocket the money, and wait for a downturn to repurchase it seems like you're just stroking your ego on what a great buy you made. In reality from an investment standpoint you couldn't have predicted in 2016 that the events leading to this massive influx of federal money and shortage of parts from Covid would make your car such a wise purchase in retrospect.
In a similar vein, if we were in a deflationary cycle, would you all be lamenting the miserable cars produced that couldn't hold their value?
Sometimes wealth is merely an illusion, as in 2008.
 

Wildcardfox

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Hmmm... you’re mistaken, but that’s ok. You may consider it to be as superficial as a stickers package, but you’re wrong.

The color and stripes are a tribute to the heritage of the 65-66 GT350s. No other GT350 can make that claim. In addition to Wimbledon White and Guardsman blue stripes, only attainable in the HEP package, the package comes with its specific chassis registry. Some may argue it’s trivial to claim a special chassis designation, despite sharing the same chassis # with other 2020 GT350Rs, but it’s not merely that... it has its own particular blue chassis plate.

The HEP R’s have the old school R seats, which are, IMHO, less ostentatious than the standard R seats.

Only 280 HEP R’s were created. To my knowledge, every one of them have been claimed, in some fashion or another, whereas, some of the 2000R’s sat at dealerships for cold minute, likely due to some unfortunate reasons like the lack of dealer knowledge of product, and the inability to sell the product for what it really was despite the awesome car it was/is. We’ve seen this occur recently with dealerships selling Base R’s and PP GT350R’s, unaware of the legacy of those cars.

But, regardless of whatever a car is, some will only see certain cars as sticker packages, and that’s ok, as there’s enough of us around to realize and appreciate something for what it really is. Thankfully, Ford did more right by the new Mach 1 to actually give it the ability to be a street car with racing guts rather than the aesthetics packages they have done in the past when transforming a GT into a Mach 1.

Lastly, to my knowledge, the HEP R’s that have resold after original purchase, have commanded a price above that of standard GT350R’s, which tells me that some buyers feel the package is justifiably worth some extra cash.
I don’t remember 2000 Cobra R’s sitting at dealerships. You had to have a valid racing license in order to buy one new just like in 1995—Ford’s early attempt to stop people buying them and storing them away like the 1993 Cobra R. And from my memory, they were snapped up pretty quick.

Didn’t work obviously as many resold them to collectors anyways.

I have a good friend who had one, he bought it from a guy who wanted to sell it so he could buy a GT350R
 

nmp1

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I don’t remember 2000 Cobra R’s sitting at dealerships. You had to have a valid racing license in order to buy one new just like in 1995—Ford’s early attempt to stop people buying them and storing them away like the 1993 Cobra R. And from my memory, they were snapped up pretty quick.

Didn’t work obviously as many resold them to collectors anyways.

I have a good friend who had one, he bought it from a guy who wanted to sell it so he could buy a GT350R
I believe by 2000 ford had given up on making you have a race license. I bought mine from the original owner and im pretty sure he didnt.

I was at the Ford nationals last weekend and there was a race red GT350R next to a 2000R and that was the first time I ever saw them next to each other. The 350R makes the 2000R look dated.
 

PP0001

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The HEP has nothing in common with the 2000R, its just a decal and color package! The 2000 R was a complete package, only offered on that model in extremely low production numbers. Don't be confused.
Agreed and not sure where I compared one model to the other other and only made mention of the similar production numbers (280 vs 300) for both of the 2 seat models from 2000 and 2020.

Other than that I appreciate the history lesson as I get confused quite easily!

:wink:
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