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Who else is Manual or Bust?

Rothgray

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Yes, there are quite a few forces in industry and government that seem to be moving towards getting rid of everything enjoyable that has to do with driving.

Heck, for some people completely getting rid of gasoline engines is a given! They even think cows need to be eliminated. Of course those people want to control every aspect of our lives. Some of them won't be happy until everyone lives in tiny boxes and uses mass or automated transportation.
I personally, do not feel that is the movement behind getting rid of manuals. It's just time for tech to take over. From a numbers stand point, a manual transmission does not win in any category against the DCT. Only in subjectivity, if that is what someone enjoys.
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Hack

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I personally, do not feel that is the movement behind getting rid of manuals. It's just time for tech to take over. From a numbers stand point, a manual transmission does not win in any category against the DCT. Only in subjectivity, if that is what someone enjoys.
I agree that the only reasons to buy a manual are subjective and that it doesn't perform as well as any kind of automatic transmission. I also agree that the liberal movement isn't behind manuals going away. It's just that fewer people want manual transmissions. Many would rather not shift manually.

The only reasons I own a sporty car are subjective, though. If I were being objective with my car buying decisions I would have a 10 year old Focus or something.

IMO it's definitely not time for tech to take over, though. I might as well ride a bus if tech takes over.
 

Rothgray

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I agree that the only reasons to buy a manual are subjective and that it doesn't perform as well as any kind of automatic transmission. I also agree that the liberal movement isn't behind manuals going away. It's just that fewer people want manual transmissions. Many would rather not shift manually.

The only reasons I own a sporty car are subjective, though. If I were being objective with my car buying decisions I would have a 10 year old Focus or something.

IMO it's definitely not time for tech to take over, though. I might as well ride a bus if tech takes over.
I have plenty enjoyment, taking my Lamborghini around the track and manually shifting the DCT.
 

Norm Peterson

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We may all be on different sides of what we prefer, manual, auto, dct etc.

I feel we all can agree though, the manual is going to the way of extinction, if you look at industry trends.
Probably true.

But by the tone of some of the responses in this and other threads it seems like some people can hardly wait for that to happen.


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Norm Peterson

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I have plenty enjoyment, taking my Lamborghini around the track and manually shifting the DCT.
How is it in street driving? I'm talking manual-command only, no slacking back to full automatic allowed. Where you aren't driving it so hard that skipping a gear here and there makes sense, and where a 100ms shift time is completely irrelevant. Seriously curious here even though Lamborghinis have always been well beyond any semblance of financial sanity for me.


Norm
 

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I have plenty enjoyment, taking my Lamborghini around the track and manually shifting the DCT.
Whats more enjoyable, to drive it in full auto mode or to manually use the paddles?
 

Norm Peterson

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It's just time for tech to take over.
Why do you think this? Is there something so basically wrong with driving a car with a conventional MT that there's an overriding reason for eliminating it?


From a numbers stand point, a manual transmission does not win in any category against the DCT. Only in subjectivity, if that is what someone enjoys.
As Hack has already noted once you take subjectivity as a reason for automotive purchase decisions, we might as well be consigned to driving 4 cylinder automatic transmission Camrys. I guess that'd mean you'd have to say goodbye to your subjective preference for DCTs as well . . . maybe reflect on that a bit.


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Rothgray

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How is it in street driving? I'm talking manual-command only, no slacking back to full automatic allowed. Where you aren't driving it so hard that skipping a gear here and there makes sense, and where a 100ms shift time is completely irrelevant. Seriously curious here even though Lamborghinis have always been well beyond any semblance of financial sanity for me.


Norm
Well, the LDF DCT in the Huracan has went fairly unchanged between models. It's what propelled the Huracan Performante, to take the Ring crown when it set its time when it did. I do not know the exact figures (I've heard it's around 50-60ms), but I do know the LDF DCT is faster than the Tremec unit Ford will be using in the GT500. It's also faster than the Getrag, they use in the Ford GT. Between the modes of Strada, Sport, and Corsa, I only notice the DCT shift times are a bit faster in Corsa (race) mode. As when you let it take control of itself in the other two modes, it runs the shifts all of the way to the limiter, and slightly past it, which I feel causes a slight delay in shifts (but ever so lightly), where in Corsa, most owners typically nail the shifts right before the limiter.

If I'm just driving around town, I honestly feel little need to manually shift, I just let the car take over, and do it's thing. I live in the outer suburbs, so I have a lot of back roads though, that I have fun on, with a flip of a switch. I also have a really nice road course nearby.

As far as drag racing, I've gotten the same 1/4 mi times letting it shift on it's own, vs. me shifting. My best was a 10.59, showroom stock. My road course times are slightly better manually shifting.

As far as a Huracan being out of your financial reach? Well, I don't know your background or finances. I'd say the minimum income, with your D to I ratios in check, should be around $250,000/yr to consider buying one of these cars, but hey, everyone has a different financial situation.

The easy way to buy these though, is buy them 1-2 years used, they take a nasty depreciation dive of about 25-30%, then finance it for 144 months, at a decent interest rate of around 3-5%. Then sell it within about 24 months. You won't lose much money or any at all, and basically you drove around a Lambo, for about the same out of pocket as a BMW 3 Series Lease, factoring in the interest payments. Thats how a lot of guys do it, when they have lesser incomes, around $250k.
 

Rothgray

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Whats more enjoyable, to drive it in full auto mode or to manually use the paddles?
The car pretty much performs similarly in either shift method, when you're in Strada, and Sport. Corsa, its a different beast, and you manually shift it there.

If you set launch control, it will do super aggressive automated shifts in Corsa, most say thats the best way to get the best drag time. The 1 to 2 shift after a launch is so quick, it's tough to hit manually.
 

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If I'm just driving around town, I honestly feel little need to manually shift, I just let the car take over, and do it's thing. I live in the outer suburbs, so I have a lot of back roads though, that I have fun on, with a flip of a switch. I also have a really nice road course nearby.
So basically, you're more than willing to hand the business of shifting off to a transmission control module . . . which is something I guess I'm just hardwired to not accept.


As far as a Huracan being out of your financial reach? Well, I don't know your background or finances. I'd say the minimum income, with your D to I ratios in check, should be around $250,000/yr to consider buying one of these cars, but hey, everyone has a different financial situation.
Like I said, well outside financial sanity. Given that $250k figure, on average by closer to a factor of two than 1.5 . . . or five. That's with respect to the last few years when I was still working and a couple of things fell into place, BTW. These days the income is from things like Social Security and Minimum Required Distributions and the factor is . . . well, let's just say it's more than two and leave it at that. Reasonably comfortable, far from luxurious.


Norm
 

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Well, the LDF DCT in the Huracan has went fairly unchanged between models. It's what propelled the Huracan Performante, to take the Ring crown when it set its time when it did. I do not know the exact figures (I've heard it's around 50-60ms), but I do know the LDF DCT is faster than the Tremec unit Ford will be using in the GT500. It's also faster than the Getrag, they use in the Ford GT. Between the modes of Strada, Sport, and Corsa, I only notice the DCT shift times are a bit faster in Corsa (race) mode. As when you let it take control of itself in the other two modes, it runs the shifts all of the way to the limiter, and slightly past it, which I feel causes a slight delay in shifts (but ever so lightly), where in Corsa, most owners typically nail the shifts right before the limiter.

If I'm just driving around town, I honestly feel little need to manually shift, I just let the car take over, and do it's thing. I live in the outer suburbs, so I have a lot of back roads though, that I have fun on, with a flip of a switch. I also have a really nice road course nearby.

As far as drag racing, I've gotten the same 1/4 mi times letting it shift on it's own, vs. me shifting. My best was a 10.59, showroom stock. My road course times are slightly better manually shifting.

As far as a Huracan being out of your financial reach? Well, I don't know your background or finances. I'd say the minimum income, with your D to I ratios in check, should be around $250,000/yr to consider buying one of these cars, but hey, everyone has a different financial situation.

The easy way to buy these though, is buy them 1-2 years used, they take a nasty depreciation dive of about 25-30%, then finance it for 144 months, at a decent interest rate of around 3-5%. Then sell it within about 24 months. You won't lose much money or any at all, and basically you drove around a Lambo, for about the same out of pocket as a BMW 3 Series Lease, factoring in the interest payments. Thats how a lot of guys do it, when they have lesser incomes, around $250k.
Thank you, I really enjoyed this! Lambo/Ferrari never on my radar but I understand why guys want them. I typically will not purchase a vehicle if I can't pay cash or pay it off in 3 years. Even though I could afford a new GT 500 I would wait a year or two and buy a low mileage used one. With a manual option not yet offered I doubt one will ever make it into my garage. With that said your reply to this post and mine really gave me a little insight on the benifits a DCT could offer. Hopefully the one put in the GT 500 will not disappoint.
 

Rothgray

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Thank you, I really enjoyed this! Lambo/Ferrari never on my radar but I understand why guys want them. I typically will not purchase a vehicle if I can't pay cash or pay it off in 3 years. Even though I could afford a new GT 500 I would wait a year or two and buy a low mileage used one. With a manual option not yet offered I doubt one will ever make it into my garage. With that said your reply to this post and mine really gave me a little insight on the benifits a DCT could offer. Hopefully the one put in the GT 500 will not disappoint.
I am sure it’ll be a good implementation. I really feel the transmission is going to allow the engine and suspension really come alive.
 

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With a auto I wouldn't get to do this!

Why are you holding onto the shifter between shifts? Maybe the 500 is for you. Who taught you to drive a manual?
 

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Why are you holding onto the shifter between shifts? Maybe the 500 is for you. Who taught you to drive a manual?
He is also driving on the wrong side of the road
 
 




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