Any dyno graphs with Comp cr Stg 3 cams?

[1320']

I don't see how you guys think a 40whp gain is low for a set of cams compared to stock. cam installs are relatively easy on a timing chain motor and for the cost I think it's a huge benefit. Considering these coyotes love to rev the slight "loss" down low would be negligible on a drag strip or road course. I still think this is a much better bang for buck then a header swap. Also I may look into headers with stock axle backs as far as sound is concerned. My main point was for the price I don't see the need for headers. To be honest if a cam and intake car with a tune can make 450whp on 93, ide be happy. that's two grand invested (if you can install and tune the car yourself) I already have hp tuners for my vette so I'm not including the initial 500 cost of tuning, since all mods need tuning. I think people get caught up in "mod paths" to be honest 850 bucks for just the intake cams from l and m seem like a great increase for money invested

A lot of people see the huge gains that OHV motors like the LS series make from cam swaps (and head swaps) which can sometimes be as high as 50 WHP from cam only. In the LS world HCI combos can easily make 75 WHP or more from stock. OHC motors, as the mod family have shown across their various generations, do respond okay to a well designed cam and tune combo, but not the 25% gains that LS motors have become famous for.

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[16MustangVet]

if you are happy making 30-40 great if i was only making 30-40 when others are making 50, 60 70 80 90 hp gains id be pissed just saying.

 

[1320']

if you are happy making 30-40 great if i was only making 30-40 when others are making 50, 60 70 80 90 hp gains id be pissed just saying.

Okay so another thing you need to consider is that the cams in the 2015+ 5.0's are already basically what has been called the "Baby Cobra Jet" cams, IE very similar to the 2012/2013 Boss 302 cams. You're not going from a dramatically under-cammed motor to a proper performance cam like a lot of other engines do.

I feel like maybe you don't fully appreciate the starting point that a lot of these motors were at in terms of their stock equipment specifications. Hell just putting a tune on a 2015 5.0 puts you at around 465 crank HP (estimated from WHP levels) and exhaust/intake combinations when properly tuned make nearly 500 crank HP. Let's just say you're looking for a gain of 60 HP from cams..that means you're looking at 550-560 crank HP out of 5 liters and maintaining great street manners, on pump gas, on stock compression, and not being an all-out race motor?
These engines only have 5.0 liters to work with, at some point they're going to run out of N/A power since they don't have the displacement of the 6.2L+motors the competition is running.

 

[16MustangVet]

have you read the svtperformance link?

undercammed? s550 gained what 20 hp over the older coyote in the s197 still far less than the cammed gains people are getting. So does the tune suck? there is alot more to this puzzle that just cams.

ive heard of tuners telling people not to do cams thats insane that sounds to me like some tuners dont know how to tune the cams thus the crappy 30-40hp gains.

I dont appreciate the s550 engine? umm far from it im questioning why we dont see more NA builds the technology and parts availability to do so is there.

I think with ported heads and better spec'd cams 600 hp na should be the norm. A few have reached it so it is possible. Quite honestly if the comps only gain 30-40 then id be looking for custom spec cams from L&M or JPC ect.ect.

 

[1320']

have you read the svtperformance link?

undercammed? s550 gained what 20 hp over the older coyote in the s197 still far less than the cammed gains people are getting. So does the tune suck? there is alot more to this puzzle that just cams.

ive heard of tuners telling people not to do cams thats insane that sounds to me like some tuners dont know how to tune the cams thus the crappy 30-40hp gains.

I dont appreciate the s550 engine? umm far from it im questioning why we dont see more NA builds the technology and parts availability to do so is there.

I think with ported heads and better spec'd cams 600 hp na should be the norm. A few have reached it so it is possible. Quite honestly if the comps only gain 30-40 then id be looking for custom spec cams from L&M or JPC ect.ect.

I'm a member at SVT, I saw the post before it was linked here.

600 HP N/A isn't realistic on pump gas with a street engine..that's nearly 550 WHP.
Now you could hit that on a 5.2L block with GT350 heads, with big cams, running a completely free flowing exhaust with a CJ intake manifold/tubes, 12.5:1 compression spinning to 8,000 on 100+ octane race fuel. At that point you're basically running an open track race motor in a street car. It would also cost around $14,000 when all is said and done. You then will have to look at beefing up the rest of the car to match.

In a street car, if you run FTW Purple, big cams, 8,000 RPM on a CJ intake/intake tube, catless exhaust with LT's on port and polished heads? You might hit 505-510 WHP, which is around 550 crank.

 

[16MustangVet]

well id run on e85 so ill agee on that sean wrights black laguna seca boss built by jpc with custom jpc spec cams is barely just barely under 600 on e85 and STOCK compression..............

 

[ZanarkO]

well it's entirely possible that these tuners don't know how to fully exploit these cams just yet, or more realistically there has not been ANY dyno graphs from a s550 showing the gains from a back to back comparison. Honestly there should be many more cam options for the coyote motors I just believe these motors take so well to boost companies don't see the point. However I think you guys maybe missing the point here.Given cost and the amount of other parts (gt350 intake, headers, etc) for the gains it just makes sense to do cams. Perhaps I'll be the guinea pig. Once I put more miles on my car maybe I'll do cams on a completely stock car and see what happens

 

[16MustangVet]

Entirely agree!! there needs to be 1 step at a time proven results but most people do cams and intake and exhaust and fuel ect ect ect mods all at once. It would be really really nice to know what works 1 step at a time.

I feel like the comp cams with stock intake would show better low and mid range tq and hp.

For the money id like to see what a cams and headers engine produced for gains. Being conservative those gains should be worth about 30hp each. I think that would be better route than doing a gt350 intake.

 

[Lonmon]

You need the GT350 intake, or CJ to take advantage of what the cams have to offer. It has been shown over and over that the stock manifold drops off big time after 6600 rpm. Those cams should also shine in the 6-8k rpm spot. You will definitely not see the same gains on the stock mani. The headers I have to agree about. Although you can get a good set of headers for $600-800. You do not NEED to spend $1400 on a set of headers. That being said, I made 450whp on the stock headers with Mak cat deletes, the GT350 mani, and e85.

 

[16MustangVet]

You need the GT350 intake, or CJ to take advantage of what the cams have to offer. It has been shown over and over that the stock manifold drops off big time after 6600 rpm. Those cams should also shine in the 6-8k rpm spot. You will definitely not see the same gains on the stock mani. The headers I have to agree about. Although you can get a good set of headers for $600-800. You do not NEED to spend $1400 on a set of headers. That being said, I made 450whp on the stock headers with Mak cat deletes, the GT350 mani, and e85.

depends. if you didnt want to drag race the headers and cams would be awesome for low end and still keep the charge motion plates that is only reason i mentioned those 2 combined.

 

[ZanarkO]

You need the GT350 intake, or CJ to take advantage of what the cams have to offer. It has been shown over and over that the stock manifold drops off big time after 6600 rpm. Those cams should also shine in the 6-8k rpm spot. You will definitely not see the same gains on the stock mani. The headers I have to agree about. Although you can get a good set of headers for $600-800. You do not NEED to spend $1400 on a set of headers. That being said, I made 450whp on the stock headers with Mak cat deletes, the GT350 mani, and e85.

I don't really agree with that, honestly I think the factory intake should be fine for those cams. yes there would be a gain however the gt350 manifold moves the powerband more then it makes power. it's more of a design difference then actual volume or a large increase in volumetric effeciency . I still don't think tuners have fully exploited the benefits of variable cam and cam gear timing on the coyote.I have access to a dyno and I'll be doing the cam swap eventually so we can see some actual dyno plots. The cams by themselves should gain quite abit of power on a stock car with a free flowing intake. I think 450whp is possible with a simple intake and cams and a tune on stock exhaust.

 

[ZanarkO]

it least that is my goal lol

 

[Terminator2]

I don't really agree with that, honestly I think the factory intake should be fine for those cams. yes there would be a gain however the gt350 manifold moves the powerband more then it makes power. it's more of a design difference then actual volume or a large increase in volumetric effeciency . I still don't think tuners have fully exploited the benefits of variable cam and cam gear timing on the coyote.I have access to a dyno and I'll be doing the cam swap eventually so we can see some actual dyno plots. The cams by themselves should gain quite abit of power on a stock car with a free flowing intake. I think 450whp is possible with a simple intake and cams and a tune on stock exhaust.

http://www.stangtv.com/tech-stories...old-shootout-gt-gt350-boss-302-and-cobra-jet/

Look at the power difference with the CJ vs the stock manifold on this cammed coyote. 40whp peak to peak but over 50whp up top which is huge. Bigger gains than many see with the cams themselves.

 

[armykyle1 [HACKED ACCOUNT]

https://www.lmengines.com/products/camshafts/l-m-intake-only-5-0l-coyote-camshaft-2015.html whenever i do the front of my motor later this year I'm seriously considering these cams there intake only though they do provide a dyno 413/365 stock. 448/382 intake cams installed.

Is this an engine dyno? Wheel power? What mods were done to the car? Looks like headers and CAI.

 

[16MustangVet]

http://www.stangtv.com/tech-stories...old-shootout-gt-gt350-boss-302-and-cobra-jet/

Look at the power difference with the CJ vs the stock manifold on this cammed coyote. 40whp peak to peak but over 50whp up top which is huge. Bigger gains than many see with the cams themselves.

That article says exactly what i suspected. the stock manifold produces best average tq out of the 4

GT
491.1 hp at 6,900 rpm
429.2 lb-ft at 5,400 rpm
Average Power: 373 hp, 376 lb-ft – 2,800-7,500 rpm

BOSS 302
510.4 hp at 7,600 rpm
398.4 lb-ft 5,400 rpm
Average Power: 376 hp, 361 lb-ft – 3,000-7,800 rpm
+/- to GT manifold: +19.3 hp, -30.8 lb-ft

Cobra Jet
531.2 hp at 7,600 rpm
408.6 lb-ft at 5,400 rpm
Average Power: 386 hp, 370 lb-ft – 3,000-7,800 rpm
+/- to GT manifold: +40.1 hp, -20.6 lb-ft

GT350
515.8 hp 7,500 rpm
402.6 hp 6,100 rpm
Average Power: 381 hp, 365 lb-ft – 3,000-7,800 rpm
+/- to GT manifold: +24.7 hp, -26.6 lb-ft

For a daily driver ill take the torque. Im not so sure the other intakes are even worth the money unless you really need the hp and will be using the car much screaming over 7500 rpm.

PS its 40 hp more up top spinning 700 more rpm but the low end tq loss is 20 lb-ft too.

Looks to me like the comp s3 cams and stock intake is best balance out of the 4 combos here.

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