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[spdbydesign]

If you can be content with roughly 800whp on the factory fuel system with 1000cc Injectors + BAP running race gas for race days, you can build a solid 9 sec factory motor, 6R80 Auto car for relatively cheap.

The next bump up the food chain will require a better fuel system to run E85, which is about $5K. (I prefer the ID1300 Injectors w/ Fore Innovations Triple Pump Basket.)

If you're willing to gamble the stock motor, 900whp is possible on the factory 6R80.

Beyond that, expect to build the trans and budget for an engine build.

IMO, 900whp is the MAX you should target on the factory motor. In doing so, you need to be financially prepared for the motor letting loose, as you're gambling at that level.

We've been fortunate pushing far more HP than that, but we know the risks and are willing to accept them...

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[sigintel]

What Mustang_guy said!
He had alot more in the 14 then where hes at on the current one.
Point being that when you are learning it cost more. But with knowledge and risk management you can go farther on less money.

Take the Fore costs for business case example:
A single pump with voltage boosted can support how many horsepower?
Whipple is saying 800 ish stock pump w voltage booster and 72# injectors?
Somebody correct me as thats foggy memory.
So you could go twin 465 with voltage boost and support 1600? no?
So stock pump plus a 465 and 2 channel Volt boost. That could be engineered down in cost if there are volume orders. Voltage boosters are probably reference design simple switchers from TI with high power pass elements.
Would E85 require 3 pumps and voltage boost to hit 1500ish?
I recall thinkn I need twins w bap to E85 850 w Whipple?
What does the cost / performance map look like for the fuel system?
Can you use both stock injectors and secondaries to avoid leaving already paid for parts on the shelf?
Add the secondary injector porting to head work if it pays for itself?
Just saying that a kit that is a level up from stock motor doesnt have to be cheap, just cost effective. Yes, you will spend $100k up front first pass. Youll be able to build fast arse car for much less after that.
I once read a thread on YellerBullt where there was an awesome discussion on how to hit 1000hp on LS motor for $5-$7k. Thread was like a who who of insane knowledge. Quarter million worth of experience in there. Lol.
Anyone know where to find that for 15-16 coyote motor?

 

[spdbydesign]

A single pump with voltage boosted can support how many horsepower?
Whipple is saying 800 ish stock pump w voltage booster and 72# injectors?
So you could go twin 465 with voltage boost and support 1600? no?
So stock pump plus a 465 and 2 channel Volt boost. That could be engineered down in cost if there are volume orders.
Would E85 require 3 pumps and voltage boost to hit 1500ish?
I recall thinkn I need twins w bap to E85 850 w Whipple?
What does the cost / performance map look like for the fuel system?
Can you use both stock injectors and secondaries to avoid leaving already paid for parts on the shelf?
Add the secondary injector porting to head work if it pays for itself?
Just saying that a kit that is a level up from stock motor doesnt have to be cheap, just cost effective. Yes, you will spend $100k up front first pass. Youll be able to build fast arse car for much less after that.
I once read a thread on YellerBullt where there was an awesome discussion on how to hit 1000hp on LS motor for $5-$7k. Thread was like a who who of insane knowledge. Quarter million worth of experience in there. Lol.
Anyone know where to find that for 15-16 coyote motor?

Making HP is really not the hard part. With Forced Induction, especially turbos, the sleeved Coyote blocks seem relatively solid up to 1500whp.

Over that, you're looking at partial or fully filled (concrete) blocks, which I wouldn't advise for the street driven car.

Fuel system wise, I'm a firm believer in the old adage, "Keep it simple stupid."

With up to 2150cc drop-in injectors readily available, I don't see the need for secondary injection. (Outside of perhaps Methanol injection for those that desire to run pump gas.)

Let's get realistic here, this is a RWD car. Traction will be your biggest issue when pushing 4 digit power on the street. (If that's your goal.)

This is a local 7 second, 1300whp JPC Built Mustang Boss 302 on the streets of Oklahoma City, battling it out with a local 1250whp GTR and a 1800whp TT Gallardo. It's one thing to put power down on a prepped drag strip, it's a whole another thing to do it on the street.

[ame]

You're never going to build a 1K FI Coyote for $7K, put down the bong and pass it to someone else ;)

If you want to reliably push 4 digit power, you need a sleeved block. That is NEVER, and I repeat NEVER, going to be a cheap job.

There are only a handful of engine shops that sleeve Coyote blocks.....and an even smaller number I'd consider reputable. (Can count on one hand.)

In regards to the factory fuel pump + BAP, we were MAXED out at 854whp on a DynoJet, forcing us to back it down to around 800whp to keep things safe.

As I've said above, if you can be satisfied with 800whp, you can get there for relatively cheap in the overall scheme of things on the factory engine with just an Injector/BAP + Forced Induction upgrade.

https://flic.kr/p/ySXHNT https://www.flickr.com/photos/105107815@N04/

 

[mustang_guy]

Making HP is really not the hard part. With Forced Induction, especially turbos, the sleeved Coyote blocks seem relatively solid up to 1500whp.

Over that, you're looking at partial or fully filled (concrete) blocks, which I wouldn't advise for the street driven car.

Fuel system wise, I'm a firm believer in the old adage, "Keep it simple stupid."

With up to 2150cc drop-in injectors readily available, I don't see the need for secondary injection. (Outside of perhaps Methanol injection for those that desire to run pump gas.)

Let's get realistic here, this is a RWD car. Traction will be your biggest issue when pushing 4 digit power on the street. (If that's your goal.)

This is a local 7 second, 1300whp JPC Built Mustang Boss 302 on the streets of Oklahoma City, battling it out with a local 1250whp GTR and a 1800whp TT Gallardo. It's one thing to put power down on a prepped drag strip, it's a whole another thing to do it on the street.



You're never going to build a 1K FI Coyote for $7K, put down the bong and pass it to someone else ;)

If you want to reliably push 4 digit power, you need a sleeved block. That is NEVER, and I repeat NEVER, going to be a cheap job.

There are only a handful of engine shops that sleeve Coyote blocks.....and an even smaller number I'd consider reputable. (Can count on one hand.)

In regards to the factory fuel pump + BAP, we were MAXED out at 854whp on a DynoJet, forcing us to back it down to around 800whp to keep things safe.

As I've said above, if you can be satisfied with 800whp, you can get there for relatively cheap in the overall scheme of things on the factory engine with just an Injector/BAP + Forced Induction upgrade.

https://flic.kr/p/ySXHNT https://www.flickr.com/photos/105107815@N04/

Pretty sure ive seen hin at nmra a couple times. Nice guy from what i recall. He needs to spin those hard a few times to heat those up around 50 before doing races like that. Thats what we did in the supra groups for races like that. :lol: i do agree putting it down on the street can be difficult after 1000whp with rwd. It can be done though.


Anyways, Head work lets get more interest!

 

[spdbydesign]

Pretty sure ive seen hin at nmra a couple times. Nice guy from what i recall. He needs to spin those hard a few times to heat those up around 50 before doing races like that. Thats what we did in the supra groups for races like that. :lol: i do agree putting it down on the street can be difficult after 1000whp with rwd. It can be done though.


Anyways, Head work lets get more interest!

He's a super nice guy. Car is for sale locally, but I believe he has a pending buyer. Will be interesting to see what he does next.

Here was his 7.98 pass. Car has EXTENSIVE weight reduction mods, carbon fiber front end, etc. Cool car, but a trailer queen, and I'm guessing that got old fast. (It would for me with no A/C!)

It's wicked though, 7's is a different league of car.

[ame]

 

[FATHERFORD]

So I can comment on a lot in this thread.

I have a Twin 67mm 14 mustang GT, that is putting down right at 1300rwhp.

I have a Twin 62mm 15 mustang GT, that is putting down over 1100rwhp.


On the porting of heads:

On my 14 I had my heads cnc'd, larger valves, etc. On my 15 I left stock heads. The builder/tuner said I didn't need to cnc my heads, there wouldn't be a power difference from his experience. I went ahead and went "all the way" as I felt why not on the 14. With the results I have seen with my cars, I tend to agree. I'm confident my factory heads my 14 would put out the same power. This MAY be due to the "small" t3 vband of the precision turbos. We both feel that is the "choke" point and the porting of the heads really didn't help anything. Precision is coming out with a new exhaust housings with a higher A/R, so maybe then the ported heads will help?

For a N/A application I can see the ported heads helping. On a blown application I can see the heads helping. On MOST turbo applications, I really don't see the heads helping that much, if at all. There are turbo guys making over 3000hp with less flowing heads(different engines).


As far as cost:
On my 14, I can tell you I have a little over 60k in parts. K-members, all suspension components, two sets of wheels and tires(drag set and driver set), sleeved/built engine, boss intake, fuel system, circle d converter, circle d trans, carbon fiber driveshaft, Moser M9 9", tuning, etc. This is even with hookups!

Now on my 15, I didn't go as wild, and have about 35-40k in parts.

These both were designed to run 8's, and be "daily driveable." The 14 should have the potential of 7's by the end of the year.

As far as hooking...

It's 345's NT05R's don't stand a chance with anything really over 800rwhp from a dig..

These will hook, decently, most of the time.

and just cause I'm pic whoring. The 335's on the back of this hook ok on wastegate.

 

[spdbydesign]

On MOST turbo applications, I really don't see the heads helping that much, if at all.

As far as hooking...

It's 345's NT05R's don't stand a chance with anything really over 800rwhp from a dig..

I think on the factory FI motor it's a 100% waste of cash. (N/A a different story.)

The fast FI S550 GT factory engine cars on this forum have shown the 2015+ heads are solid and capable.

With that said, on a built motor on a max effort car, I think they will show their value.

For me personally, knowing how high we're planning to spin this motor, I want the upgraded valve train for safety.

I dropped a valve in my GTR at 8000 RPM @ TX2K last year, cost me right at $20K to repair the damage. Needless to say, I have learned my lesson with stock heads and 4 digit HP.

In regards to the traction mod, I've tested two different setups now and so far, the new Mickey ET Street R is the tire to have. P305/45R17 is hooking over 1000whp with no problem on the street once warm.

I've found that even in cool fall air, a quick single WOT pull, and they are good to go on my next pass.

 

[mustang_guy]

He's a super nice guy. Car is for sale locally, but I believe he has a pending buyer. Will be interesting to see what he does next.

Here was his 7.98 pass. Car has EXTENSIVE weight reduction mods, carbon fiber front end, etc. Cool car, but a trailer queen, and I'm guessing that got old fast. (It would for me with no A/C!)

It's wicked though, 7's is a different league of car.

Yeah i cant do a trailer queen. If i cant weekend drive my build during great weather or road trip it for a car meet thatd bother me. Maybe thats the part he got tired of. Id have passed on those extra 5 mph for some interior comfort

 

[dcasandman]

Sub'd for education.

 

[spdbydesign]

Id have passed on those extra 5 mph for some interior comfort

I think that sums it up best.

For me, I want my cake & eat it too.

I want an 8 sec GT w/ 100% full leather interior with my heated/air cooled Premium seats. I want A/C in the summer, I want heated seats in the winter.

Yes, I realize I could go faster gutting out the car, swapping to a Glide/TH400, removing the A/C, etc....but then it would be a countdown until I sold it.

I'm much more interested in building a street-able 4 digit car that I can take my wife to dinner in on Friday night.

I'll gladly give up E.T. at the drag strip for comfort the other 99.9% of the time I'm driving the car.

I've been spoiled coming from the R35 GTR community and I'm not willing to take a step down in the amenities department at this point.

 

[FATHERFORD]

I think on the factory FI motor it's a 100% waste of cash. (N/A a different story.)

The fast FI S550 GT factory engine cars on this forum have shown the 2015+ heads are solid and capable.

With that said, on a built motor on a max effort car, I think they will show their value.

For me personally, knowing how high we're planning to spin this motor, I want the upgraded valve train for safety.

I dropped a valve in my GTR at 8000 RPM @ TX2K last year, cost me right at $20K to repair the damage. Needless to say, I have learned my lesson with stock heads and 4 digit HP.

In regards to the traction mod, I've tested two different setups now and so far, the new Mickey ET Street R is the tire to have. P305/45R17 is hooking over 1000whp with no problem on the street once warm.

I've found that even in cool fall air, a quick single WOT pull, and they are good to go on my next pass.

I did upgrade the valves/springs/etc. on both cars. As far as porting I'm not sure it will help on turbo cars. The exhaust housings(on the t3 vband) are just so much a big choking point. Maybe some high end blower cars or n/a cars.

 

[spdbydesign]

As far as porting I'm not sure it will help on turbo cars. The exhaust housings(on the t3 vband) are just so much a big choking point. Maybe some high end blower cars or n/a cars.

I'll report back and see what we find once we get the new motor swapped in. :cheers:

 

[FATHERFORD]

I'll report back and see what we find once we get the new motor swapped in. :cheers:

For sure. We are running 30psi to get that 1300rwhp number on my 14. Precision told us at SEMA the new exhaust housings we should see about 1500 at 30psi and less back pressure. Which makes sense as the guys running t4 exhaust housings with 67mm are getting around 1500rwhp.

 

[mustang_guy]

I think that sums it up best.

For me, I want my cake & eat it too.

I want an 8 sec GT w/ 100% full leather interior with my heated/air cooled Premium seats. I want A/C in the summer, I want heated seats in the winter.

Yes, I realize I could go faster gutting out the car, swapping to a Glide/TH400, removing the A/C, etc....but then it would be a countdown until I sold it.

I'm much more interested in building a street-able 4 digit car that I can take my wife to dinner in on Friday night.

I'll gladly give up E.T. at the drag strip for comfort the other 99.9% of the time I'm driving the car.

I've been spoiled coming from the R35 GTR community and I'm not willing to take a step down in the amenities department at this point.

I dont want as much in mine interior wise. Im fine with a base and the recaro seats. Looking for lower 8s through a magnum xl. 165s if it goes faster trap wise great. Ill still take the 1300whp but im not going to gut it to piss to get into 7s. Personally i dont want 7s. Only diet its getting is with a rear seat delete, welds weight savings, full exhaust savings, aero space light weight brakes and a light weight battery. I can remove about 200-250 without ripping out a passenger seat and carpet with odds and ends removed instead. Not sure how much your turbo kit will roughly weigh. Im guessing 50-60lbs. I think my goals are doable.

 

[FATHERFORD]

I dont want as much in mine interior wise. Im fine with a base and the recaro seats. Looking for lower 8s through a magnum xl. 165s if it goes faster trap wise great. Ill still take the 1300whp but im not going to gut it to piss to get into 7s. Personally i dont want 7s. Only diet its getting is with a rear seat delete, welds weight savings, full exhaust savings, aero space light weight brakes and a light weight battery. I can remove about 200-250 without ripping out a passenger seat and carpet with odds and ends removed instead. Not sure how much your turbo kit will roughly weigh. Im guessing 50-60lbs. I think my goals are doable.

I'm the same way, I'm a full weight car. I drive my cars all over the place. Not just on saturday to the local car meet.

I drove my 15 on the hotrod Power Tour, over 3000 miles round trip in two weeks basically.

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