5.0 Coyote vs LS3/LT1 GM engines - how do they compare?

[Car Man]

The LT1 weighs more and I think is within 1" in all directions to the Coyote. The whole "OHC engines are sooo heavy" thing has been dramatically overblown by LSX fans. In reality I think the Coyote only weighs around 5-10lbs more fully dressed to fully dressed.

The Voodoo weighs less than the Coyote due in part to things like the gun drilled crank, composite oil pan and a few other things.

Up until recently it was just the truth. Nowadays not so much, but there is a generation of fools who associate displacement with size.

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[1320']

Always a good way to explain size difference between DOHC and OHV.

Comparing a Coyote to a stripped down 302? Not really that accurate for Coyote to LS.

Pretty much the only dimension where the Coyote is really larger in any significant way to the LS is width, it is about 6" wider from outer edge of the head to the opposite side. Otherwise it's not dramatically taller or longer.

 

[9secondko]

Well Im going to figure that you and Eddie are also under the impression that displacement equals mass or size which then renders you both useless to the rest of this converation.

Displacement is the only metric that matters.

It's how an engine pushes air. Some need more volume and some less.

Obviously different tech will necessitate different external dimensions.

But where the actual power is being made is in the efficiency of air movement.

The entire industry recognizes this and thus you hear about displacement. Not length x height x width externally. Except when fanboys try to argue a point that doesn't exist.

The sooner you recognize this, the smarter you will have become.

 

[Car Man]

Cool story bro.

The entirety of the industry disagrees with you. Good company.

Come on into the now buddy. HP, weight, grip, transmission, gearing amongst all others dictate speed. Not HP/L. Its like arguing with a ricer here.

 

[cosmo]

Comparing a Coyote to a stripped down 302? Not really that accurate for Coyote to LS.

Pretty much the only dimension where the Coyote is really larger in any significant way to the LS is width, it is about 6" wider from outer edge of the head to the opposite side. Otherwise it's not dramatically taller or longer.

PST that isn't a coyote.

 

[Childs Play]

Comparing a Coyote to a stripped down 302? Not really that accurate for Coyote to LS.

Pretty much the only dimension where the Coyote is really larger in any significant way to the LS is width, it is about 6" wider from outer edge of the head to the opposite side. Otherwise it's not dramatically taller or longer.

Oh, I was just trying to show the difference between the old pushrod 302s vs the newer DOHC engines. Also I think that's a 4.6. Was meant to compare those. I didn't think the LS was that much different though but since I haven't exactly sat down and looked at dimensions I have no knowledge on exact sizes for that. I wouldn't mind seeing a side by side of that though to compare.

 

[Car Man]

Displacement is the only metric that matters.

It's how an engine pushes air. Some need more volume and some less.

Obviously different tech will necessitate different external dimensions.

But where the actual power is being made is in the efficiency of air movement.

The entire industry recognizes this and thus you hear about displacement. Not length x height x width externally.

The sooner you recognize this, the smarter you will have become.

No shit sherlock, but my original point was adressing a fool who was associating needing more cubes to get the power compared to a smaller displacement motor. As if having a SMALLER, MORE EFFICIENT (based on cubes compared to size) more powerful engine as compared to the modular 4.6 was a denegration of some sort.

The ls engines were smaller, and shit tons more poweful.

 

[FastCarFanBoy]

Racing organizations limit engines by displacement.

Countries tax engines based on displacement.

Manufacturers market engines based on displacement

....All irrelevant because some guy on an internet forum believes L",W", and H" is how an engine is truly measured

If the engine is physically too big trust me they will build the car around it...history has shown us this. Physical dimensions have zero impact on any measure of an engines performance, not horsepower, torque, emissions, fuel economy...precisely no fucks are given about the physical size of an engine except on internet forums where LS guys try to make an argument as to why their favorite motor has to be an entire engine bigger than a coyote to make similar power. And can anyone explain why the gigantic Coyote only weighs 10lbs more than those tiny LS's...WTF is chevy building their engines out of?

 

[9secondko]

Come on into the now buddy. HP, weight, grip, transmission, gearing amongst all others dictate speed. Not HP/L. Its like arguing with a ricer here.

If you want to talk balance, then do so.

You must incorporate track, wheelbase, suspension geometry, spring rates, damping, aero, body in white, overrall weight plus distribution, sprung and unsprung mass, wheel and tire size, etc. the engine Wright is s small small part of that, not to mention modern OHC and ohv weights are negligible in this discussion.

But when you're talking about engines, power via displacement is THE discussion. Period.

Re-read the title of the thread. It doesn't say entire car balancing.

Let's try to stay on track.

 

[DiMaio90]

HP/L is for tree hugging commis.

 

[9secondko]

Racing organizations limit engines by displacement.

Countries tax engines based on displacement.

Manufacturers market engines based on displacement

....All irrelevant because some guy on an internet forum believes L",W", and H" is how an engine is truly measured

If the engine is physically too big trust me they will build the car around it...history has shown us this.

It's amazing the logical acrobatics people will involve themselves in to avoid reality.

 

[Voodooo]

The LS engine was stolen from the ford push rod platform. Gm can't even design their own engines let alone a car body.

 

[Voodooo]

Racing organizations limit engines by displacement.

Countries tax engines based on displacement.

Manufacturers market engines based on displacement

....All irrelevant because some guy on an internet forum believes L",W", and H" is how an engine is truly measured

If the engine is physically too big trust me they will build the car around it...history has shown us this. Physical dimensions have zero impact on any measure of an engines performance, not horsepower, torque, emissions, fuel economy...precisely no fucks are given about the physical size of an engine except on internet forums where LS guys try to make an argument as to why their favorite motor has to be an entire engine bigger than a coyote to make similar power. And can anyone explain why the gigantic Coyote only weighs 10lbs more than those tiny LS's...WTF is chevy building their engines out of?

Not all race classes are based around cubic inches. Some are pounds per inch. If your in a class that has a 8.5 pounds per cubic inch and you are building a 427 for a fox body. Forget it. That's 3629.5 pounds add on top of that a manual transmission weight penalty say 200 pounds you better give up now because no fox body is going to weigh 3829 pounds.

 

[1320']

The LS engine was stolen from the ford push rod platform. Gm can't even design their own engines let alone a car body.

That's a fact that a lot of people refuse to admit..that at it's core the LS1 was a highly modernized 351/302/289.

 

[FastCarFanBoy]

Not all race classes are based around cubic inches. Some are pounds per inch. If your in a class that has a 8.5 pounds per cubic inch and you are building a 427 for a fox body. Forget it. That's 3629.5 pounds add on top of that a manual transmission weight penalty say 200 pounds you better give up now because no fox body is going to weigh 3829 pounds.

awesome to know. what penalties are enforced if your engine is crazy wide or stupid long ? or if it weighs 900lbs?

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