Whats in a tune file

[lsiunsuex]

Ordered a Steeda intake yesterday and a Live Wire wireless tuner.

I've tried to do as much research as I can on these tuners - I got the wireless one just cause I like the big display that I can mount to the windshield.

Anyway - As I understand it, you get so many tunes for free (1 or 2 - I think this one comes with 1 free) - after that, you need to pay for them, right?

But what is in a tune file? How are they made? What program is used? Anyone have any info?

I'm a programmer by trade so as soon as I request the file, I'll poke and prod at it but it's likely not to be plain text.

Just hate to spend money on something in the future I could possibly make / modify myself...

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[whalesalad]

I am a software engineer as well and would be interested to see. You're correct that it's likely raw/binary data and not something you can read in plaintext.

 

[NoVaGT]

Your being a programmer means nothing. I don't think you'll be able to touch or fiddle with anything, and anyway you'd just screw it up. The tune will be loaded on the tuner, and then you load it onto the ECU.

Being a programmer is one thing. Knowing how a Coyote engine works, in absolute technical detail, is quite another. Mess with your tune and you risk your engine taking a long walk off a short pier.

 

[lsiunsuex]

Being a programmer is one thing. Knowing how a Coyote engine works, in absolute technical detail, is quite another.

I'm not about to get into a fight - I'm to new here and really don't want to piss anyone off -

But so your telling me these companies that make these tuners work for / have worked for Ford and on these specific engines or have some kind of contract with Ford on getting the data or etc? Cause last time I checked, programming was 90% screwing around with something you don't know and figuring out how to make it work.

I'm perfectly fine with buying whatever program they use to make the tune file assuming it's not thousands of dollars - and I completely understand the risks of bricking an engine / computer.

But don't be instantly dismissive buddy - awesome stuff has been created and still is by simply screwing around and learning something new and pushing boundaries...

 

[Oryx]

It's basically a group of tables that allow you to adjust/optimize the range of values. A tune can adjust the values of a single table or hundreds of tables. Many tables are interdependent on multiple tables so it's best to know what you are doing to have things work well or stay within safe levels.
there are multiple vehicle modules that also talk with each other.

There is software available to browse the modules and tables, but bottom line is you better understand what you are doing as things can go south fast.

HP Tuners VCM suite is one example

 

[Oryx]

Most of what we see are "canned" tunes that are known to be safe over a wide range of vehicles. Most of the "custom" tunes are tweaks of the original tune based on interpretation of the data logging of the specific engine parameters.
Self tuning can "easily" be done if you understand what you are doing.

 

[NoVaGT]

But so your telling me these companies that make these tuners work for / have worked for Ford and on these specific engines or have some kind of contract with Ford on getting the data or etc? Cause last time I checked, programming was 90% screwing around with something you don't know and figuring out how to make it work....

It's a specialized job. I'd guess they're much more engine management engineers than programmers.

Let me ask you, what is a stoichiometric rate? Don't Google the answer, don't ask another person, be honest.

 

[Oryx]

It's a specialized job.

Let me ask you, what is a stoichiometric rate? Don't Google the answer, don't ask another person, be honest.

Regardless of whether he knows the answer or not, It doesn't mean that someone can't learn or discuss..... everyone has to start somewhere.

 

[airfuel]

If you open the tune files with the correct program you will see tuning tables with rows and rows of numbers. VE tables, a/f tables, ignition tables etc.

You may also see check boxes with various parameter changes.

What do you think you are going to do with these without a dyno or good data logger and expertise to change them? They are actually pretty boring to look at...like a spreadsheet at the accountants desk.
Tuning is a very specialized job. (done correctly)

 

[NoVaGT]

Regardless of whether he knows the answer or not, It doesn't mean that someone can't learn or discuss..... everyone has to start somewhere.

I was asked to datalog my car. I was sent software to do that. It was loaded onto a lap-top, which connected to my tuner, then to the OBDII port. The instructions explained which parameters to actually measure, by selecting certain ones from a very long list.

There looked to be a few hundred things on the complete list, that the ECU monitors, controls and adjusts. It's a continuous feed-back loop system that is pretty damn complex.

So, the idea of "poking and prodding" at a tune seems rather dangerous to me. And if someone pokes and prods, but doesn't know how a Coyote engine actually works (as they're very complex, more so than most other motors), the risk of damaging an engine seems rather high.

The first tunes that came out for the Coyotes back in 2010, done by the pros, were eating #8 cylinders regularly. I would suggest this really isn't something to mess around with.

OP; if I came across as rude, I apologize. I just don't want to see someone grenade their new Mustang's engine.

 

[Sasuketr]

It is not 1's and 0's. More like Arrays in a table form!

 

[Falconetti]

OP, you can google your quesion or find tuning videos on youtube all day long. No idea if the videos show a correct form or way of tuning but you can see the tables and values if you are curious. as stated it looks like an excel spreadsheet of sorts.

 

[DarkestHour]

I'm not about to get into a fight - I'm to new here and really don't want to piss anyone off -

But so your telling me these companies that make these tuners work for / have worked for Ford and on these specific engines or have some kind of contract with Ford on getting the data or etc? Cause last time I checked, programming was 90% screwing around with something you don't know and figuring out how to make it work.

I'm perfectly fine with buying whatever program they use to make the tune file assuming it's not thousands of dollars - and I completely understand the risks of bricking an engine / computer.

But don't be instantly dismissive buddy - awesome stuff has been created and still is by simply screwing around and learning something new and pushing boundaries...

This guy :lol: Start here if you want to learn how to calibrate.

https://www.amazon.com/Engine-Management-Advanced-Greg-Banish/dp/1932494421

 

[lsiunsuex]

Let me ask you, what is a stoichiometric rate? Don't Google the answer, don't ask another person, be honest.

Your right. I have no idea what that is. But I'm willing to learn.

If this really is that complex - and by the rest of the comments, it sounds like it is - And I sure as hell don't want to brick my car or crack a piston or i'm sure any of a 100 things that could go wrong - then maybe I'll just pay the fee when I make a major change.

I'm just curious, thats all - As others have said; everyone starts somewhere and it's starting to interest me more as I get into mods. At least, maybe I'll just take a look and see whats what.

 

[whalesalad]

I think there is a difference here between what the OP is asking. I'm inclined to think he was more interested in reading and tinkering and poking around, not necessarily tuning his own engine.

The tune *data* itself is just maps. I'm not talking about the meaning of the data or the value in having a professional create it. In terms of reading and exploring that data, why would you put the guy down for mentioning he is a programmer? You are coming across as a little naïve.

The engine is purely functional. Data from sensors goes in (throttle position, air flow from MAF, measurements from O2, etc..) and data comes out to drive the injectors, timing, etc...

Everything in programming essentially breaks down to input and output. There are simple functions (calculator) like add(x, y) where x and y are numbers, and then there are more complex functions (engine) like air_fuel(o2_reading, throttle_position) etc... but at the end of the day it's all simple math. I'm grossly oversimplifying things as there are dozens of various inputs, but when you compose them all together you ultimately get a set of parameters that pop out perform very simple procedures.

Sure, I would never try and tune my engine myself. I have no clue how to properly do that. I realize the OP hinted at that but cut the guy some slack.

I'd love to poke around. What would be more fun, to be honest, would be to literally diff the side-by-side products of a Lund flex fuel tune and a Livernois flex fuel tune, for example, to see the actual differences between the two. At the end of the day they are all writing data to memory in the ECU. Seeing what they are writing and manipulating would be very interesting.

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