US tuners vs Aus tuners

[msweet]

Not looking to open a shitstorm (it probably will anyway), but there's been a few posts lately about how US tuners aren't able to tune for Aussie mustangs.

I'm far from an expert, but from my position I would think that they have decades of experience, many vendors specialise in Mustangs, and our cars aren't exactly a different breed. Sure there are differences in header design, climate and slight fuel variations, but I can't see that being deal-breaking stuff.

I'd like to hear arguments to back up the theory that US tuners can't tune Aussie mustangs. [MENTION=14692]Aus-MustangGT[/MENTION] you've been vocal on this for a while, I'm sure you can clarify exactly why that is. Everyone else, let's keep it to facts and genuine questions.

And full disclosure I will be getting mine tuned locally when the time comes, by the same shop I've used before, they will be installing some stuff for me tomorrow.

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[phil545]

I can't speak highly enough for Torrie at Unleashed Tuning in the states. I bought my xcal 3 off him and he tuned my Focus ST all remotely with no issues. He even did free re-tunes as I modded it more along the way. Then perfected it after each time i went and did some data logging

As it was new at the time he did need to get some sort of code off Ford but once he had it, he could tune any of the aussie focus's here.

He has been tuning Mustangs for quite some time so I'd imagine he wouldn't have much of an issue here either.

 

[FPV GT]

It is not a case that they cannot tune Aus cars, its a case of in my opinion more of a hassle, time consuming, and again in my opinion far from the best option.
Many Aus tuners have been tweaking this engine and its sc variant the Miami for a number of years, and have had good success. The whole and sole reason why I will be using an Aus tuner with an Aus specific device is as follows.
My tuner can do incremental adjustments whilst sitting in the car, and create a custom tune for my car. The changes he makes, he is able to immediately analyse and adjust if needed. The entire tuning process can be achieved within 1-2 hours.

I will stand corrected but what I am to led to believe with the tune from the USA, is that you are sent a generic base tune. (unless you specify you have headers, cai etc)
You load this and see what happens. Data log, send the info back for tweaking etc. Changes are made, is sent back to you to reload and so forth.
Tho these generic tunes will work, their tables are set for a baseline. And as each car is different, for me this doesn’t make sense.
The tune is based on the “all cars are the same principle” without taking in the differences in the external variables (fuel rating, temperature, atmospheric pressure etc)

The easiest way to think of it is as follows.
It is a well known fact that there can be Monday and Friday builds. There can be quite a difference between one engine and another. For fact I know of a near 30kw discrepancy between two factory standard cars on the same dyno on the same day with the same fuel.
I consider the best value for money is to work with your tuner to find a happy medium. He sees what the car is doing in the beginning, then tunes to suit.

My FPV made good power, could have made more, but the tuner stayed on the side of safety, left a tad more fuel, that way no chance that it would ever lean out to the point of bang. Over the years of ownership, at service time and others if a change was needed he could do it on the spot and see the result.

Unfortunately with the tuning platform that my tuner uses he is forced to purchase it through the Aus distributor, as the USA version is locked out. I understand the rationale of protecting the distribution rights, not the price being charged as a result of the exclusiveness.

Yes the Yanks can provide tunes for our Aus cars, and provide good ones they do.
However, it makes a whole lot more sense that adjustments are made whilst the tuner's bum is behind the wheel and they can see/feel what is happening.

Regards
Paul

 

[MoosaTunga]

the Yanks can tune them no probs, have worked closely with them remote tuning for many years. The Mustang software is very different to our Falcon's and alot of our local tuners are like :headbonk: at first, but once you sit down and actually look into it it's not as hard as first seems.

Take the car to the dyno, one with Mustang experience would obviously be best, they can make on the fly changes etc and may pickup on noises, other things etc you don't. Tune on the dyno then hit the street and check, that is what every good tuner does anyway.

 

[Aus-MustangGT]

So first I will run with a bit of background. I had purchased a tune from Lund and an Ngauge, as I have said a couple of times now the transaction was less than smooth and 2-3 months after purchase I still didn't have my tune. I also had purchased a JLT cold air intake which I since sold.

All my initial research (pre-Australian cars) lead to this combination being my preferred option however as I saw more Australian car's and their IATs I decided to sell the JLT and weeks of complaints and backwards and forwards I received a refund on my tune and n guage.

I decided to go with local tuners Blue Power Racing, as they had tuned Mustang Motorsports Targa car, and have had the most exposure to Mustang tuning on the s550 platform. I am not sponsored by Blue Power but I feel very lucky that I am able to be one of their development cars so I get to test out their tunes before they are rolled out.



US Cars v Australian Cars
So the obvious differences between these cars are headers and also our fuel. The fuel is an issue, as even our 98 is not always pure 98, I have tried BP, Shell, United, Caltex and Woolworths. The inconsistencies are staggering and I now run only on BP 98. Beneath the skin of the car there are a lot of changes on the Australian model. So far there have been different CPU and CPU maps for the Australian car, which has affected power output. The first batch of cars are showing that they are consistently more powerful.

In saying that the differences between the US cpu map and the AUS cpu map are staggering, this car is one of the most complex cars to tune. For example if you are running an auto and you alter the car with LEDs, you can upset your tune, if you blow a globe which is drawing more or less power than you should, it can upset your tune. The engine is hooked up to around 36 different computers which are constantly monitoring power draw, output, voltage etc.

I have seen a US tuned car on a dyno after their tune was uploaded, the car lost 7kw at the wheels, but more of greater concern the car went into limp mode two days later. The car had to be returned to stock, but in returning it to stock there were further issues because the US tuning company does not have the multiple stock ECU maps to refer to.



US cold air intakes
First off, I love the look of the corsa intake and I have spent a lot of time looking at CAI's their IATs and how it affects tuning. To give you an example of an Australian car with a Steeda intake, the car was performing strangely, it was stalling having issues with idle and also started surging. After the CAI was removed the car was back to acting normal. There have also been two other CAI's which make power, but the back pressure is too much for the engine and the IATs don't drop.

As people should know from high school science, hot air rises and unfortunately re don't have a hood vent in the car to help exit this hot air which is an issue with open top intake kits. Blue power is aware of this issue and they have manufactured their surround with a material that cools extremely quickly under throttle.



Why I don't recommend US tuning
The whole time I have been on this forum my goal has been to gain as much information as possible and to help others use this information I have gained. Personally if I had have tuned my car with a US company I probably would have regretted it knowing what I know now.

I don't want to see anyone's car have issues, you might not have an issue with getting a tune from the US and if thats the case then great. It is a cheaper solution, but it is riskier. As I said above I have seen multiple cars have issues for reasons I am aware of and for other reasons built into the ECU that show that these cars are different under the skin.

If I am going to risk my warranty on a tune I want it to be done in the safest possible way and with a team that wont disappear on me when something doesn't perform as it should.

 

[msweet]

Points taken on board, and I understand the benefits of local tuning on the fly, street tuning etc, which is why I will get mine done locally, the question was more aimed at specifically what is so different with our cars that makes US remote tuning a bad idea.

For the sake of education, [MENTION=14692]Aus-MustangGT[/MENTION] do you have any links regarding the CPU differences, that would impact tuning? Or how did you find that information?

Completely agree re the fuel, I only fill up with BP 98, and keeping IATs down is important with closed airboxes.

 

[Aus-MustangGT]

Points taken on board, and I understand the benefits of local tuning on the fly, street tuning etc, which is why I will get mine done locally, the question was more aimed at specifically what is so different with our cars that makes US remote tuning a bad idea.

For the sake of education, [MENTION=14692]Aus-MustangGT[/MENTION] do you have any links regarding the CPU differences, that would impact tuning? Or how did you find that information?

Completely agree re the fuel, I only fill up with BP 98, and keeping IATs down is important with closed airboxes.

The way I have found out that information is through the shop that has tuned US cars, Targa Tasmania cars, early Aus S550 Mustangs and new 2017 Mustangs. The differences are impacting tuning and it is ridiculously complicated. I don't understand it completely myself to be honest.

So to be clear people can tune their cars from the US, it is definitely not the best option. I would rather people be aware of the challenges and what has gone wrong on other peoples cars. Otherwise it could be a very expensive lesson for some

 

[Burkey]

[MENTION=14692]Aus-MustangGT[/MENTION]
Can you define "first batch of cars"?
What dates are we looking at here?
Cheers

 

[Aus-MustangGT]

[MENTION=14692]Aus-MustangGT[/MENTION]
Can you define "first batch of cars"?
What dates are we looking at here?
Cheers

I am unaware of the specific dates to be honest but [MENTION=20412]Banditvox[/MENTION] car has a different ecu map to mine

 

[Burkey]

I am unaware of the specific dates to be honest but [MENTION=20412]Banditvox[/MENTION] car has a different ecu map to mine

I'm finding this interesting...

 

[Shevs550]

US cold air intakes

As people should know from high school science, hot air rises and unfortunately re don't have a hood vent in the car to help exit this hot air which is an issue with open top intake kits.

Excellent point.

 

[Egghead]

Excellent point.

Also I thought they were illegal anyway open boxes

 

[Aussie Mate]

I am unaware of the specific dates to be honest but [MENTION=20412]Banditvox[/MENTION] car has a different ecu map to mine

This is interesting...


Are you saying the first few shipments of cars - say Dec 2015 to Feb 2016 are different - if so - in what way?

- how do you know/check if your car has a different tune or what version of tune should they have?

 

[msweet]

Also I thought they were illegal anyway open boxes

Correct, then again technically your exhaust would be over the legal threshold . Only need to worry about it if you've given them a reason to check

 

[Aus-MustangGT]

This is interesting...


Are you saying the first few shipments of cars - say Dec 2015 to Feb 2016 are different - if so - in what way?

- how do you know/check if your car has a different tune or what version of tune should they have?

The tune applied to these cars are different and from stock make slightly more power (we aren't talking astronomical numbers)o, I am unaware of how to determine what tune your car has. Best bet would be to take it to a tuning shop who is aware of these changes

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