Unofficial Off Topic Thread

[HoosierDaddy]

From the University of Virginia:

https://psychology.as.virginia.edu/what-are-diversity-equity-and-inclusion-dei

"Equity is different from equality. Equality provides the same resources, opportunities, and treatment for all people without accommodating their backgrounds or resources.

Equity, on the other hand, provides everyone with the unique resources and opportunities they need to reach an equal outcome.

Whereas equality means providing equal access to everyone regardless of the differences in need, equity means recognizing that not everyone starts from the same place, and thus adjustments are made to address this imbalance. Equity is also something that is ongoing because new differences emerge, whereas equality remains the same because each individual is provided the same resources or access..."

A scenario involving running might help.

If I'm competing against someone with poor feet, while we both begin at the same starting line (equality), odds are good I'm always going to win.

But if the cause of those bad feet is looked upon and corrected (equity), it'll then be more of an actual competition (equality).

A simple definition would be: a person's destiny shouldn't be dictated by the zip code they were born into.

YMMV.

What is missing from that is the impact on everyone else. Hiring someone who is low IQ, uneducated, clumsy none of which may be their fault is great BUT only if there are unlimited jobs and none of the jobs produce any product or provide any services.

Since all jobs do (or at least are meant to) It means the quality of the products or services suffer. Raise your hands if you want your heart surgeon to be bottom of their class and only got into school in the first place and then weren't dropped even if they couldn't pass unless DEI rules demanded it.

Is that okay because it was "sad" there were too many people that will be better also wanting the jobs, school acceptance, etc.?

DEI in nature would be if the fastest gazelles offered themselves to the lions because its not fair the slowest ones get eaten more often. Of course that doesn't happen in nature. Why? Because animals refuse to be sacrificed for some hairbrained theory imposed on them.

Better to use some of the HUGE amount of extra money that would be generated without DEI to help people overcome qualities that prevent them from succeeding on merit and fund safety nets for the shortcomings that can't be fixed.

Personally, I doubt there is any point in trying to convince people. Almost all that profess to believe in it, only do because they are lemmings just following the lead of a perceived majority. That very trait will cure them since a growing majority now realize what a dumb concept it was. Any time spent convincing, even if successful only speeds up the process a little. I recommend just being patient

Sponsored

 

[sk47]

Hello; Syke provided a very technical definition of the differences between equity & equality. HoosierDaddy gave a more as applied version of the differences.
Two things come to mind. First a very old story written by Kurt Vonnegut. I forget the title but it pictured a world where healthy and or fit individuals must wear "handicaps" to make them equal to the less healthy or fit individuals. In the decades since I first knew of this story the scenario has been slowly approached in a slightly different way.

The second think was during my early time as a science teacher in public schools. I needed "hands on" materials to make learning basic science better. The funds were not available for such. However, there were plenty of funds for "special-ed" and ball teams. I understood the thinking behind the situation but not the wisdom of overall outcomes.
Special ed children were handicapped, usually from birth, either physically or mentally or sometimes both, they could not function the same way as their non handicapped peers. So, I understood the extra special busses. The extra personnel attached to each such student. Some each had a personal aid.
What i did not quite agree with was the built in neglect the system had for the other end of the spectrum. Those being the brightest individuals whose potential was not enhanced due to a lack of similar funds for an enhanced educational chance. I could not, nor could other teachers enhance the education of the best & brightest.

However, the State of KY in 1990 apparently, in the eyes of local school boards, made a mistake. The legislature provided funding for classroom teachers which bypassed the traditional path. Instead of the new funds being sent directly into the general fund of the schools, the monies were allocated to individual teachers to spend on our classrooms. I had something like $3,000 a year for hands on stuff. I bought durables to be sure, but also consumables. Consumables included things such as model rocket kits, electric motor kits, battery building kits.
Perhaps the most popular was the strips of balsa wood. The students were challenged to build a bridge which was tested to destruction. Became very popular among the students. One 7th & 8th grade group were allowed to take their bridges to an area competition with high schools. We did not win but did make third place out of seven teams.

Of course, the local principals & school boards soon found a way to divert the funds back into their control.

 

[sk47]

First a very old story written by Kurt Vonnegut. I forget the title but it pictured a world where healthy and or fit individuals must wear "handicaps" to make them equal to the less healthy or fit individuals. In the decades since I first knew of this story the scenario has been slowly approached in a slightly different way.

Hello; I found the name of the short story. Harrison Bergeron.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

Had a scare this morning. I almost never post on any social media (don't consider forums to be).

Then I get a notice that Kristi Noem commented on one and I grabbed my go bag. Fortunately, before bolting I saw the like notice.

 

[sk47]

Hello; On to more serious matters. I very much want to meet Tilly Norwood. Any ideas how to go about that?

Tilly The 'AI Actor' Is Fake, But Her Potential To Harm Women Is Real

Hello; there are forces about trying to do away with Tilly.

 

[HoosierDaddy]

Gee. Whodathunkit?

A relative leased an unfurnished apartment owning nothing but the clothing on his back. Hmm where can he furnish an apartment and get everything else needed to live in it for almost nothing? WalMart.com!

He puts over 100 items in a cart totaling ~$4k. First time Walmart shopper. Brand new address, brand new credit card. Thank you for your order. Then 10 minutes later, your order has been canceled. Click for reason. Reason: Something unexpected happened. Calls to ask what to do now. Is told just reorder. He does. Same results. Now he has ~$8k of hold on the card and nothing to show for it. I conference call to find out why and the bottom line is: no human knows why, nor can find out. Orders are reviewed by AI who issues a verdict but never documents why! Best guess was the AI thought risk of fraud. None of the humans could see anything out of the ordinary. Fortunately, the humans were able to flag the account to bypass AI for an order from that account placed in the next hour.

I can't wait until AI gets involved with health care recommendations. I'm sorry sir, yes I personally think euthanasia (if in Canada) is extreme for an ingrown toenail, but AI is a lot smarter than me (and you). You might want to ask again after buying life insurance from the same company.

 

[sk47]

Marketplace - Shelby GT500 Mustang Neon Sign - 5 ft wide | Facebook

Hello; Not sure where to post this. ran across it on FB marketplace. I do not want to buy it. I also do not have anything to do with it, just happened to see the ad.

 

[sk47]

$6.5 billion of debt erased for millions of Americans

Hello; This is about a plan to erase medical debt for some. I read the link, but some details are not included. Has to do with being on Medicaid as well as income levels.

I agree the costs of medical care are outrageous. I would like to see some workable plans to deal with the costs. A take from reading this link is monies are taken from other taxpayers to fund this program. Nothing new about making taxpayers pay for special programs. Guess there appears to be a robbing Peter to pay Paul sort of aspect to the plan. On first reading I find serious questions and am not sure the program is a good idea.

Not sure what sort of tax the payment monies become.

 

[Skye]

Disclosure: I donate to Undue Medical Debt, a charity which purchases medical debt from collection agencies and then retires it.

This is about a plan to erase medical debt for some.

https://www.congress.gov/crs-product/R43357

https://www.ncdhhs.gov/medicaldebt

https://www.ncdhhs.gov/news/press-r...-debt-relief-initiative-approved-another-year

Medicare and Medicaid spending represent close to half of all federal outlays. The topic covers a lot of ground. I'll attempt to explain what's happening in NC.

The medical system in the US is a for-profit system. While there are non-profit segments, it's predominantly for-profit, private-provider driven.

People in the US are some of the unhealthiest on the planet. A casual stroll through your local WalMart will prove that.

Some patients receive coverage through their employer. For most, while their policies cover many costs, there are deductibles, lifetime caps and procedures not covered.

Other patients work, but their employer provides no coverage. Personal private plans are very expensive. Many might not be eligible for Medicaid expansion (Obamacare), if their state even offers it.

Some are on Medicare.

Others still are on Medicaid.

The patient population is generating a certain amount of costs. Will put these costs at $1. Insurers, state and federal agencies, through the various programs and reimbursement rates (all of which are different), cover let's say .90.

Patients paying down their debt, charging more for some procedures while refusing Medicaid and Medicare recipients in some offices can bring that provider closer to being made whole.

After recovering as much as possible, the provider (which ultimately includes Medicare, Medicaid, state and GOV offices) could still be left with a certain amount of debt which, odds are, will never be paid. Providers turn this unresolved debt over to collection agencies.

Collection agencies might buy the debt from the provider for pennies on the dollar. Let's say, $1M of accounts receivable for $100K. The agency then attempts to recover the full amount from the patients. The provider writes down the $900K loss. The collector makes a profit on anything recovered over the $100K cost. Agencies can also work on a commission schedule. If the collector receives X, they gift a percentage to the provider, pocketing the rest. It depends.

To the debtor, the debt is now on their credit history as a default, acting as a drag on their credit score, reflecting poorly on such things as interest rates, securing a mortgage, car loan, employment or renting an apartment.

Some, over the course of what could be years, pay down the debt. Others, don't have an income that affords them to pay it down. Through no fault of their own, they've encountered now a permanent drag on all things involving their credit history and credit score. "Debt collector" and "default" are the key words people notice, not that they had an unforeseen medical event they couldn't pay for.

Medial debt has become a huge issue for people throughout the country. In 2023, the state of NC passed the Healthcare Access and Stabilization Program (HASP). The position of the state of NC is this: "We know you have X% of medical debt on your books today, debt you'll most likely never recover. Instead of compensating you X% for Medicare and Medicaid recipients , we'll pay you X+X% (a certain percentage more) to erase that debt, if you agree to some conditions."

To clarify on debt and the paragraph above, it's patient debt. Private, Medicare and Medicaid. The HASP legislation is not program specific on the patient debt paid down, although it will be skewed towards Medicare and Medicaid patients. Funds are not paid to the individual, but the provider.

HASP is funded by state, Medicare and Medicaid monies. The state taxes the people that live there and pays X for Medicaid and Medicare, with the GOV kicking in its percentage. There is no limit on the amounts. If a state taxes and receives $10T for its healthcare systems, technically, the GOV has to match what the state then spends.

Long-term, NC is paying their providers more for the coverage given. To the provider, there is expected to be less unrecoverable debt over time. To the beneficiaries, the burden of carrying that medical debt and its affects is lessened, if not removed entirely.

Each person will need to study their state and their provider systems. While private, Medicare and Medicaid coverage is common, not all states have expanded their systems (Obamacare). Reimbursement rates vary from state-to-state, plan-to-plan. The Medicaid and Medicare monies being spent is a form of debt-sharing, both the state and the GOV paying their percentages. If the state pays less, the GOV pays less. If the state pays more, so does the GOV.

At one extreme, some in the US would like to return to a pre-LBJ War on Poverty system: no Medicare or Medicaid. At the other, some welcome a single-payer, non-profit system. Today, we're somewhere in-between, with 50 different systems under two national programs.

To the topic of healthcare and medical systems, these issues are not unique to us. The UK's system has been a train wreck of underfunding for decades. France has seen one PM after another exit as it tries to reform (raising taxes, while reducing benefits) it's programs. Due to its low birthrate and aging population, Japan will experience huge funding shortfalls. China's One-child policies have set it up for the same. India will be dealing with its own issues in 30 years time.

Each of the countries listed above, while having their own, unique characteristics, are seeing now or will experience the same:

- An aging population
- Fewer people paying in
- An increase in liabilities

 

[sk47]

HASP is funded by state, Medicare and Medicaid monies. The state taxes the people that live there and pays X for Medicaid and Medicare, with the GOV kicking in its percentage. There is no limit on the amounts. If a state taxes and receives $10T for its healthcare systems, technically, the GOV has to match what the state then spends.

Hello; From your comprehensive reply I quote the above. Mainly because this portion address my main question. I will figure by "the GOV" you refer to the federal government and therefore federal tax dollars.
I also figure that the distinction about HASP being funded by a state (NC in this case) means monies from citizens paying state levied taxes.
This amounts to verification of my stance which I characterized as robbing Peter to pay Paul. Not robbing in the criminal street crime sense exactly. More in the sense of taking from the whole of a population (NC's taxpayers) to give to a small percentage of that same population (NC's medical debt holders)
Actually goes further that NC taxpayers because federal USA taxpayers have to chip in due to matching funds clauses. So federal taxpayers paying for the debt of NC medical debt holders.

Let me pause here. I do understand the "good deed" aspect of this program. I follow that medical debt is a crisis for individuals. Even leaving out that many paint themselves into a poor health corner by the unhealthy lifestyle they lived. Medical debt can follow them to the grave. You wrote about the hardships quite well.

Here is my point. The HASP program amounts to taking from many to benefit the few. In this case the many is some limited to taxpayers, State & federal. I am not sure which descriptor to apply. Is this socialism? Is this some other ism?

There is another aspect. We (the USA) are at or very near a population dynamic in which only around half or less of the working age adults actually have jobs which pay taxes. The other half or more either do not work at all or even if they work do not actually pay taxes. The second group tend to qualify and get benefits from programs for which they do not pay for.
A thing is all adults of both groups get to vote. An outcome of this dynamic can be that should enough of group #2 vote for these benefit programs, then any number of "free to them" programs can be enacted.

I am not convinced that adding more to the burden of actual taxpayers in the form of programs such as HASP is an actual solution. Perhaps becomes a further enabling action similar in the way a caring family try to help out a family addict. Seems a loving act but in reality, prolongs the actual problem.
Brings up the next question. That being what are the problems in a healthcare system in which much, much more monies per capita are spent than anywhere else in the world for a worse outcome. Same scenario in the education system for that matter.

 

[sk47]

Disclosure: I donate to Undue Medical Debt, a charity which purchases medical debt from collection agencies and then retires it.



https://www.congress.gov/crs-product/R43357

https://www.ncdhhs.gov/medicaldebt

https://www.ncdhhs.gov/news/press-r...-debt-relief-initiative-approved-another-year

Medicare and Medicaid spending represent close to half of all federal outlays. The topic covers a lot of ground. I'll attempt to explain what's happening in NC.

The medical system in the US is a for-profit system. While there are non-profit segments, it's predominantly for-profit, private-provider driven.

People in the US are some of the unhealthiest on the planet. A casual stroll through your local WalMart will prove that.

Some patients receive coverage through their employer. For most, while their policies cover many costs, there are deductibles, lifetime caps and procedures not covered.

Other patients work, but their employer provides no coverage. Personal private plans are very expensive. Many might not be eligible for Medicaid expansion (Obamacare), if their state even offers it.

Some are on Medicare.

Others still are on Medicaid.

The patient population is generating a certain amount of costs. Will put these costs at $1. Insurers, state and federal agencies, through the various programs and reimbursement rates (all of which are different), cover let's say .90. At this moment, the medical provider is operating in the red.

Patients paying down their debt, charging more for some procedures while refusing Medicaid and Medicare recipients in some offices can bring that provider closer to being made whole. It's a clawback.

After recovering as much as possible, the provider (which ultimately includes Medicare, Medicaid, state and GOV offices) is still left with a certain amount of debt which, odds are, will not be paid. Providers then turn this unresolved debt over to collection agencies.

Collection agencies might buy the debt from the provider for pennies on the dollar. Let's say, $1M of accounts receivable for $100K. The agency then attempts to recover the full amount from the patients. The provider writes down the $900K loss. The collector makes a profit on anything recovered over the $100K cost. Agencies can also work on a commission schedule. If the collector receives X, they gift a percentage to the provider, pocketing the rest. It depends.

To the debtor, the debt is now on their credit history as a default, acting as a drag on their credit score, reflecting poorly on such things as interest rates, securing a mortgage, car loan, employment or renting an apartment.

Some, over the course of what could be years, pay down the debt. Others, don't have an income that affords them to pay it down. Through no fault of their own, they've encountered now a permanent drag on all things involving their credit history and credit score. "Debt collector" and "default" are the key words people notice, not that they had an unforeseen medical event they couldn't pay for.

Medial debt has become a huge issue for people throughout the country. In 2023, the state of NC passed the Healthcare Access and Stabilization Program (HASP). The position of the state of NC is this: "We know you have X% of medical debt on your books today, debt you'll most likely never recover. Instead of compensating you X% for Medicare and Medicaid recipients , we'll pay you X+X% (a certain percentage more) to erase that debt, if you agree to some conditions."

To clarify on debt and the paragraph above, it's patient debt. Private, Medicare and Medicaid. The HASP legislation is not program specific on the patient debt paid down, although it will be skewed towards Medicare and Medicaid patients.

HASP is funded by state, Medicare and Medicaid monies. The state taxes the people that live there and pays X for Medicaid and Medicare, with the GOV kicking in its percentage. There is no limit on the amounts. If a state taxes and receives $10T for its healthcare systems, technically, the GOV has to match what the state then spends.

Long-term, NC is paying their providers more for the coverage given. To the provider, there is expected to be less unrecoverable debt over time. To the beneficiaries, the burden of carrying that medical debt and its affects is lessened, if not removed entirely.

Each person will need to study their state and their provider systems. While private, Medicare and Medicaid coverage is common, not all states have expanded their systems (Obamacare). No state provides the same reimbursement rates. The Medicaid and Medicare monies being spent is a form of debt-sharing, both the state and the GOV paying their percentages. If the state pays less, the GOV pays less. If the state pays more, so does the GOV.

At one extreme, some in the US would like to return to a pre-LBJ War on Poverty system: no Medicare or Medicaid. At the other, some welcome a single-payer, non-profit system. Today, we're somewhere in-between, with 50 different systems under two national programs.

To the topic of healthcare and medical systems, these issues are not unique to us. The UK's system has been a train wreck of underfunding for decades. France has seen one PM after another exit as it tries to reform (raising taxes, while reducing benefits) it's programs. Due to its low birthrate and aging population, Japan will experience huge funding shortfalls. China's One-child policies have set it up for the same. India will be dealing with its own issues in 30 years time.

Each of the countries listed above, while having their own, unique characteristics, are seeing now or will experience the same:

- An aging population
- Fewer people paying in
- An increase in liabilities

Hello; may I copy this post and send it to others?

 

[CrazyHippie]

Hello; From your comprehensive reply I quote the above. Mainly because this portion address my main question. I will figure by "the GOV" you refer to the federal government and therefore federal tax dollars.
I also figure that the distinction about HASP being funded by a state (NC in this case) means monies from citizens paying state levied taxes.
This amounts to verification of my stance which I characterized as robbing Peter to pay Paul. Not robbing in the criminal street crime sense exactly. More in the sense of taking from the whole of a population (NC's taxpayers) to give to a small percentage of that same population (NC's medical debt holders)
Actually goes further that NC taxpayers because federal USA taxpayers have to chip in due to matching funds clauses. So federal taxpayers paying for the debt of NC medical debt holders.

Let me pause here. I do understand the "good deed" aspect of this program. I follow that medical debt is a crisis for individuals. Even leaving out that many paint themselves into a poor health corner by the unhealthy lifestyle they lived. Medical debt can follow them to the grave. You wrote about the hardships quite well.

Here is my point. The HASP program amounts to taking from many to benefit the few. In this case the many is some limited to taxpayers, State & federal. I am not sure which descriptor to apply. Is this socialism? Is this some other ism?

There is another aspect. We (the USA) are at or very near a population dynamic in which only around half or less of the working age adults actually have jobs which pay taxes. The other half or more either do not work at all or even if they work do not actually pay taxes. The second group tend to qualify and get benefits from programs for which they do not pay for.
A thing is all adults of both groups get to vote. An outcome of this dynamic can be that should enough of group #2 vote for these benefit programs, then any number of "free to them" programs can be enacted.

I am not convinced that adding more to the burden of actual taxpayers in the form of programs such as HASP is an actual solution. Perhaps becomes a further enabling action similar in the way a caring family try to help out a family addict. Seems a loving act but in reality, prolongs the actual problem.
Brings up the next question. That being what are the problems in a healthcare system in which much, much more monies per capita are spent than anywhere else in the world for a worse outcome. Same scenario in the education system for that matter.

The elephant in the room is medical insurance. The GOV can adjust who is eligible for subsidies and cut funding all they want, but until limits are placed on insurance premiums, the insurance companies will crank up subscriber costs to replace the lost revenue. We need legislation to mandate medical insurance as a non-profit industry as a start!

 

[Skye]

Hello; may I copy this post and send it to others?

Yes.

 

[sk47]

Hello; I was driving home from Knoxville TN yesterday. Got behind a Mustang pulling a small trailer. Took a moment to figure what i was seeing. There were two drag slicks mounted on the trailer. I could see a couple of fuel jug spouts in an open bin. There was an enclosed box as well. The Mustang was loud and had 97 painted on the back window.
I finally cabbaged onto it was headed to the drag strip north of Knoxville and just south of Maynardville TN (Recall the song from the Thunder Road movie). The driver was towing the slicks and fuel to the track and my guess is he/she planned to race the Mustang.
I saw a pickup & a challenger with numbers painted on th back glass. As my route home passes the drag strip I saw another such trailer being pulled behind a car. The drag strip must have been running a Thursday set of races.
I did not stop yesterday but have in the past.

 

[sk47]

NASA supercomputer predicts when life on Earth will end: It is sooner than expected

Hello; NASA's computer cuts us back from two billion down to one billion years to live on earth. Anyone think we can actually last a million years.

I do not have a link to it handy but have seen lately another global warming time line. Goes something like we only have three years to act to avoid some sort of disaster. I began to think about what else is happening in around three years.

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