S550 Vibration at highway speeds

[Scooles]

Question…I’ve been an enthusiast my entire life. Fourth Stang and over 40 cars.

I bought my 2019 GT premium vert about 4 weeks ago. My only other vert was a beautiful 2007 Saab 9-3 2.0T. Well, that’s if you don’t consider my Daihatsu Rocky a convertible (google it).

I realize verts aren’t as rigid as hardtops. And they experience “cowl” shake over bumps and uneven roads. However, my GT has what I believe to be a harmonic vibration at highway speeds. No shake at the steering wheel. I feel a high frequency vibration in the seat. At times, the inside rear view mirror vibrates as does the passenger seat. Is this normal for my car?

I took it the dealer and they had two techs and the service director drive it. The techs said it’s normal for the vert and the director said it’s the smoothest vert he’s ever driven.

Already eliminated the usual suspects…alignment and wheel balance. Alignment checked three times. New Contis and road force balance.

Am I just being a picky old man??

Any thoughts appreciated.

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[Roger Blose]

Could be the tires.....I would drop the tire pressure down and see if there is any change. They may be balanced but can still have an internal problem like I have had with Pirelli P-Zeros in the past. Also could be the drive shaft balance which is a tough problem to solve at the dealer level.

 

[Scooles]

Thanks @Roger Blose. I had the vibration issue when I bought the car. It had two P Zeros and two no name Chinese tires on it. I replaced with a new set of Continental Extreme Contacts and had them road force balanced. I really think this is a driveline issue. The dealer is about as helpful as tits on a boar hog. How can I follow up with Ford Corporate? I’m going to need to get them involved apparently. I’ve seen a Ford rep on here named Deysha I think. How do I reach her? Seems odd really. There are such things as electronic vibration analyzers. I would like to think most techs have access to one. You can attach a sensor to something solid like the seat frame and the device will show frequency and amplitude of the vibration. From there the tech can tell if it’s motor mounts, drive shaft, u-joints, etc. I’m no tech and if I can research and learn this, wtf are they teaching techs these days?

 

[Cobra Jet]

Usually resonance like that can be attributed to a driveline vibration, such as something in the rear diff (premature pinion bearing failure) or an issue with the driveshaft (out of balance).

The 2015-2017's were notorious for driveline vibes - so much so the one thread on this site is probably the anchor thread to end all threads on this site as far as reads, views and posts... LOL.

You can get the tires road force balanced but most of the time, it's not a tire issue - it's either driveshaft or the rear diff.

Here's how you can tell:
Does the sensation come on at a certain speed/RPM and can you replicate it each time?

If you take load off the vehicle (ie: remove foot from a deer or pedal), does the vibe or sensation subside or decrease as speed and RPMs go down?

If you have a manual or auto trans - and at point of sensation, if you throw it into Neutral (ie: taking load off drivetrain), again does the sensation or vibe subside?

If you answered yes to all (3) above it's driveline related and confirmed by the fact that during load on the driveline, the sensation comes on at certain speed/RPM and the removal of that load subsided the sensation.

--


If it were wheel hub bearings (front or rear) the sensation wouid be persistent through all speed/RPM and when leaning into a curve or turn, the affected bearing would growl louder.

If it were brake related, that sensation does not create a wafting feeling and it wouid be more present with a shimmy/shake while braking, being flat only in brake pedal and steering wheel.

--

The driveline vibe was best described as an airplane propeller sound - as the vehicle travels faster, the resonance or "wafting" sensation in interior got louder and was felt more intensely in the seat, steering wheel, floorpan, pedals, door (if arm is on door) and rear view mirror shake. It would be a consistent feeling during certain speed/RPM.

Also to note - the driveline vibe wouid also dissipate after the vehicle reached a certain speed. For example, in many instances the driveline vibe was more pronounced in the 40-65mph range and as the car reached 75-85mph, the sensation would subside. The same is true if coasting at or below 40mph, almost no vibe sensation.

My prior 2016 S550 fastback bought new in Dec. 2015 had the driveline vibe. That car was in for warranty work more days than I actually owned it. They tried road force balancing the original tires 3-4x, the driveshaft was balanced 1x and replaced 3x, the trans cross member was replaced, the trans flange and rear pinion flange was replaced, I even spent over $1k out of pocket on brand new tires to no avail, the car had 3 alignments, and eventually the entire rear diff was replaced (everything). Even after all of that, it still had the issue come back within less than 2k miles of the rear diff replacement. I finally did a Ford Buy Back, which landed me into my 2018, with no such issue.

I suggest that you request the Dealership install a set of NVH "ears" which is specialized equipment mounted to the underside of the vehicle to determine if the vibration is within spec of "allowable" NVH. They did this to my prior 2016 2x, each time it was beyond what was allowed. Even had (2) Ford FSE's sent to the Dealership confirming the tests were done properly and there was in fact some issue that could not be resolved, let alone lengthy time and calls into Ford Engineering Team.

 

[Scooles]

Thank you @Cobra Jet. I read your same post in another thread. My dealer is unwilling. Say the vibration is normal. It is not. So where do I turn? Afraid other dealers will say the same as no one wants to deal with driveline issues. Apparently.

 

[nustang]

out of round tires - had that 3 times on new tires. 2 of those were factory tires on new cars, once on replacement tires
out of round rims - had that once on new vehicle from factory,

These are easy to identify (if you are looking for them)

 

[noGreta!]

I have a similar thread going on - mine additionally has a slight shimmy.

Dealer claims "within spec" after a test drive without looking at anything.

I work too many hours every week and this is my only car so I can't waste my time with these unscrupulous and lackluster in work ethic dealers and their "mechanics" who can't even perform an oil change without damaging the cars.

I will likely attempt a wheel swap to see if it is wheel/tire related. -maybe you can try that with a friend that has a mustang.

A brand new VW Golf I once bought had the same issue and after new tires/wheels/alignments/road-force balancing and evaluation of all drive-line components, nothing changed. Traded it in for a WRX that was great.

Good luck and do update us if you happen to figure this out.

 

[IPOGT]

Question…I’ve been an enthusiast my entire life. Fourth Stang and over 40 cars.

I bought my 2019 GT premium vert about 4 weeks ago. My only other vert was a beautiful 2007 Saab 9-3 2.0T. Well, that’s if you don’t consider my Daihatsu Rocky a convertible (google it).

I realize verts aren’t as rigid as hardtops. And they experience “cowl” shake over bumps and uneven roads. However, my GT has what I believe to be a harmonic vibration at highway speeds. No shake at the steering wheel. I feel a high frequency vibration in the seat. At times, the inside rear view mirror vibrates as does the passenger seat. Is this normal for my car?

I took it the dealer and they had two techs and the service director drive it. The techs said it’s normal for the vert and the director said it’s the smoothest vert he’s ever driven.

Already eliminated the usual suspects…alignment and wheel balance. Alignment checked three times. New Contis and road force balance.

Am I just being a picky old man??

Any thoughts appreciated.

Call Ford and launch a complaint.

 

[IPOGT]

Thanks @Roger Blose. I had the vibration issue when I bought the car. It had two P Zeros and two no name Chinese tires on it. I replaced with a new set of Continental Extreme Contacts and had them road force balanced. I really think this is a driveline issue. The dealer is about as helpful as tits on a boar hog. How can I follow up with Ford Corporate? I’m going to need to get them involved apparently. I’ve seen a Ford rep on here named Deysha I think. How do I reach her? Seems odd really. There are such things as electronic vibration analyzers. I would like to think most techs have access to one. You can attach a sensor to something solid like the seat frame and the device will show frequency and amplitude of the vibration. From there the tech can tell if it’s motor mounts, drive shaft, u-joints, etc. I’m no tech and if I can research and learn this, wtf are they teaching techs these days?

Did you buy that car used? I see you have/had one of those HPP's?

 

[Cobra Jet]

Thank you @Cobra Jet. I read your same post in another thread. My dealer is unwilling. Say the vibration is normal. It is not. So where do I turn? Afraid other dealers will say the same as no one wants to deal with driveline issues. Apparently.

You can:
1) Call the Ford 800# and ask for a Regional Rep to start a Case. You will be given a Case ID # and the Rep will then work with the Service Center to get the problem resolved.

2) You can leave a negative survey with your Dealership. That will get elevated within Ford Corp. who will contact that Dealer Mgmnt. about the negative. The Dealership will reach out to you, asking what they can do to resolve the issue or to make you happy.

3) Go to another Ford Dealership within your region (if applicable). Even the Ford Rep. will recommend the same IF you cannot get proper repair or resolution at your current Service Center.

 

[sk47]

Hello; Many years ago I recall reading about a harmonic native to radial tires. Best i can recall it was a small but noticeable vibration at a particular speed range. Not an issue if you cruise above or below that particular range of speed. Best I can recall it was in the + or - 50 mph range.

Another thing i learned the hard way has to do with taking out and replacing a drive shaft. The trick is to mark the driveshaft so it is replaced in the same relative position. I had a car with a two-piece driveshaft and a center carrier bearing assembly. I put new universal joints on the ends of the shafts but failed to mark the position. Wound up with a high-speed vibration.

 

[Scooles]

Did you buy that car used? I see you have/had one of those HPP's?

yes. I traded my HPP for it at GrandPrairie Ford.

 

[Scooles]

You can:
1) Call the Ford 800# and ask for a Regional Rep to start a Case. You will be given a Case ID # and the Rep will then work with the Service Center to get the problem resolved.

2) You can leave a negative survey with your Dealership. That will get elevated within Ford Corp. who will contact that Dealer Mgmnt. about the negative. The Dealership will reach out to you, asking what they can do to resolve the issue or to make you happy.

3) Go to another Ford Dealership within your region (if applicable). Even the Ford Rep. will recommend the same IF you cannot get proper repair or resolution at your current Service Center.

I called Ford and they opened a case. They said nothing about a rep working my case to get it resolved. They only offered to find other dealers in my area. Totally useless as I can do that on my own.

 

[Scooles]

Hello; Many years ago I recall reading about a harmonic native to radial tires. Best i can recall it was a small but noticeable vibration at a particular speed range. Not an issue if you cruise above or below that particular range of speed. Best I can recall it was in the + or - 50 mph range.

Another thing i learned the hard way has to do with taking out and replacing a drive shaft. The trick is to mark the driveshaft so it is replaced in the same relative position. I had a car with a two-piece driveshaft and a center carrier bearing assembly. I put new universal joints on the ends of the shafts but failed to mark the position. Wound up with a high-speed vibration.

Old tires — vibration. New tires — vibration. I don’t think it’s tires. Or wheels. The car is practically brand new. Under 18k miles. I did buy used but doubt the driveshaft has been removed.

 

[jbeckva]

Usually resonance like that can be attributed to a driveline vibration, such as something in the rear diff (premature pinion bearing failure) or an issue with the driveshaft (out of balance).

The 2015-2017's were notorious for driveline vibes - so much so the one thread on this site is probably the anchor thread to end all threads on this site as far as reads, views and posts... LOL.
...

Hey not to hijack the thread too much, but CJ.. is THIS the sound you are referring to? Long story here, but it's heading BACK to the dealer tomorrow after me doing a LOT of research on my own after them failing to diagnose it in January..

(Yeah, don't mind the mess as it's a bit "in flux" right now..or that "big head" in the way LOL )

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