Roll Bar and Harness Recommendations

[rts9364]

I hit the 1/8 mile a couple of nights ago with my newish D-1X/E85 setup and after several runs was informed that I need a roll bar in order to come back. I know that implies a 5-point harness, too.

This is strictly a weekend/fun street car that I hope to take to the track (both 1/8 and 1/4) several times per season. I might get more serious after several years. I have two young boys; the oldest is 3-1/2 and loves riding in the car (backseat in a carseat). So...I can't justify permanently giving up my backseat for the time being.

With all of that said, I am thinking about trying to be legal down to 10.00 (6.40). I think the car will very possibly be capable of breaking into the 9s, but I just can't (won't) do a full cage right now. I am about to pull the trigger on the Watson 6-point bolt-in bar. I know it is a pain to bolt in a bar to prep for the track, but here we are. I think it would be worth it, all things considered.

Does anyone see a reason NOT to go with the Watson roll bar? Any other options worth considering? What about a good harness? I'd like to use both with the stock cloth seats for now, but I am open to different options there, too.

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[BDMACH1]

I hit the 1/8 mile a couple of nights ago with my newish D-1X/E85 setup and after several runs was informed that I need a roll bar in order to come back. I know that implies a 5-point harness, too.

This is strictly a weekend/fun street car that I hope to take to the track (both 1/8 and 1/4) several times per season. I might get more serious after several years. I have two young boys; the oldest is 3-1/2 and loves riding in the car (backseat in a carseat). So...I can't justify permanently giving up my backseat for the time being.

With all of that said, I am thinking about trying to be legal down to 10.00 (6.40). I think the car will very possibly be capable of breaking into the 9s, but I just can't (won't) do a full cage right now. I am about to pull the trigger on the Watson 6-point bolt-in bar. I know it is a pain to bolt in a bar to prep for the track, but here we are. I think it would be worth it, all things considered.

Does anyone see a reason NOT to go with the Watson roll bar? Any other options worth considering? What about a good harness? I'd like to use both with the stock cloth seats for now, but I am open to different options there, too.

Here is a good read for you @rts9364

https://www.dragzine.com/news/nhra-amends-roll-barcage-rules-for-08-later-street-vehicles/

 

[Jay-rod427]

The watson 6pt. Once you have the holes drilled and the backing plates in place it won't be that bad to remove it for the street duty. For non kid backseat duty in between weekends you can just remove the door bars only.

 

[Jay-rod427]

Here is a good read for you @rts9364

https://www.dragzine.com/news/nhra-amends-roll-barcage-rules-for-08-later-street-vehicles/

That's not entirely true. Only applies to oem supercharged/turbo applications. Aftermarket F/I defers back to 4 pt minimum on unaltered firewall and floor pans.

 

[rts9364]

That's not entirely true. Only applies to oem supercharged/turbo applications. Aftermarket F/I defers back to 4 pt minimum on unaltered firewall and floor pans.

Yep, agreed. Once anything is modified that exemption is gone. Isn't it a 5-pt minimum, though? (Roll bar with at least a driver door bar)

One more thing...does anyone know for sure what size tubing the Watson 6pt CM bar uses? When I read the NHRA rules section 4:10, it seems like 1.75" OD x 0.083" is required (0.118" if MS). The Watson website description shows the tubing as 1.625" OD. The installation instructions on the Watson site seem to hint around that it is 1.75". I'm assuming the 1.625" on the main site is just a typo. I can't get a hold of anyone at Watson to get an answer. I talked to someone at LMR earlier today and he was saying that it is indeed 1.625" because that is allowed in the roll CAGE section of NHRA (4:11 figures). I don't buy it, but I could be wrong. I am sure Watson is using whatever is legal, but I want to know what that is before I put down my $$$. A bunch of other vendors have further conflicting info on their sites, even though they are presumably all getting the same stuff direct shipped from Watson.

 

[rts9364]

I found out today that the Watson 6-point bolt-in roll bar is indeed made from 1.625" x 0.083 CM tubing. This does not meet NHRA requirements in a bolt-in application. According to Watson, it does meet the rules if it's welded in. I'm not sure I fully agree with that last part yet, but that's what they said. It is clear in the book that 1.625" OD is sufficient for a full cage, but I don't see how that ties into or applies to the roll bar section, regardless of attachment method.

So they sell a bolt-in roll bar that doesn't meet NHRA sub-11.50 rules unless it's welded into the car. Hmm. Watson claim they've been using 1.625" tubing for roll bars for 20 years and never heard of a tech problem.

So, I am still thinking about this. I will probably still end up using it...I don't think any of the tracks I go to will bust out calipers to measure tubing OD. Just hate to drop the coin and STILL not technically be legal to run 10's.

 

[Jay-rod427]

I read the latest NHRA rule book and that is what it states. Pretty gray verbiage, But that's what it says. I agree short of some national NHRA event there is no way tech will ever get wound up about the bar diameter. I still absolutely plan on putting the watson 6 in my car next year! lol

I'm sure watson uses 1.625 as that is acceptable for a full cage, and this 6pt is the foundation and exact same for their other cages.

 

[rts9364]

I read the latest NHRA rule book and that is what it states. Pretty gray verbiage, But that's what it says. I agree short of some national NHRA event there is no way tech will ever get wound up about the bar diameter. I still absolutely plan on putting the watson 6 in my car next year! lol

I'm sure watson uses 1.625 as that is acceptable for a full cage, and this 6pt is the foundation and exact same for their other cages.

Yes, correct. Watson uses 1.625 for their cages, and it doesn't make sense for them to stock 1.75" material (and tooling) just for this one application.

A salesman might tell you that because it's 1.625, the 6-point bar could be turned into a cage one day. Maybe that is technically correct, but not realistic. Watson told me the geometry is quite different and a person would be much better off selling the 6-point bar and starting fresh for an 8.50 cage.

 

[Barrel]

Well for what it's worth I have the Watson 4-point with 1.75" tubing in red. It's a very nice piece.

I also use the RaceQuip 5-Point harness with camlock and the UPR bracket: http://www.uprproducts.com/mustang-crotch-strap-bracket-05.html.

 

[rts9364]

Well for what it's worth I have the Watson 4-point with 1.75" tubing in red. It's a very nice piece.

I also use the RaceQuip 5-Point harness with camlock and the UPR bracket: http://www.uprproducts.com/mustang-crotch-strap-bracket-05.html.

If it's a Watson then it's 1.625" tubing. That's what Watson told me, anyway.

I also got the same RaceQuip harness and the UPR bracket in this week! It looks to be a pretty easy setup, even with a stock seat. Roll bar should be here today.

 

[Barrel]

If it's a Watson then it's 1.625" tubing. That's what Watson told me, anyway.

I also got the same RaceQuip harness and the UPR bracket in this week! It looks to be a pretty easy setup, even with a stock seat. Roll bar should be here today.

It's listed as 1.75 and I have an H3R fire extinguisher mount for 1.75 tubing that is a very snug fit, almost doesn't fit.

 

[rts9364]

It's listed as 1.75 and I have an H3R fire extinguisher mount for 1.75 tubing that is a very snug fit, almost doesn't fit.

My bad. I was talking about CM tubing. Is yours mild steel/DOM? I think they use 1.75 in MS but not CM.

 

[Barrel]

My bad. I was talking about CM tubing. Is yours mild steel/DOM? I think they use 1.75 in MS but not CM.

Ah yes, my bar is DOM, not chromoly.

 

[drive_55_not]

If it's a Watson then it's 1.625" tubing. That's what Watson told me, anyway.

I also got the same RaceQuip harness and the UPR bracket in this week! It looks to be a pretty easy setup, even with a stock seat. Roll bar should be here today.

I've got the Maximum Motorsports 6pt roll bar in my blown 3v, runs 6,50's on the 1/8th and track tech has never checked my bar, Around me even on the fast cars all they look for is the 8.50 SFI cert tag which is certified by a NHRA certified chassis guy, not the track guys.

All tracks are different so it's best to ask your's what they want.

Looking at the Watson bar, bolt in to the floor is legal , bar diameter not withstanding, but in order for it to be NHRA legal you'd need to weld the bolted together joints for the rear hoop supports, and I'd highly recommend installing swingout's for the door bars, Unless you're a small framed guy it's a major PITA [and back] crawling in/out over the door bar.


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[rts9364]

I've got the Maximum Motorsports 6pt roll bar in my blown 3v, runs 6,50's on the 1/8th and track tech has never checked my bar, Around me even on the fast cars all they look for is the 8.50 SFI cert tag which is certified by a NHRA certified chassis guy, not the track guys.

All tracks are different so it's best to ask your's what they want.

Looking at the Watson bar, bolt in to the floor is legal , bar diameter not withstanding, but in order for it to be NHRA legal you'd need to weld the bolted together joints for the rear hoop supports, and I'd highly recommend installing swingout's for the door bars, Unless you're a small framed guy it's a major PITA [and back] crawling in/out over the door bar.


.

Yeah, the owner of the 1/8 track where I was basically told me to go get a bolt-in bar when he told me I had to have one. I am not worried about that track; I think any bar is a good bar there. It's a very small town, etc. I am more concerned with some of the bigger tracks around that are 1/4, but the reality is if/when I get this setup dialed in I am not going to be happy until I break 9.99 causing any roll bar discussions to be moot. I am already pretty easily flirting with 135 in the 1/4 anyway. (105+ in the 1/8 with the trans short-shifting)

Yep, welding the rear bars to the hoop is something else that isn't made entirely clear with the "full bolt in option." I wonder if the bar can be removed with the rear bars attached (welded)?

I know door swingouts are nice, but this bar will be just a track day thing for me, so it won't be in the car much for things like going to the store or taking my wife to dinner. Still, I have started to look at those carbon fiber bar covers since I can see the driver's bar getting scratched/knicked climbing over it at the track.

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