Procharger Stage 2 Install

[gqneon]

Late finding this threar

I'm a little late finding this thread but I was pointed here by Phil. Let me share my ProCharger experience so far.

I too installed a Procharger Stage 2 kit with an upgraded D1SC head unit. I found the belt included with stage 2 to be entirely too short and had 3 conversations with their tech about it, once before trying it, once after shredding the first belt immediately on startup because of excessive tension, and once again after they assured me it was right and shredding my spare I had bought of the same type and size. I then went to O'Reillys and bought belts in .5" increments longer and found 68.5"(1740mm) to be perfect, as opposed to the 66.9" they put in the kit (1700mm) That's what I'm now running with zero issues. ( I ordered Bando 8PK1740 8-rib belts which are on there now for clarification.)

I too blew off an intercooler hose on the passenger side, after finding that hose to be just a tad too short to really reach without straining. I installed a silicone hump hose to the IC, a 3.5" OD aluminum connector with beaded ends, and then mated it to the kit hose on that side after trimming it back to fit correctly. No issues with that now, and it's clearly making boost.

I also had two conversations about the 3.5" inlet hose to the blower being WAY TOO SMALL. I used heat, windex, stretching, picks, screwdrivers, brute force, and threats of harm to all components present. I ended up having to shave the inside of the hose inlet area with a razor knife tiny increments at a time to get it on. If it ever pops off, I have no idea what I'm going to do about it. I'm trying to source a 3.75" coupler which would match the OD of the inlet perfectly, but have been unsuccessful finding a silicone replacement. I may get a 90* rubber 3.75 hose instead, but want the silicone version if possible. ProCharger insists, like the belt, that it's the perfect fit. I hadn't installed the other silicone tube, so I tried both and measured both and found both to have 3.5" ID on both ends, so it was the part they meant to send.

I ALSO have a Lund remote tune. We got through three revisions, but put it on a dyno for 5th gear pulls yesterday. It doesn't help that the dyno shop I've been using doesn't have a boost module for the dyno, so I used a cheap mechanical gauge. It showed 10-11psi at 7200. So the install is absolutely holding manifold pressure.

The first pull put down 562rwhp and 440 rwtq. Watching my boost gauge it looks like it put down a little over 10psi at redline. Everything on the graph looks great with about 19 degrees until about 4400 rpm, then it quickly dials out timing down to 12.5 degrees. That's HUGE! I'm guessing if I can get past the knock sensor / timing issues, then it's going to put down much more. Lund says these cars take 17-18 degrees on 9-10psi all the time without issue. So fuel or sensor issue I guess? Like the OP I'm seeing about 12 degrees where it matters, the only difference is I routed my PCV and IMRC valving per the book with no deviations, so I don't believe I have any potential underlying issues with my IMRC from potential physical damage from his initial configuration he mentioned. I think this info is useful because I'm seeing the same timing WITHOUT the potential IMRC damage.

I installed the kit myself and used ID1000's and a JMS FuelMax, set to default 25/50% activation at 18v. Car is definitely not lean, about 12.0 on the wideband at the dyno although that wideband could be off some according to the dyno guy, since he said my car has 4 wideband sensors on it which would likely give it better accuracy.

It made about 10-11psi on a regular pull, but when the dyno guy started the car for pull 2, it activated the advancetrak warning system and he didn't know how to clear it and didn't want to unstrap it to drive it 25 feet to clear it (which is what it takes and it cleared the instant I got it into first and started rolling the front tires leaving the shop. ) That pull it hit every bit of 12-13psi towards peak, but made less than stock hp because I'm sure the TB or runner valves probably were partially shut because of the advancetrak warning being on.

We tuned one at 11.5psi, and it made 710whp. We work with Lund. The car drives fine, and make a ton of power.

I would drive my car to Boostworks RIGHT NOW if I thought you could give me a some dyno time and get me over this timing hump. It could be fuel, it could be a sensor too. I have a 2.5" Ford Racing Street cat-back and it's a little raspy towards middle-high rpm and I can't help but think it's potentially throwing enough vibration to piss off the sensors, but would hate to go back to stock exhaust.

So I'm in a hold till I hear back from Lund. Maybe he can shed some light?

He told me that the ProFlow valve surging is typical of these ProCharger kits. I have the stock black ProFlow valve installed and it works fine but anytime you're driving near 0 vacuum (read about 5 inches or less vacuum by factory gauge) it surges like it wants to go, then falls back, then forward, then back. He mentioned the red valve doesn't seem to do this, but maybe that's not been everyone's experience here from reading this thread.

He mentioned being able to mask some of the surging in the tune, but only to a degree. He also noted that I'm only holding (in 3rd pulls anyway) about 14-15 degrees timing, and should be about 17-18. I am running Brisk RR14YS plugs (1 range colder, silver electrode, 0.035 gap, no CEL's and no detected misfires). 93 Octane fuel from QuickTrip (QT) all the time, which is supposed to be a guaranteed gas.

I'm thinking about my order of attack being finding a can of Torco to dump in or a tank of 100 octane and putting it on a dyno again. Then maybe swapping out the exhaust back to stock. Then... hell I don't know.

This exact build tuned by the same guy has a video on youtube putting down another 90 hp and 60 lb/ft that was put together by Evolution performance.

I don't get it. I didn't skimp on anything so I wouldn't have any regrets. It's too early to have regrets in this build.

Hope my experience helps or correlates to some of the info in this thread.

Sponsored

 

[Phils15GT]

Op ran breathers and capped off a imrc vac line. This most likely caused a mechanical failure.

Just to clarify. Yes, I did do this. That's after I called procharger tech and a gentlemen on other end said it would be fine to cap off the IMRC line coming off of the Y as that's what a lot of guys are doing. Gave that a go and it didn't work well.

 

[socalsnake]

Hope all of you get the issues worked out. Power output potential looks fantastic.

Really looking hard at ProCharger's offerings, but gonna hold off for now.

Watching everyone's progress intently.

 

[ProChargerTECH]

I too installed a Procharger Stage 2 kit with an upgraded D1SC head unit. I found the belt included with stage 2 to be entirely too short and had 3 conversations with their tech about it, once before trying it, once after shredding the first belt immediately on startup because of excessive tension, and once again after they assured me it was right and shredding my spare I had bought of the same type and size. I then went to O'Reillys and bought belts in .5" increments longer and found 68.5"(1740mm) to be perfect, as opposed to the 66.9" they put in the kit (1700mm) That's what I'm now running with zero issues.

This is interesting, your case of this is the only one noted in the system.
Just talked to the techs about this. We are looking into why the variance.

I too blew off an intercooler hose on the passenger side, after finding that hose to be just a tad too short to really reach without straining. I installed a silicone hump hose to the IC, a 3.5" OD aluminum connector with beaded ends, and then mated it to the kit hose on that side after trimming it back to fit correctly. No issues with that now, and it's clearly making boost.

The hoses we send are not trimmed in any manor.
Most people complain they are to long actually.

I also had two conversations about the 3.5" inlet hose to the blower being WAY TOO SMALL. I used heat, windex, stretching, picks, screwdrivers, brute force, and threats of harm to all components present. I ended up having to shave the inside of the hose inlet area with a razor knife tiny increments at a time to get it on. If it ever pops off, I have no idea what I'm going to do about it. I'm trying to source a 3.75" coupler which would match the OD of the inlet perfectly, but have been unsuccessful finding a silicone replacement. I may get a 90* rubber 3.75 hose instead, but want the silicone version if possible. ProCharger insists, like the belt, that it's the perfect fit. I hadn't installed the other silicone tube, so I tried both and measured both and found both to have 3.5" ID on both ends, so it was the part they meant to send.

Yes we send a 3.5", same as we have on C7's since that kit was released.
We never changed it, since no C7 customers have ever complained about it.

HOWEVER, we may look into changing that.
Just didn't have a reason since no corvette guys said anything.
(we install them here, its tight but they go on)

I ALSO have a Lund remote tune. We got through three revisions, but put it on a dyno for 5th gear pulls yesterday. It doesn't help that the dyno shop I've been using doesn't have a boost module for the dyno, so I used a cheap mechanical gauge. It showed 10-11psi at 7200. So the install is absolutely holding manifold pressure.

The first pull put down 562rwhp and 440 rwtq. Watching my boost gauge it looks like it put down a little over 10psi at redline. Everything on the graph looks great with about 19 degrees until about 4400 rpm, then it quickly dials out timing down to 12.5 degrees. That's HUGE! I'm guessing if I can get past the knock sensor / timing issues, then it's going to put down much more. Lund says these cars take 17-18 degrees on 9-10psi all the time without issue. So fuel or sensor issue I guess?

If the knock sensor is pulling timing, look towards fuel quality.
If the timing is backing down itself, the ECU might be limiting power.
Either way, very low power numbers for that boost level.
Once the timing is in place, and the car is "happy" you will be golden.

Car is definitely not lean, about 12.0 on the wideband at the dyno although that wideband could be off some according to the dyno guy, since he said my car has 4 wideband sensors on it which would likely give it better accuracy.

The car will correct with the front two widebands, to what the tune commands. Unless something has been deactivated, or royally messed up. I would trust the car's sensors more then a dyno's. (unless they use a calibrated lab grade sensor)

It made about 10-11psi on a regular pull, but when the dyno guy started the car for pull 2, it activated the advancetrak warning system and he didn't know how to clear it and didn't want to unstrap it to drive it 25 feet to clear it (which is what it takes and it cleared the instant I got it into first and started rolling the front tires leaving the shop. ) That pull it hit every bit of 12-13psi towards peak, but made less than stock hp because I'm sure the TB or runner valves probably were partially shut because of the advancetrak warning being on.

???? Why was this on

Hitting the traction control button turns it off.
Holding it down, disables everything.
If it didn't disable, that usually points to ONE thing. Calibration error.

Worst case, all you had to do was pull the relay in the engine bay fuse box.
Instantly removes all traction control functions no matter what.
(I do this, to save me the hassle of hitting the button all the time)

He told me that the ProFlow valve surging is typical of these ProCharger kits. I have the stock black ProFlow valve installed and it works fine but anytime you're driving near 0 vacuum (read about 5 inches or less vacuum by factory gauge) it surges like it wants to go, then falls back, then forward, then back. He mentioned the red valve doesn't seem to do this, but maybe that's not been everyone's experience here from reading this thread.

If the car does that with the proflow, it will do it with the race valve.
It is in the tune, our cars did it in the beginning.
The latest revision removes 99% of that condition. (no valve change)

Others that have custom tuned their cars, also have resolved this.
Without changing the valve out. (that valve flows a LOT of air)
Remember same valve used on 2011-2014 Stangs with same motor.
(and LOTS of boost, and power)

The blower actually turns SLOWER on the 2015's, due to the revisions Ford made with the motor, so thus its actually less CFM for the valve to handle.

He also noted that I'm only holding (in 3rd pulls anyway) about 14-15 degrees timing, and should be about 17-18. I am running Brisk RR14YS plugs (1 range colder, silver electrode, 0.035 gap, no CEL's and no detected misfires). 93 Octane fuel from QuickTrip (QT) all the time, which is supposed to be a guaranteed gas.

This exact build tuned by the same guy has a video on youtube putting down another 90 hp and 60 lb/ft that was put together by Evolution performance.

Something is very fishy here.
- your low timing value
- your low power numbers
- your advanced track light coming on

Solving the timing, and advance track issue will likely also result in the power numbers coming WAY up.

 

[ProChargerTECH]

Hope all of you get the issues worked out. Power output potential looks fantastic.

Really looking hard at ProCharger's offerings, but gonna hold off for now.

Watching everyone's progress intently.

Why hold off?
This thread is about cars having issues that have been custom tuned.

We have tons and tons of happy customers making killer power with our stock system and stock tunes.

Its easy:

Find a dealer of ours. (there is a few on here)
Order yourself an out of the box STG2 system.
Install it, load our supplied tune
Smile for days!

* I only said STG2, because well its not much more $$$, and the power increase is nice and potential down the road.

 

[Nemesys]

Tempted to return my ID1000s and Lund Tune and just ordering the additional stuff from Procharger instead to not deal with this right now.

 

[out of focus]

Think he might have Procharger's new tune.

no sir, Livernois Motorsports:first:

 

[ProChargerTECH]

For those that are not running our tune, here may be another source of contact info.
Thats good power for a DynoDynamics dyno. (and 8.8psi)

[ame]

 

[Chargedguard5.0]

For those that are not running our tune, here may be another source of contact info.
Thats good power for a DynoDynamics dyno. (and 8.8psi)

My question is why do you need a 3.6 pulley for 8lbs? The kit is advertised with 8lbs and comes with a 4.0 pulley. A 3.6 is dropping down 3 pulley sizes.

 

[tevol1]

Gqneon, sounds like it's knocking and throwing timing. I had to put torco in my 93 to keep it from doing this.

 

[gqneon]

HOWEVER, due to the 3-4 complains we have seen on this forum.
We are going to spend the $$$$ to have a custom silicon mold made.
To create the 3.75" tube that will be easier for install.

If so, please send me one or I will buy one outright.

???? Why was this on

Hitting the traction control button turns it off.
Holding it down, disables everything.
If it didn't disable, that usually points to ONE thing. Calibration error.

Worst case, all you had to do was pull the relay in the engine bay fuse box.
Instantly removes all traction control functions no matter what.
(I do this, to save me the hassle of hitting the button all the time)

He didn't know which fuse to pull since it isn't marked on the 2015. This same thing will happen if you tow the car any distance with the rear tires on the ground the next time you turn on the engine. I'm guessing it's because of the front tires being stopped from the last dyno pull, but I don't know since this was the first instance of that happening. The first pull had zero to do with the power numbers it put down, I believe. Advancetrak, for whatever reason, decided to kick in when it say the back tires had gone 150mph and the front hadn't turned any, I guess, although that's not happened to me before.

If the car does that with the proflow, it will do it with the race valve.
It is in the tune, our cars did it in the beginning.
The latest revision removes 99% of that condition. (no valve change)

Others that have custom tuned their cars, also have resolved this.
Without changing the valve out. (that valve flows a LOT of air)
Remember same valve used on 2011-2014 Stangs with same motor.
(and LOTS of boost, and power)

This is good to know, and sort of what I felt could be true after reading and thinking it through with my experiences with this. It does what its supposed to but light throttle and near boost driving is not enjoyable at all. I wonder what Lund could possibly do to fix this? I'm not a tuner, I don't know.

Something is very fishy here.
- your low timing value
- your low power numbers
- your advanced track light coming on

Solving the timing, and advance track issue will likely also result in the power numbers coming WAY up.

I agree, but I actually do not believe Advancetrak had anything to do with the first run. I think it's timing, and has lots more potential. The same guy (Lund) tuning an identical setup, it just seems odd that there can be such a huge range of power outputs. I'm not knocking Lund, I actually hope for all the best, but I'm hoping he gets back to me soon. Remote tuning has huge pitfalls, mostly the lengthy process of waiting to hear back and then finding time to go back and forth, especially with weekends being deal breakers. But I'm envious of the people who got their tunes to work so easily, since that doesn't sound like the norm. A basic Stage 1 or 2 kit would have put down this much power or more most likely with the canned tunes from ProCharger.

But again, its way too early for regret. I just want it to run like all all the advertising shows it should.

 

[gqneon]

Gqneon, sounds like it's knocking and throwing timing. I had to put torco in my 93 to keep it from doing this.

Thanks Tevo1, I am going to go look for a can right now. That or that mystical 100 octane pump somewhere in a nearby city. Why they don't advertise, I have no idea.

 

[gqneon]

My question is why do you need a 3.6 pulley for 8lbs? The kit is advertised with 8lbs and comes with a 4.0 pulley. A 3.6 is dropping down 3 pulley sizes.

I tried to link a page here but it doesn't seem to be working.

Google 2015 Mustang Procharger SVT Performance and pull up the stock HO kit they installed on the yellow 2015.

If you scroll to the bottom a stock HO kit on a 2015 barely broke 7psi at redline with stock pulley, as published in this test. It was a major factor in me deciding to go Stage 2 and D1.

 

[ProChargerTECH]

My question is why do you need a 3.6 pulley for 8lbs? The kit is advertised with 8lbs and comes with a 4.0 pulley. A 3.6 is dropping down 3 pulley sizes.

Easy...

1) Its only spinning to 6,900 (we normally spin them 7,200/7,300)
2) Cat back exhaust system (drops a little bit)
3) No cats (drops a little bit)

The main thing is the RPM though.

Stock exhaust, and spinning to the full max RPM.
It would make exactly the boost we say it does (with 4" pulley)
Just like every car that comes in here.

If so, please send me one or I will buy one outright.

He didn't know which fuse to pull since it isn't marked on the 2015.

Its in the owners manual

This same thing will happen if you tow the car any distance with the rear tires on the ground the next time you turn on the engine. I'm guessing it's because of the front tires being stopped from the last dyno pull, but I don't know since this was the first instance of that happening. The first pull had zero to do with the power numbers it put down, I believe. Advancetrak, for whatever reason, decided to kick in when it say the back tires had gone 150mph and the front hadn't turned any, I guess, although that's not happened to me before.

When the car is on the dyno, the car would have disabled the ABS, and Traction control, since it obviously knows the front wheels are turning. So even if you don't turn it off, it will eventually turn itself off. (which then you have no limiting of power, etc)

A basic Stage 1 or 2 kit would have put down this much power or more most likely with the canned tunes from ProCharger.

Most of the people that call in/email back report in the 560-580rwhp range on HO systems, and 600rwhp+ on STG2 kits. (canned tune, on good fuel)

But again, its way too early for regret. I just want it to run like all all the advertising shows it should.

Your tuner will get you handled, and you will be rocking and rolling!

 

[ProChargerTECH]

I tried to link a page here but it doesn't seem to be working.

Google 2015 Mustang Procharger SVT Performance and pull up the stock HO kit they installed on the yellow 2015.

If you scroll to the bottom a stock HO kit on a 2015 barely broke 7psi at redline with stock pulley, as published in this test. It was a major factor in me deciding to go Stage 2 and D1.

Old BETA kit,
Tune version one,
Speed Limiter is what limited boost/power. (look at the redline) ;)

Basically OLD OLD INFO


Thats the bad news about the internet, all the old info still stays around.
I have posted updated graphs on this forum, please review.
It shows boost level, rpm without speed limiter, and power numbers.

Sponsored