Need reliable fuel delivery?

[Aussie-up-north]

Made a post tuning forum.
this will be good for street car boosted people.

when idling I’m down to 3.8amps :-)

what’s your fore system at?


In search of the perfect fuel system for the s550 mustang has come to a end.

first of all… Fuelab is an amazing company to work with. I have had a few of their Prodigy pumps in the past and they have not let me down.
Im excited for the intank brushless future!

Issues we faced with the triple 450s or the 525s is now a thing of the past.

Issues that some people may not know about yet;

1. Brushed pumps causing issues with heat in the fuel and the potential of the pump prematurely wearing out causing a lean conditions.
2. Having to run no less the 1/2 tank to really make sure pumps are staying cool.
3. A crazy amount of amp draw taxing the alternator.
4. Poor flow control.
5. Noise.
6. And the potential of the hobbs switch not firing on pumps 2 and 3.

With the plastic fuel tanks we have, keeping fuel cool is very hard with high horsepower “brushed” pumps. Many of us have seen it where we get close to critical fuel conditions just by driving around before a race.

In the following set up i look at eliminating nearly all the problems that cause issues with fuelling.


Fuelab 49614 500lph brushless pumps (qty 2)

Fuelab 72002 PWM controllers (qty 2)

Fuelab 52902 Electronic fuel pressure regulator (qty 1)

Fuel hat.
-10 Carbon PTFE Stainless fuel hose.

-8 Carbon PTFE Stainless fuel hose.
Relays and power wire for the fuel pumps.

With the above system and utilizing the insane control of the Electronic Fuel Pressure Regulator it idle you will be only using just enough fuel to keep the fuel pressure at 55psi while limiting fuel returning to the tank by the pump speed being slowed down by the signals from the fuel pressure regulator. Soon as you think about touching the gas the response time of the piece will bring the pumps up to speed to again keep the fuel pressure where you need it without rail pressure drop!

This combined with being a brushless pump will keep the pumps and fuel as cool as possible no matter if you are at the traffic lights or at the big end of the track chasing a low 8 or faster!!
But! What if you need more fuel. Simple. Just add another 500L pump and controller and be fuelled to 1900WHP!

keep tuned for updates a I get this all dailed in.
Also for the fuel hat. It’s from SPE and the quality and price is on point. I did have to mill the hanger a little bit to get the pumps to fit nicely.

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[HKusp]

What is the total cost for this set-up?

 

[bankyf]

The 1/2 tank of fuel wasn't necessarily to keep the pumps cool and your setup will still require no less than a half tank of fuel. Aside from that, there is another thread in this forum with a very similar, but more complex setup. Interested to see how this all works out. I've had a complete return fuel system brand new in the box for almost a year that I have been on the fence about installing due to the sacrafices.

 

[Angrey]

I'm one of the first to run the Fuelab electronic regulator.

Brushless pumps + the electronic regulator eliminate many of the current flaws with high flow systems, but not all.

Naked pumps are a recipe for fuel starvation at low fuel levels and launch. This means you end up having to run at least 1/X fuel level to not risk starvation and voids.

Additionally, the current IRS setup means the system typically relies upon the puny siphon system to pull fuel from the passenger side to the active driver's side. This is problematic for a number of reasons. Under hard left turns and even moderate fuel levels, the fuel can flow over the center and away from the pumps and starve out. The siphon system moves fuel at a very pitiful rate back to the other side. The siphon system requires a secondary connection at at least one pump which acts like a "leak" in pump flow reducing pump output.

I'm running DW400 brushless (twins) in a Radium bucket (which acts as a miniature surge tank with a one way check valve at the bottom and and return and passive lift flow in the top. Additionally I ditched the siphon system and repurposed the siphon line with a pair of low draw lift pumps (each draw about 3.5 amps each) which flow 400 lph transferring flow from the passenger side directly into the active bucket. I also have a manual switch that allows the pumps to be activated or turned off.

The Fuelab Regulator and brushless pumps are a big leap. But there are other failings of the current market offerings. Those issues may or may not be important to others. If you run E85 and you don't like filling up every 70 miles and you want to be able to go WOT all the way down to 1/8 of a tank without worrying about lean conditions, if you want to be able to do more than straight line rips at 1/2 tank and turn the car and still suck continuous fuel, the other issues can be resolved.

 

[Angrey]

The hat cover looks interesting, never seen it before. I'm curious how the wiring bulkhead works and seals the wiring that passes through.

Radium's hats have insulated posts that are sealed that involve a ring connector on the top side with a nut and same on the bottom. Totally sealed and works great.

 

[LOL WUT]

OP this looks like a really well thought out system, nicely done!

For those commenting that this doesn’t fix the need to fill up frequency, what’s the actual fix for that?

I want to pull the trigger on going FI and run E85. For peace of mind and tuner expectations I’ll run a return fuel system. However, I don’t want to worry about fuel starvation issues and don’t know what the fix is for that.

 

[bankyf]

I'm one of the first to run the Fuelab electronic regulator.

Brushless pumps + the electronic regulator eliminate many of the current flaws with high flow systems, but not all.

Naked pumps are a recipe for fuel starvation at low fuel levels and launch. This means you end up having to run at least 1/X fuel level to not risk starvation and voids.

Additionally, the current IRS setup means the system typically relies upon the puny siphon system to pull fuel from the passenger side to the active driver's side. This is problematic for a number of reasons. Under hard left turns and even moderate fuel levels, the fuel can flow over the center and away from the pumps and starve out. The siphon system moves fuel at a very pitiful rate back to the other side. The siphon system requires a secondary connection at at least one pump which acts like a "leak" in pump flow reducing pump output.

I'm running DW400 brushless (twins) in a Radium bucket (which acts as a miniature surge tank with a one way check valve at the bottom and and return and passive lift flow in the top. Additionally I ditched the siphon system and repurposed the siphon line with a pair of low draw lift pumps (each draw about 3.5 amps each) which flow 400 lph transferring flow from the passenger side directly into the active bucket. I also have a manual switch that allows the pumps to be activated or turned off.

The Fuelab Regulator and brushless pumps are a big leap. But there are other failings of the current market offerings. Those issues may or may not be important to others. If you run E85 and you don't like filling up every 70 miles and you want to be able to go WOT all the way down to 1/8 of a tank without worrying about lean conditions, if you want to be able to do more than straight line rips at 1/2 tank and turn the car and still suck continuous fuel, the other issues can be resolved.

I have really wanted to go with the radium hat, regardless of what I do with the rest of my fuel system, but have heard rumor that they can be sucked dry and not allow fuel in at a fast enough rate in higher HP applications. Any thoughts on that?

 

[Aussie-up-north]

What is the total cost for this set-up?

Was not to bad. Fuelling is very important in these cars and I believe a lot of motors have been hurt from not having good fuel delivery

 

[Aussie-up-north]

The 1/2 tank of fuel wasn't necessarily to keep the pumps cool and your setup will still require no less than a half tank of fuel. Aside from that, there is another thread in this forum with a very similar, but more complex setup. Interested to see how this all works out. I've had a complete return fuel system brand new in the box for almost a year that I have been on the fence about installing due to the sacrafices.

I have hydra mats. I have no worry about fuel down to 1/8th but I’ll keep it to a 1/4 just to be safe

 

[Aussie-up-north]

I'm one of the first to run the Fuelab electronic regulator.

Brushless pumps + the electronic regulator eliminate many of the current flaws with high flow systems, but not all.

Naked pumps are a recipe for fuel starvation at low fuel levels and launch. This means you end up having to run at least 1/X fuel level to not risk starvation and voids.

Additionally, the current IRS setup means the system typically relies upon the puny siphon system to pull fuel from the passenger side to the active driver's side. This is problematic for a number of reasons. Under hard left turns and even moderate fuel levels, the fuel can flow over the center and away from the pumps and starve out. The siphon system moves fuel at a very pitiful rate back to the other side. The siphon system requires a secondary connection at at least one pump which acts like a "leak" in pump flow reducing pump output.

I'm running DW400 brushless (twins) in a Radium bucket (which acts as a miniature surge tank with a one way check valve at the bottom and and return and passive lift flow in the top. Additionally I ditched the siphon system and repurposed the siphon line with a pair of low draw lift pumps (each draw about 3.5 amps each) which flow 400 lph transferring flow from the passenger side directly into the active bucket. I also have a manual switch that allows the pumps to be activated or turned off.

The Fuelab Regulator and brushless pumps are a big leap. But there are other failings of the current market offerings. Those issues may or may not be important to others. If you run E85 and you don't like filling up every 70 miles and you want to be able to go WOT all the way down to 1/8 of a tank without worrying about lean conditions, if you want to be able to do more than straight line rips at 1/2 tank and turn the car and still suck continuous fuel, the other issues can be resolved.

Correct I have a lift pump in the passenger side since I had a fuelab 424 pump stuffed in the tank.

 

[Aussie-up-north]

I have really wanted to go with the radium hat, regardless of what I do with the rest of my fuel system, but have heard rumor that they can be sucked dry and not allow fuel in at a fast enough rate in higher HP applications. Any thoughts on that?

I sucked it dry with two

The hat cover looks interesting, never seen it before. I'm curious how the wiring bulkhead works and seals the wiring that passes through.

Radium's hats have insulated posts that are sealed that involve a ring connector on the top side with a nut and same on the bottom. Totally sealed and works great.

its really sweet. Look up SPE fuel hat :-)

 

[Aussie-up-north]

What is the total cost for this set-up?

Cheaper than a Walbor pump cooking at WOT :-

 

[Angrey]

I have hydra mats. I have no worry about fuel down to 1/8th but I’ll keep it to a 1/4 just to be safe

Are your hydramats working? The TMO crowd it's hit or miss.

 

[Angrey]

I sucked it dry with two

its really sweet. Look up SPE fuel hat :-)

I put down 1100 rear on E85 with two DW440's in a Radium bucket. That was without the lift pumps running.

 

[Angrey]

Correct I have a lift pump in the passenger side since I had a fuelab 424 pump stuffed in the tank.

How are you controlling it? The DW Micros I have can allegedly (according to DW) run for an hour dry and still keep going. But I don't like the idea of them running dry or cavitating. Not sure they'd last very long. Once the passenger side is drawn completely down (1/2 tank with all of it on the driver's side) I'm not a fan of the manual switch. I tried an Autometer Elite Pro Control gauage, but it's not working quite how I want it.

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