Concerned about rotating assembly

[Livernois Motorsports]

How do you retune with the use of datalogs for the car? I'm seriously curious about that.

I bought a Cobb AP, but the only things that kept me from buying your tuner was 1) I wanted my tunes to be optimized for my car....

When it comes to retuning, all that we need to do is get us your octane and list of mods. Obviously we would already have your strategy and software ID, because you would have boughten our MyCalibrator tuning interface. So, we use our car as the test mule and install random mods with various strategies and tune away. That is the perk of using our own cars, software and hardware. We can make ourselves the guinea pig. We have a stable (no pun intended, I promise) of our own cars that we test on. Everything from an XTS-V to our now famous S550! Those are the giant differences between us and most everyone else. We actually own the same cars that you guys do. So testing is easy for us, as we do not need a log to make educated guesses if you will. With a log you are asking for a reference or a starting point to tune from, because they do not have the ability or experience to do it all in-house.

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[tittermary]

Understood, but to try and blame us for not sharing our success without patronizing us makes no sense. And that is what we find frustrating. We we are here to try to provide all of the support for building the best and most reliable vehicles on the street, strip and/or track.

We know that our tuning, bolt-ons and internal upgrades will produce great dividends. We offer tons of flexibility. We can retune for almost any major upgrade that you make at no extra cost to you.

I have your tune and am trying to get it updated for the intercooler that just installed but I was told there wasnt any. Not complaining at all tune is awesome but not sure I understand how it's possable that there are no tune changes to take advantage of the greatly reduced intake temps?

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

...And 2) I have 15 gallons of MS109 in my outbuilding and would love to have had the race gas tune...but people said that you guys were sternly against releasing it because a lot of people doesn't have access to VP fuels....

We can absolutely tune for the VPR fuels! We ran MS109 in our car for our race tune. We prefer our clients to run their fuels as they as always the exact same every time.

 

[EcoSwag1990]

I do feel confident that you guys have the best OTS tune available and would do just fine making tuning tweaks for really popular bolt ons with this tuning strategy.

I hope you plan to upgrade this dated tuning device some time soon though. Pretty much all of the big tuners have their own EBs btw

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

I have your tune and am trying to get it updated for the intercooler that just installed but I was told there wasnt any. Not complaining at all tune is awesome but not sure I understand how it's possable that there are no tune changes to take advantage of the greatly reduced intake temps?

Your turbo is not thermally inefficient, and that is part of the reason why there is not have a major update for your upgraded FMIC. Our tunes already has the logic to make modifications to the tune with your better and colder air density.

 

[tittermary]

Your turbo is not thermally inefficient, and that is part of the reason why there is not have a major update for your upgraded FMIC. Our tunes already has the logic to make modifications to the tune with your better and colder air density.

Works for me, I also have your thermostats . I will be hiting the track this weekend and we shall see what's up, I will say car feels strong, I had a 2013 that ran 10.60's so I'm not new this. This car feels like bottom 12's, my dr's won't be here till 18 so I am stuck with street tires but still should be able to get an idea

 

[DanFish]

Livernois so what engine parts would you say should be upgraded if I want to make big power safely?

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

I do feel confident that you guys have the best OTS tune available and would do just fine making tuning tweaks for really popular bolt ons with this tuning strategy.

I hope you plan to upgrade this dated tuning device some time soon though. Pretty much all of the big tuners have their own EBs btw

Thank you Eco.

I don't think that you guys know this, but we have actually tried to "monitor everything" style tuning interfaces. They provided more problems than solutions. Because everyone wanted to provide us with the info that they got from the device, and we would have to edify them that the info there is for a reference, not tune building. Nobody that is experienced with the EB platform will argue that the sample rates and PIDS are terrible. A lot of the information that is displayed or logged is inaccurate. Accurate enough to provide a tuner with a good starting point? Yes.

But, we would rather use the strategy that we have proven works better for years now. Again, we are not "dissing" or "calling out" any other companies that use the logging route. Every company just like every person has their preference and way of doing things.

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

Works for me, I also have your thermostats . I will be hiting the track this weekend and we shall see what's up, I will say car feels strong, I had a 2013 that ran 10.60's so I'm not new this. This car feels like bottom 12's, my dr's won't be here till 18 so I am stuck with street tires but still should be able to get an idea

Take some video, we would love to see it!!!!!

Too bad on your DR's a little drifting never hurt anyone lol!

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

Livernois so what engine parts would you say should be upgraded if I want to make big power safely?

Depends on what you call big power, honestly. That is fairly subjective. Just as an educated guess because there is not a ton of data out there, we recommend that the rotating assembly be upgraded if you are looking to make about 400 wheel. Our the shortblock is good to about 750 wheel.

 

[04SloSnake]

I would venture that 80% of my decision to buy my car was based upon what you did with yours. That is a fact, and I have no reason to lie. Like the OP, I figured 10's were an easily obtainable goal based on what you did with your car and mostly stock parts. After talking to you, I did not get the impression that tune was going out to the public.

So, maybe saying you "suckered" people into buying these cars is a bit dramatic. I will concede that. However, your videos have sold quite a few cars, I guarantee that.

Mike

If it makes you feel any better, your car convinced me to order the EB. I don't necessarily trust vendor runs because they seem to good to be true but your car was proof how easy mid-12's was. Fortunately for me I'm only shooting for high 11's to low 12's out of this car.

 

[Apwrx]

If it makes you feel any better, your car convinced me to order the EB. I don't necessarily trust vendor runs because they seem to good to be true but your car was proof how easy mid-12's was. Fortunately for me I'm only shooting for high 11's to low 12's out of this car.

I think those are realistic goals. 10's easily and reliably not so much
A boosted v8 is the option for those goals IMO. Although not cheap

 

[04SloSnake]

I think those are realistic goals. 10's easily and reliably not so much
A boosted v8 is the option for those goals IMO. Although not cheap

I'm really hoping the FFTEC turbo setup will be similar to doing a K04 swap on a GTI and be a simple bolt on and go. I would rather not crack the motor open until much later in its life.

 

[JJ@WMS]

You will be fine, I commented in the stock rod limit thread with our findings. Proper upgrades, proper tuning, you will be fine.

Cliff Notes: We have over 300 pulls on our Ecoboost Mustang now, about 90% of them are over 400ft/lbs of torque and there is no knock or failure.

And yours is an unloaded or loaded Dynojet dyno?

JJ

Considering I have asked MAP twice about the dyno they use and they have not answered I will let everyone know why I'm asking the question.

They have stated they have hundreds of dyno pulls done to their EB Mustang with "no failures or knock".

Hundreds of pulls on an unloaded dyno honestly doesnt mean squat and thats coming from a company that has an unloaded dyno jet dyno ourselves.

Unless your able to induce a load, other then the weight of the rollers themselves then you can do thousands of pulls, add timing, lean it out etc... etc... etc... with no problems because there is very little to no load on the engine/drivetrain.

I've dyno'd hundreds of vehicles over the last 15 years and never had a single problem or hurt anything doing so. When a vehicle does get hurt or damage occurs its almost always at the track or on the road under high load. That is why every single vehicle that we tune gets road test tuned before it ever hits the dyno. Thats to ensure its loaded properly and tuned for the real world, the dyno is just used for numbers and to make small changes to the tune in a controlled environment.

So unless MAP does have a load based dyno jet saying you have made hundreds of pulls on a particular vehicle is a moot point when it comes to discussing whether or not a vehicles rotating assembly is going to survive abuse/tuning or whatever.

JJ

 

[greg hazlett]

Considering I have asked MAP twice about the dyno they use and they have not answered I will let everyone know why I'm asking the question.

They have stated they have hundreds of dyno pulls done to their EB Mustang with "no failures or knock".

Hundreds of pulls on an unloaded dyno honestly doesnt mean squat and thats coming from a company that has an unloaded dyno jet dyno ourselves.

Unless your able to induce a load, other then the weight of the rollers themselves then you can do thousands of pulls, add timing, lean it out etc... etc... etc... with no problems because there is very little to no load on the engine/drivetrain.

I've dyno'd hundreds of vehicles over the last 15 years and never had a single problem or hurt anything doing so. When a vehicle does get hurt or damage occurs its almost always at the track or on the road under high load. That is why every single vehicle that we tune gets road test tuned before it ever hits the dyno. Thats to ensure its loaded properly and tuned for the real world, the dyno is just used for numbers and to make small changes to the tune in a controlled environment.

So unless MAP does have a load based dyno jet saying you have made hundreds of pulls on a particular vehicle is a moot point when it comes to discussing whether or not a vehicles rotating assembly is going to survive abuse/tuning or whatever.

JJ

Good question!

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