Cobb or Bama

[Livernois Motorsports]

I'm with you to an extent. I feel like it will still be able to be accomplished. We have cooling issues, fueling issues, and turbo size issues. So far, nothing has been tested on the internals (that we know of)....

We will be releasing something soon.

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[greg hazlett]

I think people's menstrual cycles are syncing in this subforum. Watch out for bears.

Nope, he is spot on.

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

But WE can't, right? So, it is basically a test of faith. We can't see the data, and if we access it...you will assert it is corrupt and unreliable because the consumer does not have access to the OEM level hardware you do? Meanwhile, you are all over the board telling everyone how your systems are so much more advanced than every other system available and that you have worked around every known issue. You even have guys like Anthony, who does not even own an EcoBoost Mustang, who come here and prop you up. I find it disingenuous.

I am at a personal crossroads. I don't trust this platform. I am 100% honest when I state that I bought this car because YOU ran an 11.8 with yours, on a tune and a tire. I figured that was the tip of the iceburg and we would see low 11's come and go, then the 10's....on a stock engine. What I did not realize, and what many here probably don't realize, was that that was not the tip..that was, for all intents and purposes, the whole freaking thing. Without seriously bolstering the strength of this platform, those results are not going to be repeatable with any ease. And, they were done with a kill tune on one of VP's leanest burning, most volatile unleaded fuels. There is reason why you have rods and pistons, as well as shortblocks and longblocks, in the pipeline. I want to see a repeatable, safe tune and tire car that can run 11's like you did with a stock longblock.

It is not going to happen.

Mike

Mike,

Our track record with EcoBoost vehicles speaks for itself. We don't relelase our data, and keep things to ourselves because frankly, no one else has it figured out like we do. We prove this every time we lay our hands on an EcoBoost.

What I am confused on is if you bought the car because of what we did with it, why isn't anything we make for it on your car?

I think people forget the time table that we had with our car, but maybe this will help with that:

10-14-14 got the car, baselined it

10-16-14 baselined the car at the track

10-17-14 started tuning the car

10-29-14 ran 12's at the track right off of the street with just our 93 octane tune and a drag radial on a heavy 20" wheel

11-2-14 ran 12.1 at the track with the same tune, but a full slick and skinny setup and removing the passenger seat

11-5-14 went 11.8 with MS109 (a fuel we use all of the time for builds, never have we ran into it being volatile) and removed cat-back, with stock downpipe, removed passenger seat

11-7-14 started test fitting car for other upgrades, namely our Windstorm cai and EvenFlo thermostat

11-11-14 car shipped to NY for ARH to start developing our Thunderstorm modular Turbo back Exhaust upgrades

12-08-14 car returned from NY with exhaust on it

12-09-14 Final production EvenFlo thermostat installed, car cleaned and detailed

12-09-14 car loaded into trailer for PRI trade show

12-10-14 car put on display at PRI trade show

12-15-14 car returned from trade show

12-17-14 Windstorm intake prototype installed

12-19-14 further tuning work in process to cover additional strategy codes and to develop cals for new upgrades released by us

and that is where the car still is today so we can properly tune for all combination of mods, for all different strategy codes.

So we have been isntalling and uninstallign components on the car to build tunes for these mods and test them all along the way

The car is here for anyone to check out in person, but we have a thing called winter here, which means tracks close down from november until april, and means we can't go out and show track results from these upgrades because the track is closed.

We have shortblocks, internal upgrades, and long blocks in the pipeline because we want to see this platform grown, and we are an engine manufacturing company, so of course we are going to work on engine upgrades. If you would like to come check out our car, see there isn't a bolt that has been touched on it outside of intake, thermostat, and exhaust you are welcome to. It would also let you see the 2 development engines we have for upgrades, and see that it's the original engine in our car.

We continue to do the hard work for customers on their cars, rather than what the rest of the industry does by making customer's the test bed. I am not certain why it's seen as incorrect, but that is why you don't find Livernois tuned cars with popped engines like you do with other companies.

I truly apologize if that seems cocky, condescending, curt, or anything else offensive, but we are legitimately trying to protect people's cars, even if we haven't sold them a thing, but somehow are getting painted as a villain instead.

We have been open and honest about what tunes we have released, are working on releasing, and will never release. We want to see more upgrades come out, but fear all of these other tunes floating around are going to kill the momentum for these cars.

 

[mbreinin]

Eh, to hell with it. I am tired of arguing.

 

[Tcnarber]

Since I have taken it upon myself to be the jerk here, I might as well live up to it. People are complaining about spending $1500 on a full exhaust system, and you have a $2400 offering. I don't care if it is crafted in the halls of Valhalla from a cache of stainless steel forged from Thor's own hammer...it is overpriced.


Mike

That is one of the funniest things I have ever read in my life..... Valhalla and Thor all in one.

 

[cosmo]

Mike... You have unrealistic expectations of aftermarket progression for this platform. The coyote motor has barely changed and I doubt much of the ECU for that engine platform has either. That's why you are seeing all the superchargers and everything already out. This is a new engine, and isn't a simple modified carryover motor like the 5.0L is. It's the bump up of the Focus ST engine in every way. That requires development time. I bet you'll be seeing some bolt on 11s Ecoboosts come summertime. You're already in mid twelves with just a tune and tires and an intake that barely does anything. Get a high flow cat downpipe, or something of that sort with a meth kit and intercooler. Woodbine has a downpipe for sub $300, many intercoolers are around $3-500, and meth kits are around $400. You can work with Torrie and I guarantee that will be enough to get you where you want, without touching the inside of the engine.

Have patience.

 

[SloS14]

First Livernois forces a guy to buy a car against his will, NOW they are making him buy a $2400 exhaust. I'm fed up with this company already.

 

[mbreinin]

Mike... You have unrealistic expectations of aftermarket progression for this platform.

Maybe so.

 

[mbreinin]

First Livernois forces a guy to buy a car against his will, NOW they are making him buy a $2400 exhaust. I'm fed up with this company already.

LOL, I would say they inspired me to buy it. They wanted to know why their parts are not on my car, I told them why.

 

[SloS14]

Whether or not we go 11's on the stock motor - just the fact that a tiny baby 2.3L can move these tanks at all, never mind any any appreciable speed - is pretty neat.

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

We do offer 3 separate stages of exhaust as well....
When someone goes to buy a new car do they select EVERY option and say, "Oh no, this car is too expensive!"

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

Because after talking to you, I realized that what you engaged in was a marketing ploy, to show what could be done with an EcoBoost Mustang, not what the average tuned EcoBoost was going to be capable of doing safely. I was not going to get the 11.8 tuneup from you out of the gate, and possibly never at all. How many 11.8 tuneups have you shipped out? How many cars are running numbers even remotely approaching what you have run, with your tune? There are dragstrips open all over the country right now. I have 3 within 100 miles of me. The "up north" excuse is wearing thin.

I freely admit, that I am a skeptic. I don't doubt for a minute that you got those results, as I saw the video. It impressed me enough that I went out and bought a car. Ford should write you guys a nice commission check for that video, I bet you have sold dozens of cars to like minded people. I just think that what you did was a bait and switch. You JUST started to ship Stage 1 tunes out, and you were banging out 11's in November.

In terms of your parts, I own an Airaid. I think we have established the basic similarities between your offering and theirs. Your exhaust I was not impressed with, and it is grossly overpriced. Since I have taken it upon myself to be the jerk here, I might as well live up to it. People are complaining about spending $1500 on a full exhaust system, and you have a $2400 offering. I don't care if it is crafted in the halls of Valhalla from a cache of stainless steel forged from Thor's own hammer...it is overpriced.

Everything you sell, from your tuner and tune, to your intake, is expensive. I know that you will claim the quality and superiority sets the price point, but people still want value for their dollar.

Mike

I am sorry you feel that way on the exhaust, however if you look at any system with the material and craftsmanship that's in ours it's easy to see why there is so much cost involved. Just look at what headers and exhaust cost for the 5.0 cars, this costs more because frankly, the tooling is all new for it, and the volume will be less. Also, we offer our exhaust as a modular design. Don't want every bell and whistle? then get our downpipe and use whatever exhaust you want with it. No one is saying you have to check off every option when you get it. That's why we designed it this way.

And you're right, there are about 6 tracks within 200 miles of here, but they are all closed. No one said we don't have tracks, we don't have tracks that are open right now. Big difference.

Our concern is getting our tunes built for all strategy codes, not going and running the car that the track right now. Our Stage 1 and 2 tunes have been out for certain builds since november, but all of the newer strategies had revised logic in them, causing us to have to start from square one on them. This is why there are so many popped EcoBoost engines already, because tuners are out there putting out tunes without the proper knowledge and experience it takes to do these cars properly. They just push changes from one strategy to another rather than taking the time to learn the ins and outs of ever strategy, and every car, and how the mods impact them.

Everybody's cold weather issues? We saw them during testing as the cold weather moved in, and put our focus on stage 1 tunes and covering the broad range of strategy codes rather than focusing on stage 2 tunes and above endlessly while we find a safe solution to the fueling concerns. Now that all back log strategy coverage has been met on stage 1, we are going back with our car to get the situation addressed with fueling.

We are used to people looking at our results and thinking it's a ploy. What's crazy is when we have customers equal, or beat those results on their own, hundreds, or thousands of miles, or even hemispheres away, the same people claim it's a ploy, or tricks, or something. Even when the cars get inspected by these doubters they still just can't come to terms with the fact that we were 100% accurate in everything we say and do.

We are the only company doing EcoBoost work that is able to do these types of upgrades. Just look at our world record results. All of them except maybe two are held by customers of ours, not us. But it's our work, our products, our engineering that goes into it.

 

[mbreinin]

I am sorry you feel that way on the exhaust, however if you look at any system with the material and craftsmanship that's in ours it's easy to see why there is so much cost involved. Just look at what headers and exhaust cost for the 5.0 cars, this costs more because frankly, the tooling is all new for it, and the volume will be less. Also, we offer our exhaust as a modular design. Don't want every bell and whistle? then get our downpipe and use whatever exhaust you want with it. No one is saying you have to check off every option when you get it. That's why we designed it this way.

And you're right, there are about 6 tracks within 200 miles of here, but they are all closed. No one said we don't have tracks, we don't have tracks that are open right now. Big difference.

Our concern is getting our tunes built for all strategy codes, not going and running the car that the track right now. Our Stage 1 and 2 tunes have been out for certain builds since november, but all of the newer strategies had revised logic in them, causing us to have to start from square one on them. This is why there are so many popped EcoBoost engines already, because tuners are out there putting out tunes without the proper knowledge and experience it takes to do these cars properly. They just push changes from one strategy to another rather than taking the time to learn the ins and outs of ever strategy, and every car, and how the mods impact them.

Everybody's cold weather issues? We saw them during testing as the cold weather moved in, and put our focus on stage 1 tunes and covering the broad range of strategy codes rather than focusing on stage 2 tunes and above endlessly while we find a safe solution to the fueling concerns. Now that all back log strategy coverage has been met on stage 1, we are going back with our car to get the situation addressed with fueling.

We are used to people looking at our results and thinking it's a ploy. What's crazy is when we have customers equal, or beat those results on their own, hundreds, or thousands of miles, or even hemispheres away, the same people claim it's a ploy, or tricks, or something. Even when the cars get inspected by these doubters they still just can't come to terms with the fact that we were 100% accurate in everything we say and do.

We are the only company doing EcoBoost work that is able to do these types of upgrades. Just look at our world record results. All of them except maybe two are held by customers of ours, not us. But it's our work, our products, our engineering that goes into it.

What I want to know is how you managed to block quote something at 3:35, when I edited that content out two hours before. What exactly is going on here?

As I said when I edited it, I am done arguing with you. It is fruitless to argue over a car I am trading in.

 

[Tcnarber]

Our concern is getting our tunes built for all strategy codes, not going and running the car that the track right now. Our Stage 1 and 2 tunes have been out for certain builds since november, but all of the newer strategies had revised logic in them, causing us to have to start from square one on them. This is why there are so many popped EcoBoost engines already, because tuners are out there putting out tunes without the proper knowledge and experience it takes to do these cars properly. They just push changes from one strategy to another rather than taking the time to learn the ins and outs of ever strategy, and every car, and how the mods impact them.

How many are you talking? Is this all form tunes? I am a total noob at this stuff, bought a car and was just wanting some better performance out of it.

 

[cosmo]

...It is fruitless to argue over a car I am trading in.

What? LOL. A few months in and you've completely given up hope? You got some expensive ADHD.

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