Cobb or Bama

[dragonacc]

So the lesson here is to not buy direct from Cobb?

I wouldn't unless you are content with buying parts that Cobb has OTS maps for and don't care about getting your tune adjusted.

I know they've suggested to several users on here in the past that they should check their protuner list and buy the AP from one of them.

EDIT: Just like I would never buy an X4 directly from SCT. And why I didn't buy my X3 from SCT...

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[foghat]

So the lesson here is to not buy direct from Cobb?

Until Cobb starts offering more OTS maps (which you can use regardless of where you buy the AP) that include tunes for downpipes, IC, etc, it probably wouldn't be a bad idea to buy for a tuner who will make those changes for you.

I have to say, this whole 'free tunes for life' thing being offered by resellers is quite refreshing - there was no one offering anything like this in the bmw world.

 

[dragonacc]

In defense of JJ, I am/was a bit confused as well.

Except that JJ ignored myself and several others multiple times when we explained how it works.

 

[bislag]

My over all point was that if you purchase the device and base tunes from any tuning company why should you have to pay again for having something as simple as a downstream 02 sensor being turned off? Sure if you want the car completely custom tuned thats fine and you should pay for that but for a simple change like that it shouldnt cost any customer a dime.

JJ

The real point is that when you buy an AP, it comes with those maps as a complimentary feature. You do not pay a cent extra for them. They are just there, and you don't need to run them. You can also buy an AP from some tuners and they might tune you free of charge, just like you do. Some might charge extra, but that's the prerogative of the individual tuner.

Moreover, it is a canned tune. You either abide by the parameters of the canned tune you CHOSE to run, find a canned tune that meets your needs, or get a custom tune. That is how canned tunes work and it isn't something unique to Cobb. Cobb has been pretty clear that they don't alter their OTS maps from the beginning. This isn't news and anybody buying an AP and expecting otherwise failed to do any research whatsoever before modifying their car. This isn't even unique to Cobb.

It'd be nice if people could be responsible and do at least 5 minutes of research before modifying and notice that Cobb has OTS maps that do account for catless pipes on other platforms. They could even then decide to contact Cobb and ask them if such a map was eventually going to be released, and if that map would have the codes associated with being catless disabled. But maybe that's just what I would do since I actually care about my car and how it performs beyond "I MAEK MOAR NMBRS."

 

[JJ@WMS]

Except that JJ ignored myself and several others multiple times when we explained how it works.

I'm sorry I wasnt ignoring you at all and I didnt know I had to respond directly to you comments.

I do understand how other companies work when it comes to tuning. My initial post was made because a customer ours was directed to go to a local tuner to have the downstream sensor turned off for an OR pipe and that local tuner was going to charge $300+ dollars to "retune" the vehicle. All of this after having purchased his tuning device and tunes directly from the manufacturer. That in and of itself made no sense to me and I was under the impression that the manufacturer should have had the ability to make simple change to the tune for the customer to avoid him having to spend more money.

I have no agenda here and I'm sorry you feel that way but I will say that when you purchase tuning devices from any company you as the consumer should know what does and what does not come with that purchase.

JJ

 

[bislag]

So the lesson here is to not buy direct from Cobb? In defense of JJ, I am/was a bit confused as well.

Same lesson applies to SCT. Why buy from any shop that isn't your tuner of choice (originally said:SCT directly) when you can have Torrie, WMS, or Bama tune you free of charge?

 

[JJ@WMS]

Same lesson applies to SCT. Why buy from SCT directly when you can have Torrie, WMS, or Bama tune you free of charge?

One thing that needs to be said is that you cant purchase directly from SCT.

JJ

 

[bislag]

One thing that needs to be said is that you cant purchase directly from SCT.

JJ

Today I learned something.

Then I'll change that to "Why buy the SCT from any shop that isn't your tuner of choice?" Still relevant.

 

[dragonacc]

I'm sorry I wasnt ignoring you at all and I didnt know I had to respond directly to you comments.

I do understand how other companies work when it comes to tuning. My initial post was made because a customer ours was directed to go to a local tuner to have the downstream sensor turned off for an OR pipe and that local tuner was going to charge $300+ dollars to "retune" the vehicle. All of this after having purchased his tuning device and tunes directly from the manufacturer. That in and of itself made no sense to me and I was under the impression that the manufacturer should have had the ability to make simple change to the tune for the customer to avoid him having to spend more money.

I have no agenda here and I'm sorry you feel that way but I will say that when you purchase tuning devices from any company you as the consumer should know what does and what does not come with that purchase.

JJ

You don't have to respond directly to my comments, but I wasn't the only one that stated how tuning with Cobb works. Even now you keep talking about how the customer didn't do their homework and it's somehow Cobb's fault.

Just so everyone is clear - Cobb doesn't do "custom" tunes. If their off the shelf tunes won't work for your mods, don't buy the AP directly from Cobb.

Maybe you guys should look into what the AP can do now that the ATP software has been released and you can provide more options to your customers.

 

[foghat]

You don't have to respond directly to my comments, but I wasn't the only one that stated how tuning with Cobb works. Even now you keep talking about how the customer didn't do their homework and it's somehow Cobb's fault.

Just so everyone is clear - Cobb doesn't do "custom" tunes. If their off the shelf tunes won't work for your mods, don't buy the AP directly from Cobb.

Maybe you guys should look into what the AP can do now that the ATP software has been released and you can provide more options to your customers.

I wonder if these 'free tunes for life' resellers could get away with ATR? ATP is pretty pricey for someone who isn't charging for custom tunes and doesn't need to lock the file so other can't see/adjust.

 

[dragonacc]

I wonder if these 'free tunes for life' resellers could get away with ATR? ATP is pretty pricey for someone who isn't charging for custom tunes and doesn't need to lock the file so other can't see/adjust.

Not an expert on the differences between ATR and ATP. Maybe ATR can only be used for a single Accessport SN?

I would imagine that the price for ATP is probably in line with what it costs for the tuning license that people buy from SCT.

 

[foghat]

Not an expert on the differences between ATR and ATP. Maybe ATR can only be used for a single Accessport SN?

I would imagine that the price for ATP is probably in line with what it costs for the tuning license that people buy from SCT.

you are probably right - I can't remember from when I downloaded mine for the 135i. It also looks like it is not free, but $150. I know I got mine for free, guess they have changed that policy.

 

[dragonacc]

you are probably right - I can't remember from when I downloaded mine for the 135i. It also looks like it is not free, but $150. I know I got mine for free, guess they have changed that policy.

I just checked their website, still free for the 135i. Guessing the difference is in the initial cost of the AP. Seems to me that you are paying for ATR upfront on that platform.

Probably just trying to stay cost competitive with the Mustang AP vs other tuning solutions so they are making the software an optional upgrade.

 

[Slow5oh]

Ive had cobb before on some mazdas. I love there tunes.

 

[AMAlexLazarus]

We're hesitant to get involved in this thread because of all the madness that has been exchanged. However, it's time to get some helpful information out there.

Let me start by saying that it's absolutely not true that "other companies" haven't gone fast with their EcoBoosts. Actually, I think Bama is right up there with the "fastest" cars out there, especially factoring in full-weight and 19" wheels. They tuned their car fully with SCT software using a Bama X4.

1/8th Mile Track in NC 2 Weeks Ago:

7.71 @ 89 MPH
1.59 60' foot time
Calculates out to 12.0-12.1 @ 105MPH

Mods:

- Airaid CAI
- Bama V2 Race Tune (same boost level as the tune their customers receive)
- 3" Kooks Catless Downpipe and Exhaust
- Prototype Intercooler and Up-Pipe Kit w/External Blow-Off Valve
- Full weight (no seats removed)
- 19" Drag Radials (not slicks on smaller drag wheels)

To be clear, this is on Race Gas however it's the same Boost level as the Race tune Bama sends their customers on 93 octane. They only used Race gas for a margin of safety (not for this particular setup, but for other things they tested on this trip) and to bump the timing a tad. Also, if there are any customers running Race fuels, they'll be able to tune for that.

Also, the Intercooler didn't add horsepower but did decrease intake temperatures over 100 degrees when they tested the (2) dyno runs and (2) track runs. If they were to continue to beat the cars brains out on the dyno to heat-soak it, you may see power gains when the aftermarket intercooler "does work", but not if you're only doing 2-3 pulls on the dyno and 2-3 pulls at the strip in each form. It's a consistency mod and not a mod for gains, since they're not seeing temperatures rise and timing pulled, etc.

As for Bama just coming into the EcoBoost world, that's also not the case. The Bama team has members who have tuned plenty of factory turbo cars for years, including Ford and the EcoBoost platform. This definitely isn't their first run-in with this type of tuning.

Hopefully that gets our side of things across. Feel free to ask away any questions that you guys may have!

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