Tunes and buying a used GT350?

[jpowl]

Question regarding tunes and buying a used GT350. How can I, a buyer, determine if a car has had a prior 3rd party tune? Sure, a seller can say "never been tuned", but a dealer won't care if I unknowingly bought a used car that had been tuned prior and they, right or wrong, deny warranty work because of a tune. Yes, I know some folks have no problem getting engines replaced even with a tune and forced induction, but that's a risk I'd rather not take.
Aside from having a Ford dealer check for 3rd party tunes, is there anything a buyer can do? Thanks!

Sponsored

 

[drummerboy]

I don't know, but I'm just chiming in to say to take it to Ford for an inspection and have them check. I was looking at a private party used one about a year ago and took it to a dealership with the owner to have them check it out - there were some things I didn't fancy, so I backed out, and the dealership only charged me $100 for the full look over.

 

[Shift]

Best bet is to take it to a dealer. Their computer showed that I had modified the ecu/pcm/bcm(I don't fucking know) even though the only thing I did was use ForScan to turn on the trans temp sensor.

Also find one that's been serviced at Ford. They log your system parameters every time you bring it in, so they know if something has changed in between service.

 

[Niz55]

Servicing at ford dealer is not always the best thing.

 

[NoXiDe]

Best bet is to take it to a dealer. Their computer showed that I had modified the ecu/pcm/bcm(I don't fucking know) even though the only thing I did was use ForScan to turn on the trans temp sensor.

Also find one that's been serviced at Ford. They log your system parameters every time you bring it in, so they know if something has changed in between service.

I would had mentioned you requested they turned it on after you discovered it was possible but lacked technical skills to do it yourself. You requested it be turned on to be aware of the transmission temperature due to the history of limp from other owner experiences..Did you argue that the techs turned it on there as it was safe to do? No performance was modified with the ecu/pcm/bcm changes? Either way, if they denied warranty due to that modification, that is a perfect example where the Magnunson Moss Warranty Act can slap the dealer across the face for even bringing that up.

 

[Wildcardfox]

Question regarding tunes and buying a used GT350. How can I, a buyer, determine if a car has had a prior 3rd party tune? Sure, a seller can say "never been tuned", but a dealer won't care if I unknowingly bought a used car that had been tuned prior and they, right or wrong, deny warranty work because of a tune. Yes, I know some folks have no problem getting engines replaced even with a tune and forced induction, but that's a risk I'd rather not take.
Aside from having a Ford dealer check for 3rd party tunes, is there anything a buyer can do? Thanks!

Only thing that you can do is take the car for a smog check. In CA, for instance, they will be able to tell if the car’s computer was “unlocked”, which will signify that a tune was installed. In CA, a computer that was unlocked equals an immediate fail on a Smog check because they know that you have been messing around with the emissions controls and monitors.

The state uses that data to presume that you have been running an illegal setup in the street, but removed it for the smog check, so they fail you immediately and send you to a referee who looks for signs that the car has been tampered with by running a supercharger or other power adder modification, or an advanced tune.

You can do this at the Ford dealer, a local smog shop, or a referee by appointment.

I myself, would not be too concerned about this happening to a GT350 because most are happy with the motor as is, I would concerned if I was buying a turbocharged car like a Focus RS, Honda Civic Type R, or Focus ST— those particular car are always the recipients of turbo swaps, downpipe or up pipe swaps, or other changes that will require a tune, and the original owner may not have known that the evidence of the change would show up years later at his first smog. They are most likely unaware that CA is able to tell if you installed at then at all. A

I know all of this because one of my vehicles a 2006 mustang that was converted to a 2012 and certified by the state for 2012 emissions, was caught up in this exact situation where amongst other issues in newly changed state law, the car was immediately failed and sent to the referee because the computer had been unlocked multiple times. They could tell when, what date, and what time. It took a total of 3 months to get it all figured out with the state.

This was such an issue that Hot Rod Magazine is currently recreating the situation with a test car, to do an article to prove that in some cases a swapped car with a newer motor, a can run better emissions than is previously had and should not be caught in this quagmire.

I have also been looking at turbo cars as a replacement for my current daily, and I’m looking at the cars I mentioned above: civic type r, focus rs, focus st, ecoboost mustang, and for those cars, it is harder to find a car that hasn’t been modified if you are buying second hand. A good rule of thumb is: if you see modifications of any kind, walk away. If they started changing parts like exhaust, sway bars, lowering springs, etc. then it is probably a safe bet that they ordered and installed a tune in a box, or bought a programmer.

The only situations where a computer is unlocked is if it was accompanied by a Smog EO number in the case of a 50-state legal supercharger install, where the tune has been certified to not change the emissions equipment of the car, but when buying a car, you have to hope that the previous owner cared enough to know the difference between a legal kit and an illegal kit.

But in your case, take the car or request that the car have a smog check. Or go buy from CarMax as they make sure to put everything back to stock before they sell the car.

 

[honeybadger]

Only thing that you can do is take the car for a smog check. In CA, for instance, they will be able to tell if the car’s computer was “unlocked”, which will signify that a tune was installed. In CA, a computer that was unlocked equals an immediate fail on a Smog check because they know that you have been messing around with the emissions controls and monitors.

The state uses that data to presume that you have been running an illegal setup in the street, but removed it for the smog check, so they fail you immediately and send you to a referee who looks for signs that the car has been tampered with by running a supercharger or other power adder modification, or an advanced tune.

I fully support green initiatives, the move to electric cars, etc.

But fuck California.

 

[Wildcardfox]

I fully support green initiatives, the move to electric cars, etc.

But fuck California.

Hey, it's a nice place to live.

You wouldn't like it if I said Fuck Texas.

 

[Shift]

I would had mentioned you requested they turned it on after you discovered it was possible but lacked technical skills to do it yourself. You requested it be turned on to be aware of the transmission temperature due to the history of limp from other owner experiences..Did you argue that the techs turned it on there as it was safe to do? No performance was modified with the ecu/pcm/bcm changes? Either way, if they denied warranty due to that modification, that is a perfect example where the Magnunson Moss Warranty Act can slap the dealer across the face for even bringing that up.

The problem is they don't know exactly what is modified unless they really dig deep. All I know is when they plug the car in for diagnostics/log data, their computer automatically tells them the car's ecu/pcm/bcm has been modified. It doesn't say if it was a performance tune, or if I just turned on the trans temp.

 

[honeybadger]

Hey, it's a nice place to live.

You wouldn't like it if I said Fuck Texas.

Haha, I don't mind if you say it at all. There's plenty that happens in Texas that makes me:

 

[Wildcardfox]

Haha, I don't mind if you say it at all. There's plenty that happens in Texas that makes me:

hahaha that gif made me laugh

 

[NoXiDe]

The problem is they don't know exactly what is modified unless they really dig deep. All I know is when they plug the car in for diagnostics/log data, their computer automatically tells them the car's ecu/pcm/bcm has been modified. It doesn't say if it was a performance tune, or if I just turned on the trans temp.

I guess they'll have to call true Ford Engineers to evaluate the ECU.

 

[Tank]

The problem is they don't know exactly what is modified unless they really dig deep. All I know is when they plug the car in for diagnostics/log data, their computer automatically tells them the car's ecu/pcm/bcm has been modified. It doesn't say if it was a performance tune, or if I just turned on the trans temp.

I would think it’s pretty easy for the Ford system to pull your As Built data and compare it to what they’re currently reading . It’s probably one of the first things it does when connecting...

 

[NoXiDe]

I would think it’s pretty easy for the Ford system to pull your As Built data and compare it to what they’re currently reading . It’s probably one of the first things it does when connecting...

That's outside of the techs level of skill. Remember but before I go with where I was going with this... the only people working on the GT350 should be the master mechanic that also includes oil changes. This is true, correct? In order for the dealer to become a partner in the allocation program for the GT350 and also the GT500 (not all dealers will be accepted) they had to purchase touchless wheel mount (HUNTER) and also get their master mechanics trained on the GT350. This is where the ADM would have covered the additional expense for the dealership to pass onto the customer but they got overly greedy and kept it going for sometime and some still do.

 

[Tank]

That's outside of the techs level of skill. Remember but before I go with where I was going with this... the only people working on the GT350 should be the master mechanic that also includes oil changes. This is true, correct? In order for the dealer to become a partner in the allocation program for the GT350 and also the GT500 (not all dealers will be accepted) they had to purchase touchless wheel mount (HUNTER) and also get their master mechanics trained on the GT350. This is where the ADM would have covered the additional expense for the dealership to pass onto the customer but they got overly greedy and kept it going for sometime and some still do.

I don’t agree it’s beyond a techs level of skill to hook up an ODB reader.

Also, my dealer does NOT have a Hunter.

I haven’t had the need to check out their service other than the initial oil change and yearly inspection. I have asked about their techs training but will so as circumstances permit.

I appreciate the heads up though. I’ve changed a couple of values through Forscan and hadn’t really thought it might come up.

Sponsored