Real World Test by the SCCA.

[bdavies011]

I do not take lap times from a coned track on a Saturday in a parking lot. However, if (when) the Camaro is the best in that class, what is your reaction going to be? My guess is go back to your non posting ways again haha, see weight discussion.

I don't think you're necessarily always reaching the maximum handling capabilities of a vehicle when "racing" (more like weaving IMHO) through cones in a parking lot. I believe an inferior handling car like the GT can do well in a series like this because it is more important to control the weight transfer of the vehicle. IMO, a fast time on a coned course, can be achieved without ever reaching the maximum grip limitations of the car. When done well by a good driver, the car probably doesn't reach its limit of grip due to the quick, yet small changes in direction. It's really more about the drivers ability to control weight transfer quickly with good rhythm. This can be achieved without reaching the limit of grip on these types of courses. For this reason, I think an inferior handling car like the GT can perform well if driven right.

A true road course or even a short oval is where a car will show its true handling capabilities due to longer, sweeping corners (where the limit of grip can be achieved on a consistent basis) and long braking and acceleration zones. Don't get me wrong though, weight transfer on a roady or short oval is very important too but a car will really give you a better idea of what it's capable of on these types a tracks vs a coned course. This is really where we see the SS run away from the GT.

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[thePill]

I don't think you're necessarily always reaching the maximum handling capabilities of a vehicle when "racing" (more like weaving IMHO) through cones in a parking lot. I believe an inferior handling car like the GT can do well in a series like this because it is more important to control the weight transfer of the vehicle. IMO, a fast time on a coned course, can be achieved without ever reaching the maximum grip limitations of the car. When done well by a good driver, the car probably doesn't reach its limit of grip due to the quick, yet small changes in direction. It's really more about the drivers ability to control weight transfer quickly with good rhythm. This can be achieved without reaching the limit of grip on these types of courses. For this reason, I think an inferior handling car like the GT can perform well if driven right.

A true road course or even a short oval is where a car will show its true handling capabilities due to longer, sweeping corners (where the limit of grip can be achieved on a consistent basis) and long braking and acceleration zones. Don't get me wrong though, weight transfer on a roady or short oval is very important too but a car will really give you a better idea of what it's capable of on these types a tracks vs a coned course. This is really where we see the SS run away from the GT.

If that were the case, the 1LE would have "run away" from the S197 in T2. The results in T2 were far less comparable than the results in FS.

The 1LE has a championship and wins in FS so, in my opinion, FS is a better platform for Camaro results.

However, FS is more factory stock than T2. Either way you look at it in any form, series, circuit, road, track... the Camaro does better in FS against the Mustang.

Saying the Camaro (or any Camaro) runs away from a GT with no results is a little bland. As it stands right now, there is no modern Camaro capable of handling the Mustang in its class.

 

[bdavies011]

Huh? You just told me there are no results in the GT vs SS comparison. How can your very next statement be this?

As it stands right now, there is no modern Camaro capable of handling the Mustang in its class.

:shrug:

 

[ZaneWayne]

Has the 6th gen been driven around the coned parking lot yet? What was its time compared to other cars in its "class?"

And if you think the 5th Gen and 6th Gen are roughly the same as far as performance goes, you need some serious seat time in them both. They are complete night and day difference.

 

[ZaneWayne]

Huh? You just told me there are no results in the GT vs SS comparison. How can your very next statement be this?



:shrug:

The S550 is better than the Alpha SS is many areas. Sight lights. Storage. It is better when adding FI. But out of the box performance the Alpha SS walks all over the S550 GTPP.

 

[thePill]

Huh? You just told me there are no results in the GT vs SS comparison. How can your very next statement be this?



:shrug:

There is NO Camaro that handles its competitor in the magnitude Motor Trend suggest.

Honestly, there are more Mustang's winning their class than Camaro for sure. You need to understand, SCCA FS is THE VERY BEST PERFORMANCE BY A 5th GEN EVER. The 1LE driven by one driver is the exception to that rule. Just because a 1LE win an FS title once doesn't put it in a "handling the Mustang" column.

I use FS because that is the class the Camaro had its BEST RESULTS. I wouldn't try and discredit the only class the Camaro has a pulse in...

 

[thePill]

Has the 6th gen been driven around the coned parking lot yet? What was its time compared to other cars in its "class?"

And if you think the 5th Gen and 6th Gen are roughly the same as far as performance goes, you need some serious seat time in them both. They are complete night and day difference.

From what I hear, the 2016 SS has done a TnT and classed in FS. It did so because it was no faster than the 1LE. It belongs in FS until someone complains that it doesn't.

There were lots of complaints about the 1LE too from the Mustang side. They assumed the magazine results would carry over. The 1LE was kind of a push over. An extreme pushover in T2. The results were so bad that I rarely use T2 as an example.

 

[bdavies011]

There is NO Camaro that handles its competitor in the magnitude Motor Trend suggest.

Honestly, there are more Musang's winning their class than Camaro for sure. You need to understand, SCCA FS is THE VERY BEST PERFORMANCE BY A 5th GEN EVER. The 1LE driven by one driver is the exception to that rule. Just because a 1LE win an FS title once doesn't put it in a "handling the Mustang" column.

I use FS because that is the class the Camaro had its BEST RESULTS. I wouldn't try and discredit the only class the Camaro has a pulse in...

But the heavier '15 Camaro probably can do well in the SCCA FS because of the drivers ability and the fact that those are coned courses with subtle changes in direction and speed (its heavier weight will not affect it as much on courses like that). Which further proves my point in my post above.

I will not argue that a 16 GTPP could outrun a 5th Gen SS on a true roadcourse. The 5th Gen's heavier weight will prevent it from keeping up with a '16GTPP on a true roady. An SCCA course is a different story as a stated above.

A '16 SS will outrun a '16 GTPP 9 times out of 10 on a roady but will not argue that the GTPP could possibly do well against an 6th Gen SS in SCCA FS due to course configurations. You're simply not always going to be at the limits of grip on a SCCA coned course.

 

[Car Man]

The point is, when raced, there really is no clear advantage in the pack of vehicles in FS.

This SCCA report contradicts everything Motor Trend has put effort into. It shows you that regardless of what MT said, you may get your ass handed to you by any of the cars on the list.

The 2015 Mustang tore the SCCA up... moreso than the 2005-2006 did. Any faster and it would be removed from FS...

...and a lot of people would bitch I'm sure.

The fact that a thread started by this idiot gets as much attention as it does in here speaks volumes. Is this the only place left fir theShrill to post? Seems like it, most other places got rid of him or just ignore his ramblings.

 

[thePill]

The fact that a thread started by this idiot gets as much attention as it does in here speaks volumes. Is this the only place left fir theShrill to post? Seems like it, most other places got rid of him or just ignore his ramblings.

It's the SCCA... I'm not affiliated with the SCCA.

This was a Test in order to determine class eligibility. The results are the results... there is no ifs ands of buts about it. Be upset, it surely upsets me too.

None of this is top secret.

 

[ZaneWayne]

It's the SCCA... I'm not affiliated with the SCCA.

This was a Test in order to determine class eligibility. The results are the results... there is no ifs ands of buts about it. Be upset, it surely upsets me too.

None of this is top secret.

Yes and the results of this test have proven that the 5th iteration of the Camaro is faster than the 6th iteration of the Mustang. Yet you are spouting its a win for the Mustang. It is kind of silly haha.

 

[ZaneWayne]

So just to be clear, no one in the SCCA has ran the 6th gen? They are just placing in that class on speculation? Or did someone run it and it sucked?

 

[Memphis]

So just to be clear, no one in the SCCA has ran the 6th gen? They are just placing in that class on speculation? Or did someone run it and it sucked?

Neither. Just testing done to determine what class they think it will compete best in


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[ZaneWayne]

Neither. Just testing done to determine what class they think it will compete best in


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Ahhh. So no times to compare against?

 

[Memphis]

Ahhh. So no times to compare against?

No. Which is where he Pilk will probably be pleasantly surprised after a full 2 seasons or racing the new 16.


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