Fix For Climate Controlled Seats Not Cooling

[Darko66]

Exhaust explanation

First, thinking about this made me realize something. I never reinstalled the plastic insert back into my seat. So, those of you installing the attachment or having already installed it, might want to leave it out. There's a chance it might obstruct the hot exhaust air exiting the seat albeit only slightly.

Okay, I'm not saying that having a directly connected exhaust isn't a good idea. My attempt at it was flawed, but I assume Seatguru's take on it doesn't suffer the same issues. There are two issues with the exhaust - heat accumulation and the fact that the exhaust blows right next to the tube taking the cold air to the seat. A properly working exhaust system should be able to greatly improve performance.

However, by drawing air from outside the seat and taking advantage of the A/C and the floor vents, the exhaust issues can be somewhat overcome.

I'm going to try and explain this. I apologize if it just sounds like a lot of babble.

My experience might be different because our seats are different. I don't know anything about the F150 seats, so they might not have the perforated material section that we have. Although this material isn't as breathable as it should be, it does allow a path for air to escape the inside of the seat.

As originally designed by Ford with the air being drawn from within the seat, the hot exhaust isn't under pressure so it doesn't get forced out. In fact, because the blower splits the air with half going out the front of the seat and half exiting as exhaust inside the seat, air had to be drawn into the seat to equalize the pressure. The seat does not do this very well.

Once you begin drawing air from outside the seat, you increase the air pressure inside the seat. This pressure forces the hot exhaust out via the perforated areas or any other crevice it can. This exhaust is being replaced by new exhaust though, so it's necessary to feed the blower cold air so you can push the exhaust temperature down. This is why it's necessary to divert at least some of the cold A/C to the floor vents, especially when the vehicle is starting out hot. As the vehicle cools and the TED temp drops, the exhaust from the blower goes from being hot to just being warm. Although this warm air does have a negative impact, the overwhelming factor is the intake air temperature. As long as it stays cool, the blower will continue to blow cold air. I haven't had any issues with the blower being able to continue blowing cold over an extended period of time.

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[papinist]

Speaking user-side, I would be happy to see a collaboration between two great guys, and go beyond what Ford did without respect for us.

They did not and will not make an improvement to try and fix the lack of cooling as it does not impact the overall function of the vehicle (their words not mine).

They could say that even if my EB lose 200 hp from one day to another: the 'overall' function of the vehicle are not impacted since with 117 hp I can still use the car to drive..
Did they forgot that cooled seats function was not a gift for our nice face, but we paid that? I paid 600 eur for that, so I consider the overall function compromised! :rant:

 

[DropTop]

Speaking user-side, I would be happy to see a collaboration between two great guys, and go beyond what Ford did without respect for us.

That is exactly what I have been trying to foster with my posts....as I worked with Tim in getting the original TSB (for F-150s) released and we were the first field tests of that release. Sadly, they only addressed removing the "hot spot" vs. optimizing the system a la pre-2015s.

On another note, if there is anyone in the Souix Falls area that would be willing to be a beta tester for Tim's kit(s), please contact him so we can remove speculation as to if/how the F-150 solution might port into our more "compact" Mustang Premium Seats..... DropTop

 

[Cobra Jet]

Just curious -

2 offerings of ideas regarding the TEDs in the upper seat backs:


1) What if there was a way to vent the hot air from the seatback upwards - instead of "down and out"? It seems to vent it downward is a further route than it would be to vent it upward, no? For instance - say there was a way to insert a slit or a thin edged "vent" that would exit somewhere under the headrest (pointed away from heads but towards back of car).

OR

2) Vent it into the seat back pocket that is already there. The seat back pocket is already "open" at the top (and who uses them anyway). The installed vent would be hidden within the pocket, so no ugliness to see. If there was a clean way to install a vent that dumps the hot air immediately out and into the pocket area, wouldn't that work better instead of trying to get it to vent in a longer route within the seat to the bottom of the seat?

Just throwing ideas out there...

 

[Rich of So Cal]

doin' it

Well, I just finished doing this mod on the driver's seat. I am combining this project with putting on new Katzkin leather. This makes it much easier since I removed my old seat leathers before doing this one (but after putting on the new bottom seat leather).

The mod went well, but I would hate to do it without raising the seat back material and exposing the vent. Plus, since I removed my seats entirely and did it in my living room, it was very simple to do. In fact, there are only 4 bolts to remove (15 mm socket) to get the seat out. I think it's worth it. Of course, I have a convertible which makes seat removal even easier. Also, routing the tubes up in the seat frame was much simpler when I was able to lay the entire seat on it's side.

TORX 6: these are tiny and I had none in any of my torx sets. Good news is that Home Depot has a Husky precision screwdriver set for under $6 that has the 6 in the set.

So now back to work to put on the upper seat leather.

 

[GT Pony]

Rich of So Cal ... looking forward to your comments on how the mod performs. If I do the DIY mod I think I'd just get a helper and remove the seats entirely from the car.

 

[Captdistraction]

I didn't even realize the seatback cooled at all. In phoenix, I can feel the seat bottom very strongly, but for me it was always about getting cooling to one's core/back area.

That said, I just bought one of these kits. So far is everyone mostly happy with theirs? I can't even feel air movement coming out of my seatback's front faces. I'll have to look into this more.

 

[Rich of So Cal]

Rich of So Cal ... looking forward to your comments on how the mod performs. If I do the DIY mod I think I'd just get a helper and remove the seats entirely from the car.

Well I just drove to Palm Springs with drivers cooler turned on. When I got here I put my ear to the seat. Fan not running at all. Also have an air bag light. I'm guessing I didn't seat the plugs tight enough. Not much room under there with those tubes. I will have to try to replug when I get home.

UPDATE: apparently both front seats had to be installed for everything to work. it's fine now.

 

[Rich of So Cal]

cooling mod and Katzkin leather

OK, well today was the first time I got to try out the cooling mod. I also installed new Katzkin leather. A few caveats:

today is still pretty cool, so far. not the usual heat of summer that drove me to get this mod.

the Katzkins have special foam added for the cooling seat system and it appears to be more porous than the stock covers. however, Katzkin does NOT put in anything for the exhaust. Inside it is similar, with a layer that has big circles cut into in. but not any solid plastic sheet, and no cloth/breathable material for exhaust. I called them about lack of exhaust and their answer was: the exhaust will find it's way out and no-one has complained so far.

So with those differences in mind, I found that the bottom seat cooled rather well, but as others have already said, I didn't feel much in the upper area. Maybe a slight cooling. At least not heating up. But the real test will be when the hot weather returns.

Oh yes, and I was driving with the top down, so it was coolish outside air going through. I am still optimistic that I will feel a difference when it gets hot again.

 

[Captdistraction]

Bleh, went to install tonight, and my 5/16 build 2016 car has the newer style.

Doesn't cool the back at all, but will sit back (pun) and see what happens for the later cars.

My kit will end up in the classifieds with all the tubing etc.

 

[Mid_life_crisis]

I've never had a problem. I bought a seat cushion with a plastic open weave structure inside. Works like a champ. Instead of sitting on the holes and blocking them with my body, the air disperses through the mesh and does a great job cooling me off.

 

[Darko66]

Forum discount plus thoughts on install

A few thoughts on installing the attachments.

On the most recent units I've shipped, I've included a couple cable ties for each seat. I thought that one could be used to attach the hoses to the wire frame inside the seat just below where the hoses attach to the blower unit. This would just be to add a little extra support to the whole system. I thought the other tie could be used to connect the three hoses together at the front of the seat. This is primarily for those running the hoses under the seat loosely and not those attaching the hoses to the seat.

If you move your seat backward/forward frequently or perhaps use the easy entry/exit function, you will likely be best served attaching the hoses to the bottom of the seat as some have suggested. Removing the seat from the vehicle should make this much easier. If your seat pretty much stays in one location, you can get away with just leaving the hoses loose along the floor. Either way, the best location for the opening of the hoses seems to be in the center of the seat. Having the openings as low to the floor as possible likely has a small advantage as well.

I am assuming that if you do remove your seats from the vehicle to do the install, you probably only need to release the bottom flap elastic straps. You should be able to reach into the seat to work w/o the need to pull the seat cover up at all. The only limitation would be that there isn't a lot of room to get a screwdriver in so you need one that's fairly short. That's why I'd originally recommended the bit holder/torx bit combo. It's 3.5" tall, but you should be able to get something taller than that in there.

I appreciate everyone who has shared their installation suggestions and hope others will as well. I've pretty much put my seats through enough trauma so I'm relying on the community from now on to help improve the instructions. Please share any images of your install that might be helpful like the bottom of the seat with the hoses tied on or anything you think might be of assistance.

Thanks

 

[Darko66]

Oh yes, and I was driving with the top down, so it was coolish outside air going through. I am still optimistic that I will feel a difference when it gets hot again.

Thanks for trying out the attachment and for sharing.

I wish I'd caught you before you'd put your seats back together and imposed upon you to take a look at the cooling mesh on the seats. I'm still trying to figure out why the cold air spreads out so much better on the seat cushions than the back.

I had actually been wondering whether having the top down might be detrimental. Same with windows down, I guess. Even though it might be somewhat cool out, the outside air would still be warmer than the air conditioning. I'd like to think that blasting the air to the floor vents would overpower the outside air though. Pure conjecture though on whether the open air hurts, helps or doesn't matter.

We're cheating a little with this fix and relying on the cold a/c to help. We're essentially using the floor vents as underseat ducts like ctlaw has mentioned the Fusion does. Not ideal since the ducts are 2 feet away and blow on your feet, but the best I could figure out. The most important thing is the temperature of the air being sucked into the unit. The colder it is, the colder the unit blows and the less of an issue the exhaust heat becomes.

 

[Rich of So Cal]

Thanks for trying out the attachment and for sharing.

I wish I'd caught you before you'd put your seats back together and imposed upon you to take a look at the cooling mesh on the seats. I'm still trying to figure out why the cold air spreads out so much better on the seat cushions than the back.

I had actually been wondering whether having the top down might be detrimental. Same with windows down, I guess. Even though it might be somewhat cool out, the outside air would still be warmer than the air conditioning. I'd like to think that blasting the air to the floor vents would overpower the outside air though. Pure conjecture though on whether the open air hurts, helps or doesn't matter.

We're cheating a little with this fix and relying on the cold a/c to help. We're essentially using the floor vents as underseat ducts like ctlaw has mentioned the Fusion does. Not ideal since the ducts are 2 feet away and blow on your feet, but the best I could figure out. The most important thing is the temperature of the air being sucked into the unit. The colder it is, the colder the unit blows and the less of an issue the exhaust heat becomes.

Well, in general I do remember that the mesh in the seat bottom was much more open than that in the seat back. As your pic of the back showed, it depends on those slots alot.

As far as using the a/c program to split the air between top and heater vents, I tried that, but it turns off my ability to use auto and set a specific temp. Also, it take a lot of button pushing to get auto to work properly again, after I have done that. Auto climate control is one the features of the premium model that I like the best.

 

[Darko66]

As far as using the a/c program to split the air between top and heater vents, I tried that, but it turns off my ability to use auto and set a specific temp. Also, it take a lot of button pushing to get auto to work properly again, after I have done that. Auto climate control is one the features of the premium model that I like the best.

That's strange. I haven't experienced any trouble with that.

Setting the vents manually does turn off the "AUTO" function, but the temperature control still works for me. Pushing auto again seems to set everything back fine.

My experience has been that "AUTO" mode, based on the temperature set and I assume the current environment, just changes the configuration of the system – which vents the air blow from, whether the compressor and/or recirculation are turned on, etc. With "AUTO" on or off, the fan speed and air temperature still vary based on the set temp.

Anyone else had an issue using the vents set manually?

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