Tax, the future, emissions etc

v8hgt

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Recently I have been debating what to do with my Mustang. Obviously 2020 has been a very strange year with most of us doing far fewer miles in cars. However it has shown us that we don't need to commute anywhere near as much as we used to.
I get the feeling that the future of office work will be changed forever. Even when we are all immunised against the current strain of Covid my business will be maybe in the office 1 or 2 days a week in future instead of 5.
Also with the UK government brining forward the end of new ICE date to 2030, I can easily imagine that they will become increasing keen to get old ICE off the road using tax hikes on road tax and fuel. It will soon become uneconomic to have a 5 litre V8. Now sure if you have a million pound classic Ferrari then you can probably afford the once annual trip to Goodwood FoS. But if you are a normal person with a £30K ford, you aren't going to be able to afford £10K a yr road tax and £10 per litre tax on fuel. Therefore my initial idea of keeping my Mustang forever and passing it down to my kids isn't going to be financially viable for me or them.

This leaves me with a choice:

1. Stop using the Mustang as a summer toy, start using it all yr round. Get rid of my winter banger volvo. Drive the thing and put miles on it before it becomes a financial burden to own something fun. Assume depreciation down to zero over 10 yrs from now.
2. Sell it now while it still has some value. In 10 yrs time, even its been garaged its entire life and has only 20K miles, it will be effectively worthless (as per option 1), not a usable classic like a (BEV converted) Morris Minor, not a valuable classic like an original Ferrari 250.
3. Continue using the mustang as a fair weather car and SORN it over winter to save costs. However with post Covid commuting being reduced my annual milage will drop massively and I can see myself only doing maybe 2000-3000 miles per yr. So big chunk of cash in the garage and expense per yr for so few fun miles. Motorbike may be a better option or a genuine old classic that attracts no road tax.


Has anyone else been thinking along similar lines? I know Harrys Garage on YouTube did a piece on this recently, but Harry M was talking about expensive old classic stuff mainly and he is rather wealthy. What about us average people?

 

Kristian87

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I can't ever imagine getting rid of mine, and my thoughts on the far future and the tax situation is that the "specialist/classic" cars will fall in to their own category, much like the old classics do now - where the assumption is that they'll be used rarely. Sure fuel will become ever more expensive, but by that time I'll have a nice environmentally friendly daily.

We fall in to such a small fraction of a % of ICE cars on the road, I hope the government will be focusing on the many millions of everyday drivers, and getting those off the road first!

Here's hoping!
 

maddog1982

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I've been wondering how they will replace the lost revenue as more and more people switch to EV. Assume they pay no road tax. I can see a pay per mile coming in, something that's plugged into your car and you are then invoiced every month or something. My car is the higher tax bracket and I dont even want to know what its cost per mile this year. Sad times ahead but my plan is run something fun for as long as I can. Future generations wont have it so easy to experience a large capacity fossil fuel car.
.
 
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v8hgt

v8hgt

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One fear about the black box charging for road usage..... it will also know the exact time taken to cover ground.. which makes speed cameras redundant as there's now a speed camera focused on every car all the time.... means your 500 bhp v8 somewhat defunct in the UK at any rate. :(
 
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Phil_AVF

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I've been thinking about this and I am also about to make a new purchase with my Mach 1 coming early next year. I don't have a car at the moment having sold my 2019 Need for Green two months ago and I really haven't missed needing a car, but then again we have been in lockdown most of the time.
I work from home so the Mustang is used for meeting up with fellow Mustang friends and going for drives, to shows etc. but I can still put 10K on it a year no problem. I'm seeing the Mach 1 as my last V8 and I'll probably keep it as long as I can financially justify running it. I don't think there will be a massive change all of a sudden as we approach 2030, as most road users are actually in the lowest-paid sector of the population and use a car for commuting. They can't afford to be buying expensive EV's so it will take quite a few years after 2030 for the used EV market to nudge out the ICE cars.
Tax changes will come and I'm prepared to pay those charges for as long as I can afford it and it is viable. I expect to lose money on my Mach 1 and I have no illusions otherwise, I want it, I'll use it and when it becomes too expensive, I'll decide then what to do.
I have nothing against EVs and actually think the tech is superb and really interesting, but for now, I'm sticking with my V8 and expect to get a good number of years out of it.
 


GR11M

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I fear we'll end up being priced out of owning a V8 with horrendous fuel and emissions costs
 

inky5.0

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I fear we'll end up being priced out of owning a V8 with horrendous fuel and emissions costs
I fear you may be correct! I’m just hoping that it won’t be too soon (fingers crossed).
 

Bullitt66

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Don’t forget this shift in tax & culture affects all ICE sports cars to some extent, so it’s not really a case of saying lets swap the Stang for an M3. The whole industry is affected, which gives some protection in numbers.

I totally agree that EVs are technologically a marvel but equally quite devoid of the joy of driving. Auto/cvt with no exhaust note gives a rapid but unemotional experience. How often can you hit the ludicrous button before you’re bored And say ‘next’.

classics are great but frankly they’re really not well suited for daily use. Their benchmark was similar 50 year old antique cars with all their charm but dynamic faults.

personally I plan to keep a V8 till something interests me more, or it’s outlawed/unfeasible

if the value drops to zero, it’s only the same as depreciation on your string of average dull family cars over the next 10 years.

As mentioned I dont think these cars will ever be family heir looms so cherish the V8 experience while you still can
 

Vince

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This idea that we will all go elecrtic by 2030 is just pie in the sky. I was talking to an electrical engineer who told me the grid would melt down. It is decades old and could not handle all the cars charging. If they were to try to upgrade all the national grid you would be looking at a minimum 25 years to complete, and thats if they start tomorrow. Its thousand and thousands of miles of wiring. Electric solution is the old betamax and will not work. Liquid Hydrogen is the way forward
and cars can be converted.
 

inky5.0

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This idea that we will all go elecrtic by 2030 is just pie in the sky. I was talking to an electrical engineer who told me the grid would melt down. It is decades old and could not handle all the cars charging. If they were to try to upgrade all the national grid you would be looking at a minimum 25 years to complete, and thats if they start tomorrow. Its thousand and thousands of miles of wiring. Electric solution is the old betamax and will not work. Liquid Hydrogen is the way forward
and cars can be converted.
I agree, but there has been little or no investment in that infrastructure in the UK. The synthetic fuel development also looks interesting. Porsche are on the case and I think I read that F1 is moving towards it...
 

wenklaw

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I think it’s unlikely that VED would be changed massively retrospectively so I wouldn’t worry about it to much. It would be massively unpopular for any government to implement. Increasing VED retrospectively on cars with higher emissions will hit older cars as well therefore hitting far more poorer motorists.

I wouldn’t be surprised if VED is changed for new registrations though soon as the government need to clearly start collecting revenue from EV’s but also need to make us believe there is still an incentive to buy one over the combustion engine.
 

Silver Dragon

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The writing has been on the wall for some time and now with the Great Reset coming the freedom to drive large engined ICE vehicles wherever and whenever we want to is surely going to be continually curtailed.

It isn’t just increasing taxation and road pricing that will accelerate this restraint on personal freedom but also many more cities will become effectively car free centres.

My view is that with time limited it becomes even more important to use your Mustang as freely and widely as possible while you still can.

If this year has proved anything it is take nothing for granted.
 
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v8hgt

v8hgt

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I think this is the view point I am increasingly converging on too. The time has come to use it before I lose it, because lose it, I surely will within an ever decreasing number of years.
 

Supersolo

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Hear me out here, if europe is setting up all these stupid emissions and taxes and crap why not just leave...
The U.K. is about to leave Europe.
But our " Leader " wants to prove that his penis is larger than everyone elses, so he's joined the " see who bans ICE soonest " competition, to win favour with Greta.

I'd happily leave the U.K. to drive a V8 in the land of the free & home of the brave.
But Jeez! Have you tried?
It's impossible!!
 

 
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