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Strokerswild

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Honestly, it sounds like you're a better man for the experience. Now what if these assistance grants could only apply to say STEM programs, or similar "working" fields like agricultural programs?
No doubt the experience molded me....it definitely made me appreciate the results of working one's ass off.

I'm all for STEM programs/grants, I know I would have appreciated such a thing.
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Cplennon17

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I personally have 120k in loans from getting a bachelors degree in mechanical engineering. Yes, I did sign up for the loans (I thought I was getting into 80k of loans but they tacked another 40k on, another story another day), I am not looking for someone to forgive them, but I think some relief is necessary. Why do I need to pay 120k in loans for the same education that someone got 20 years ago that costed them under HALF that cost previously? Boy do I wish I could just work a summer job and afford my whole 4 yrs of college, I am working 2 jobs just to afford them now......850$ a month for the next 15 years.

Yes, I signed the dotted line, but my hand was kind of forced. If I wanted to "make anything of myself" after dropping out of high school, college was my only option. That decision led me to getting my GED, which only certain colleges would accept, and needing night time classes due to working full time left 1 college in my local area left, boom 120k in loans.

Is it all bad? No, I have a 285k house, I did buy a 35K mustang 4 years ago, but that's because I have a wife that works and makes good money as well. I could not imagine being from a lower income housing and trying to take all these loans on. My parents had me at 16 (I am 30 now) so there was no such thing as a college fund in my future, but they supported me by letting me live at home for free while I was in school. There are tons of people who need to go to work instantly to help afford bills from single family households, where's their opportunity??
 

Strokerswild

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While I went, I don't believe that such an emphasis should be made to herd kids toward college. If I had to do it over again, I might go a different route, probably a trade. A lot of those guys make what I do being a mechanical engineer, or more. But since I was good in math and science in high school, I was aimed for that engineering degree.

The cost of college, while plenty high when I went, is astronomical now. I haven't done the math, but I'm not sure I could work my way through in six years as I did. The cost of college tuition needs to be addressed more so than student loan forgiveness (don't get me started on the insane textbook costs).
 

bootlegger

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I personally have 120k in loans from getting a bachelors degree in mechanical engineering. Yes, I did sign up for the loans (I thought I was getting into 80k of loans but they tacked another 40k on, another story another day), I am not looking for someone to forgive them, but I think some relief is necessary. Why do I need to pay 120k in loans for the same education that someone got 20 years ago that costed them under HALF that cost previously? Boy do I wish I could just work a summer job and afford my whole 4 yrs of college, I am working 2 jobs just to afford them now......850$ a month for the next 15 years.

Yes, I signed the dotted line, but my hand was kind of forced. If I wanted to "make anything of myself" after dropping out of high school, college was my only option. That decision led me to getting my GED, which only certain colleges would accept, and needing night time classes due to working full time left 1 college in my local area left, boom 120k in loans.

Is it all bad? No, I have a 285k house, I did buy a 35K mustang 4 years ago, but that's because I have a wife that works and makes good money as well. I could not imagine being from a lower income housing and trying to take all these loans on. My parents had me at 16 (I am 30 now) so there was no such thing as a college fund in my future, but they supported me by letting me live at home for free while I was in school. There are tons of people who need to go to work instantly to help afford bills from single family households, where's their opportunity??
As an ME (15 years now), I am happy that people like you do get the degree. Also, as someone who has lived in the EU, I find many comments in this thread quite silly.
 

Strokerswild

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Exactly. ^^^^

I remember general eds well. What a waste of time and money.

I did get a minor in English to go along with my engineering degree so I can be a grammar dick, so there's that.
 

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bootlegger

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Exactly. ^^^^

I remember general eds well. What a waste of time and money.

I did get a minor in English to go along with my engineering degree so I can be a grammar dick, so there's that.
I may be in the minority here, but I actually got a lot out of my general courses. I also took them seriously, because my math courses put my GPA in a bad spot. I took a theater/acting course, which greatly improved my public speaking abilities. I took a course in art history, which helped me respect artistic design and styles. This helped when traveling for business in EU. I could actually give customers a bit of a guided tour and discuss the era of the building designs. I also took a philosophy course which forced me to debate on the side of an issue I didn't agree with. I learned to see things from the other side. I have used what I learned in these courses far more than what I learned in Diff Eq or my course on Matlab/C.
 

sk47

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Why do I need to pay 120k in loans for the same education that someone got 20 years ago that costed them under HALF that cost previously?
Hello; This is an easy one to answer. Allow me to give some examples. I started college in 1965. At that time I could go to Conly's fast food drive in on US 25E just outside Middlesboro KY. I could order two foot long hot dogs, an order of dries from fresh cut potatoes and a milk shake cup of milk for a dollar. I married in 1966 and could buy a week or more's worth of food for the two of us for $20. I graduated in 1970 and looked at an SS Camaro with a list price of $4000. Got my first teaching job in 1970 which paid around $4,500 per year so I could not afford the Camaro. There is a point to this.
Several times in this thread and the first one about federal student loan forgiveness it has been mentioned in some form about how much in debt the USA currently is and how such programs will be too expensive. The base reason you pay more today is the inflation which comes from the massive debt which increases each year. As a country we spend beyond our means and borrow the rest. In effect you may not be spending that much more in terms of value that those of us did in the past.
I paid much less for food , tuition, books, lodging and such back in 1965 to 1970 with fewer dollar. But those dollars were harder to come by back then. I think my first job paid something like 75 cents an hour or maybe a bit less. Inflation.

At least some of the ever growing inflation comes from the various social programs enacted since 1965. The sort of federal spending programs which never seem to come to an end and swell well beyond the initial purpose. Add these debt bombs to the needed federal spending and we have the current situation. Some estimates put relief of federal student loans at over a trillion dollars on it's own. Could be less as details are not yet known.
So if the trend continues and you have a child bound for college, that child may face over $500,000 in "normal" college costs. Problem is at some point the USA dollar will not be the base currency it had been for so long. At some point people and institutions will stop buying federal treasury notes and the ride will stop. Inflation will then go completely out of control is my take.

It's a giant money-making scheme at this point. Once the colleges got in bed with the lending agencies, and the debt was exempt from bankruptcy, it stopped being about education. A
Hello; this is the other reason for the rising cost of college in particular which is even greater than regular inflation. A much greater increase in cost over other inflation. If I have my information correct college and health care are the big two in terms of cost. And also among two of the things big government is involved with.

To sum up. My opposition to student loan forgiveness is not some revenge because I had to pay my way and my debts.
 

lonegunman

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No opinion here.


Sorry, I do not see your opinion here either. And my reading skills are fairly decent.

Please tell me what I am missing. I'm open to hearing your opinion but these political rants are going to get this thread shut off. Just like the last one. Is that what you're trying to do?

Use those amazing "reading skills" and go read the original post.

What you are missing is the ability to be honest and truthful. You ignored my first post to try and distort what I've said, typical of a Dimmercrat. Dishonesty and distortion are two of your best qualities.

My opinion of vote buying is unfavorable, therefore I'm probably not a Dimmercrat. Paying of the debt of dregs is completely offensive to every decent person who accepted responsibility and paid their debts. Why does your party always reward the scum first?

I do not support voter fraud, therefore I'm not a Dimmercrat.

Promising "student loan debt relief" for votes is literally buying votes, a form of election fraud. Do you have the ability to understand that?
 

bootlegger

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If I have my information correct college and health care are the big two in terms of cost. And also among two of the things big government is involved with.
The governments of many countries are far more involved in education and healthcare than the USA, and many of these countries pay a fraction of what we do for education and healthcare. Private universities are exponentially more expensive than state universities. This isn't just a simple issue that we can point a finger at the gov and say "you did it". There are ways the government has helped the cost of education in this country. Back when I was in school, I was making $10/hr from a government research grant. Best part time job I ever had, and it allowed me to pay for books/food/housing.
 

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But I’m not open to paying more from my taxes to pay for these free things to people. I work hard, this should be optional. If you want free college and get it, you should pay that tax for life til it’s paid off
 

sk47

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The governments of many countries are far more involved in education and healthcare than the USA, and many of these countries pay a fraction of what we do for education and healthcare.
Hello; Afraid I do not know enough details about the other countries to make reliable comments. At least one thing I have heard is that in some of those countries the personal income taxes are very much higher than the USA. Also some debate about the quality of the health care. I do not have exact enough information to make strong counter points.
Some strong connections have been made about how the backing of student loans by the federal government is a substantial part of the rise in the cost of college. Perhaps the best being the one about what would regular banks do if the loans were not so backed. I agree than loans would be harder to get from a bank for questionable degrees. As it stands now the lenders have little to no risk. The colleges have loads of money coming in from these secure loans and can raise prices.

But I’m not open to paying more from my taxes to pay for these free things to people. I work hard, this should be optional. If you want free college and get it, you should pay that tax for life til it’s paid off
Hello; This is another point those in favor of canceling federal student loan debt often look past. Concerning those of us who actually pay taxes the cost of government programs is spread among all of us. The reward from student loan forgiveness will not be equally shared.

I am going to make an assumption possibly not entirely true. That assumption being people go to college to qualify for a good job. Those who pick a good major often get good jobs and can pay off the loans. Those who pick weak majors find lesser rewarding jobs and have the "burden" of debt for an education not actually worth the cost.
 

FreePenguin

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Hello; Afraid I do not know enough details about the other countries to make reliable comments. At least one thing I have heard is that in some of those countries the personal income taxes are very much higher than the USA. Also some debate about the quality of the health care. I do not have exact enough information to make strong counter points.
Some strong connections have been made about how the backing of student loans by the federal government is a substantial part of the rise in the cost of college. Perhaps the best being the one about what would regular banks do if the loans were not so backed. I agree than loans would be harder to get from a bank for questionable degrees. As it stands now the lenders have little to no risk. The colleges have loads of money coming in from these secure loans and can raise prices.


Hello; This is another point those in favor of canceling federal student loan debt often look past. Concerning those of us who actually pay taxes the cost of government programs is spread among all of us. The reward from student loan forgiveness will not be equally shared.

I am going to make an assumption possibly not entirely true. That assumption being people go to college to qualify for a good job. Those who pick a good major often get good jobs and can pay off the loans. Those who pick weak majors find lesser rewarding jobs and have the "burden" of debt for an education not actually worth the cost.
Was at a family event and one of the siblings is majoring in liberal arts, defended them, said it makes a good person even if has no point for work.

what the fk? I went off. He said liberal arts for him and his friends was to enlighten them as a person, with zero intent to get work from it

he’s pro Bernie sanders, and is all for this free college and debt write offs.

he’s also a loser, dude is just weird. I don’t want to support a single penny towards him or people like him. It’s a rip off to tax payers.
 

Bikeman315

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Use those amazing "reading skills" and go read the original post.

What you are missing is the ability to be honest and truthful. You ignored my first post to try and distort what I've said, typical of a Dimmercrat. Dishonesty and distortion are two of your best qualities.

My opinion of vote buying is unfavorable, therefore I'm probably not a Dimmercrat. Paying of the debt of dregs is completely offensive to every decent person who accepted responsibility and paid their debts. Why does your party always reward the scum first?

I do not support voter fraud, therefore I'm not a Dimmercrat.

Promising "student loan debt relief" for votes is literally buying votes, a form of election fraud. Do you have the ability to understand that?
I'm not a Democrat therefore your post has no merit. But thanks for the name calling. Tells us all we need to know about you.
 

Bikeman315

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what the fk? I went off. He said liberal arts for him and his friends was to enlighten them as a person, with zero intent to get work from it
Donald, not everyone who goes to college uses it to get a job. College is a place to become further educated. A lot of people go for majors/minors that have absolutely nothing to do with where they plan their future employment. For instance my carpenter has a degree in Zoology. Why, because he liked it. Not everyone go to become a doctor, lawyer, or engineer. That's what liberal arts is all about. It's a good start for an 18 year old who doesn't know what they want to be yet.
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