P0430 Code Procharged w/stock cats

[pmor4243]

Question for the group here. Had a P0430 come up yesterday.

Car has been Procharged for about 10k miles on the stock cats and all has been well. As of right now this is the only code that’s showing up.

My plan was to pop a new sensor in and see if that solves the problem but was curious if that code is a pretty good indicator that the cat is actually bad based on what others may have seen.

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[engineermike]

Most likely a failed cat.

 

[pmor4243]

Most likely a failed cat.

Bummer. Still wanting to be able to pass emi

Most likely a failed cat.

Thanks Mike. It actually looks like there is a TSB for 18 and early 19 GTs with a 0420 and/or0430 code.

Hoping I may be able to get it fixed under that.

 

[engineermike]

All my local dealers wouldn’t. Some argue the emissions system is still covered but that wasn’t my luck. Fortunately swapping out a cat is pretty easy, probably 1-1.5 hrs drivers side and 30 minutes passengers. However, new ones will eventually fail as well. The stock coyote cats are very delicate. I think I have a tuning strategy that will help but most tuners go the opposite way.

 

[ZXMustang]

This is why I went for the LTs with no kittens. Then got my whipple. Yeah its loud and stinks though. I do wish I could have held on to the stock cats with the blower.

 

[pmor4243]

Ya I would definitely prefer the catted route which is why I opted to leave them. I just figured/hoped I would have gotten more life out of them.

Bummer, I wish there was a better option for cats with a blower.

 

[DF19RS3]

Cats are covered..Ive been through several and if you are out of base warranty their is a separate Federally mandated warranty that Ford has on their cars. Here is from the Ford owner manual for my 2019.

 

[pmor4243]

Im sure things like superchargers may change those coverages a bit.

For other reasons, I have actually been contemplating selling the car and just put it back to stock over the weekend. Still VERY on the fence about this as this thing has been an absolute blast and I feel like I just got it all dialed in how I like, but other things in life are calling for time/attention/money, so Ill see what happens there.

I figure if the code comes back, which I'm sure it will, I may have a better chance of getting it resolved in stock form.

So far after 4 30+ minute drives, I have yet to get a code, so I'm wondering if having stock amounts of air/fuel/heat may actually mean the cats can still function as expected for a while and I may be able to trade it or sell it without that being an issue.

 

[pmor4243]

Cats are covered..Ive been through several and if you are out of base warranty their is a separate Federally mandated warranty that Ford has on their cars. Here is from the Ford owner manual for my 2019.

Did you have any issue getting those covered while you were supercharged? Yours may have been new enough that it was still under the Roush/Ford warrantee I suppose.

I just assumed with 700 hp to the tire, that any part connected to the engine would be near impossible to get covered.

 

[DF19RS3]

Roush fought it with the dealership..Ford pointed the finger at Roush and Roush pointed the finger at Ford. Once i showed the service writer this in the owners manual and I said I just wanted it fixed it got fixed. Took me about a month of dicking around. Been through two sets in the past 7500 miles. Code has to be active when you bring in the car to have scanned. I have a few friends with Whipples that have blown theirs out as well. They were covered under warranty. I guess it could be in how the claim was filed as well. I just went catless a few weeks ago when I had an IC Chiller installed along with a Wengerd Dyno tune. You have nothing to lose by giving it a shot. Dont get into boost with a plugged up cat or you will have other bigger problems.

 

[pmor4243]

Roush fought it with the dealership..Ford pointed the finger at Roush and Roush pointed the finger at Ford. Once i showed the service writer this in the owners manual and I said I just wanted it fixed it got fixed. Took me about a month of dicking around. Been through two sets in the past 7500 miles. Code has to be active when you bring in the car to have scanned. I have a few friends with Whipples that have blown theirs out as well. They were covered under warranty. I guess it could be in how the claim was filed as well. I just went catless a few weeks ago when I had an IC Chiller installed along with a Wengerd Dyno tune. You have nothing to lose by giving it a shot. Dont get into boost with a plugged up cat or you will have other bigger problems.

^^Main reason I decided to pull the supercharger off so fast. Even if I end up keeping the car and putting it all back on, I didn't want it to lead to taking the engine with it.

 

[engineermike]

None of my local or regional dealers would warranty the cats due to the added supercharger. I think they have good reason but I’ve heard some other dealers are more forgiving.

 

[pmor4243]

None of my local or regional dealers would warranty the cats due to the added supercharger. I think they have good reason but I’ve heard some other dealers are more forgiving.

That makes sense

 

[pmor4243]

Figured I would toss a little update in here. Pulled out both cats and put in some 2M delete pipes at the moment. Also ordered another set of OEM cats I found from a seller on ebay that went with Long tubes. My intent is to have an easily swappable solution moving forward.

I'm not an expert with this stuff - the cat doesnt looks horrible (Ive seen far worse examples from others on here) but there is no question that it has taken some damage. What's interesting is that this was enough to trigger a cat efficiency code with the supercharger, but no code stock.

So at least in my case, I may have been lucky they gave me an early warning sign that they were failing Prior to getting misfire codes. I did however notice a lot of knock on a pull right around when my code came up, so maybe there is some internal cat damage that was causing this thing to rattle a lot and induce knock, at least I hope thats what happened.

The passenger side looked better but not by much.

I currently have the 2M pipes on the car (no supercharger at the moment).

I'm curious for those of you that have gone down the catless route, is there any way to retain the functionality that the rear O2s play in the front wideband calibration? EngineerMike correctly pointed out in a private message that the rear O2s help to keep the front widebands in calibration. Not talking about the emissions side of things here, but more specifically are there parameters that can be adjusted that allow the rear o2 to correctly feed back calibration data to the fronts in the absence of the cats?

If not, do the front o2s just become a maintenance item for the catless crowd? It would seem like disabling the rear o2s and then changing out the fronts on a yearly basis to ensure they are staying accurate would probably work.

I could also just be way overthinking this here.

 

[pmor4243]

Alright, got a set of OEM cats from ebay, that were supposedly pulled off for long tubes at about 10k miles. It seems my o2 and cat readiness monitors are not wanting to set so I decided to look at the rear o2 sensor voltages.

This was at idle

Red is Bank 2. It looks like they both have a few fluctuations but Bank 2 consistently drops down to the .15v range. My thought based on this is that it seams that the driver side cat may be bad with the passenger potentially not far behind.

@engineermike I saw a few posts where you had used rear o2 data to identify a bad cat, does this look like what you would expect from a failed cat?

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