GT350R on coil-overs

[Eritas]

Again you’re ignorant.
What you are now telling me is magneride is fully active? Lmao yeah ok. It’s semi active.
I didn’t say vipers had magneride. It’s your incompetent Abilty to read and understand what is said.
It’s nice to know that you are now a engineer of Tractive.
You’re wrong.
As far as the shocks' damping range goes. They have very wide damping pairing with DSC controller. The peak comfort level ultimate depends on the spring selection since the selected spring rate dictates the minimum stiffness(an extreme example: don't expect the ride comfort of a 300-lbs spring when 1000-lbs spring is selected, but in real world use the shocks can produce 300 to 400-lbs of effective stiffness over the springs). The active technology allow you to select softer spring than what you'd ideally select for a given application by using the shocks to produce the peak stiffness only when the car need it. This active technology is being used by supercars like McLaren P1 and Porsche 918. They are offering this technology to users(with user preference tuneability) at a reasonable price.

Magneride is semi-active the same way McLaren's Tenneco system is reactionary as well as Porsche's Active Suspension Management (PASM) which by their definition: responds to changing road conditions and/or driving style by continuously varying the individual damping forces - ie: reactionary, not a true "active" system. Same for Tractive dampers, which are not, by definition, "active".

Increasing damping rate is not the same as spring/bar rate. Once the car takes a set, and the transient phase is complete, dampers have no effect on body roll. So you can't look at the shocks force vs velocity figure and say that it has any effect on the cars peak body roll when the damper is not moving. :headbonk:

Coilovers are only as good as the people who set the valving and spring rates up, and the person fine tuning the damping settings for the given characteristics and needs of a given car (weight, tire, power, aero, etc..). Asking what coilovers are "best" on a forum isn't the right way to do it, especially without listing all his mods and details on his car.

Please learn how to make a paragraph.

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[Dominator]

I know they’re in the early stages. Definitely a place to start sourcing information.

For my street car I like to track, after installing the FP springs and bars, I will likely play with a DSC tuner as well. I have heard, yes rumor, that Ford engineers indicated there was a lot left on the table with shock tuning.

:cheers:
Exactly and that’s why I mentioned the dsc controller. Without it there is no other way to tune the magneride. Same thing I said all along.

 

[Dominator]

Magneride is semi-active the same way McLaren's Tenneco system is reactionary as well as Porsche's Active Suspension Management (PASM) which by their definition: responds to changing road conditions and/or driving style by continuously varying the individual damping forces - I: reactionary, not a true "active" system. Same for Tractive dampers, which are not, by definition, "active".

Increasing damping rate is not the same as spring/bar rate. Once the car takes a set, and the transient phase is complete, dampers have no effect on body roll. So you can't look at the shocks force vs velocity figure and say that it has any effect on the cars peak body roll when the damper is not moving. :headbonk:

Coilovers are only as good as the people who set the valving and spring rates up, and the person fine tuning the damping settings for the given characteristics and needs of a given car (weight, tire, power, aero, etc..). Asking what coilovers are "best" on a forum isn't the right way to do it, especially without listing all his mods and details on his car.

I’ll tell you what.
Why don’t you call or email dsc, Tractive or better yet talk to Mike Levitas or Tom Chan. The engineers that done all the work. Nothing I say is right to you. You have all the answers. I’m done explaining.

 

[Eritas]

I’ll tell you what.
Why don’t you call or email dsc, Tractive or better yet talk to Mike Levitas or Tom Chan. The engineers that done all the work. Nothing I say is right to you. You have all the answers. I’m done explaining.

Because you don't know what you're talking about

 

[Dominator]

Because you don't know what you're talking about

Ok and like I said. Your wrong and you are ignorant to the fact that the Tractive system is fully active and capable of what I said in my last post. All you want to do is argue and say I’m wrong when you don’t know anything about the Tractive dampers. You already shown your ignorance stating they use a stepper motor to adjust damping...LMAO

Not to mention you first said our magneride was active then I said it’s semi active. Now you say it’s also semi active. Make up your mind.
So basically you’re telling me I’m wrong in saying the Tractive dampers allow you to run a softer spring rate because the Tractive damper produces 300-400 lbs of effective stiffness over the spring itself?

 

[Eritas]

Ok and like I said. Your wrong and you are ignorant to the fact that the Tractive system is fully active and capable of what I said in my last post. All you want to do is argue and say I’m wrong when you don’t know anything about the Tractive dampers. You already shown your ignorance stating they use a stepper motor to adjust damping...LMAO

You have no idea what you're talking about. By definition (below) Tractive dampers are NOT active.

Tractive dampers appear to be a standard motorsports damper with a traditional adjustable shim stack. Based off of the damping curves that they have on their website, I'm assuming they use a motor to adjust the shaft that alters the shim stack the same way manually turning knobs on a double or triple-adjustable damper would be.

Since i'm ignorant and you know everything, can you provide cutaway images and explain how Tractive dampers work?

Not to mention you first said our magneride was active then I said it’s semi active. Now you say it’s also semi active. Make up your mind.

Many people call Magneride 'active' relative to a non-adjustable passive damper. I don't deny that I too called it 'active'. You wanted to be more specific and argue over semantics, so I called it 'semi-active' because by the true definition of "active", Magneride, McLaren's Tenneco, Porsche's PASM, AND Tractive dampers are not, by definition, "active" since they ALL respond and react to the inputs of sensors to change the damping.

So basically you’re telling me I’m wrong in saying the Tractive dampers allow you to run a softer spring rate because the Tractive damper produces 300-400 lbs of effective stiffness over the spring itself?

You clearly don't know how DAMPING force differs from SPRING rate.

A car with a 500lb spring will eventually compress the same given a steady-state cornering (or braking) load whether it has 100lbs or 800lbs of damping force. Dampers have no effect on the peak roll of a car. They are transient devices.


Thanks for figuring out paragraphs

 

[Competition Orange]

:doh: I need to learn how to do that multi imbedded split quote response thingy. I will admit to being ignorant.

It's easy. When you use the quote button, you'll have the post loaded into the comment window. Copy the [ quote=name;numbers] grouping at the beginning and insert it wherever you want a new quote to begin.

:doh: I need to learn how to do that multi imbedded split quote response thingy.

Then end each quote grouping with the [/quote] sting placing it wherever you want each grouping to end.

I will admit to being ignorant.

Hope this helps.

 

[snaproll]

CO - thanks! I’m going to try that.

This is one setup I looked at about 30 mi ago:

 

[stanglife]

CO - thanks! I’m going to try that.

This is one setup I looked at about 30 mi ago:

Did you just define the timeframe in miles? Love it! :cheers:

 

[snaproll]

Did you just define the timeframe in miles? Love it! :cheers:

Ha - you guys pay attention to detail, that’s what I like about this place.

Funny thing is that iwas about right; 30 mi or 30 min, I was rolling down the road.

The other race car around here has Ohlins, which probably came from Cortex and/or Dean. I’m headed to KohR this Friday. Gotta get some parts for the S197 to try to keep up with this superior new chassis!

 

[Kenwood1113]

Fella's, in all due respect, I didn't start this thread to create tension. I have very limited experience with coil-overs and wanted input from folks who have run them on a R. My hope was to learn something from those who are more educated than me; my driving instructor runs a race spec Porsche, he suggested I look to those on the forums for feedback.

So to clear the air........I run HPDE events and have track experience (there are many great wheel men out there but I'm don't give many point by's. No one during our last event). Someone mentioned Focus RS's in this thread and mentioned their friend has one. Yea, they're fun cars, I gave my son one for his 16th birthday as a second car so he could run HPDE events with me. Before we run our first event at VIR I will throw some mods at the R including: Watson Racing roll bar, racing harness, Hoosier R7's, carbon fiber drive shaft, Braille battery, a tune, possibly front carbon fiber rotors and suspension mods. Bolt on suspension mods are an option as well as coil-overs. I just wanted solid feedback from people who have run them on R's, not commentary from people who have no experience with them on R's or folks who disagree with the spend as costs is notwithstanding.

Thank you to those who have contributed and those of you who want to battle--carry on........."in all due respect" (spoken loosely).

 

[Next Phase]

Hey Ken,
Are you doing the Watson roll bar install yourself? I'm in the process of installing some parts as we speak (tow hooks f/r), wheels, brakes, etc.
Looking at a roll bar and harness, but thinking of going Cooltech.
(I'm local in Raleigh - I think I've seen you around at C&C).

 

[snaproll]

Ken - an R is just another S550 if you are going to gut the suspension.

If you are going 11/10ths and find it unsatisfactory for a reason, I’d consider doing something. Otherwise, don’t screw with an R. You’re only going downhill unless you know what you’re doing. After over 10 years of racing (life after HPDE), I still have little idea of what makes one dampener faster than another. Lots of things to do consider. But for HPDE, just go have fun with your car and learn to drive it to whatever limit you have.

 

[Memphis9s]

I gave my son one for his 16th birthday as a second car so he could run HPDE events with me.

You looking to adopt another son ?

 

[stanglife]

Fella's, in all due respect, I didn't start this thread to create tension. I have very limited experience with coil-overs and wanted input from folks who have run them on a R. My hope was to learn something from those who are more educated than me; my driving instructor runs a race spec Porsche, he suggested I look to those on the forums for feedback.

So to clear the air........I run HPDE events and have track experience (there are many great wheel men out there but I'm don't give many point by's. No one during our last event). Someone mentioned Focus RS's in this thread and mentioned their friend has one. Yea, they're fun cars, I gave my son one for his 16th birthday as a second car so he could run HPDE events with me. Before we run our first event at VIR I will throw some mods at the R including: Watson Racing roll bar, racing harness, Hoosier R7's, carbon fiber drive shaft, Braille battery, a tune, possibly front carbon fiber rotors and suspension mods. Bolt on suspension mods are an option as well as coil-overs. I just wanted solid feedback from people who have run them on R's, not commentary from people who have no experience with them on R's or folks who disagree with the spend as costs is notwithstanding.

Thank you to those who have contributed and those of you who want to battle--carry on........."in all due respect" (spoken loosely).

I think what a few people were trying to say was that unless you're already a pro at driving AND car setup - you'd likely be wasting money due to your inability to take advantage of even the stock setup and the likelihood that the modifications would actually set the car backwards a bit. The fact that you didn't find a plethora of R owners who have dumped the OE suspension should tell you something. Forgive me...and with all due respect...it sounds like you want to "play" pro and you have the money to burn, so to that end, do what makes you happy.

So many times people come in here with questions but seem to already have their minds made up - makes for a rough conversation.

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