CQ.UK 3.0 Ceramic Lessons Learned

[TeamGomez]

Shout out in advance to the gray beards and savvy aficionados of all things *clean and swirl free* who helped propel my car care technology to the 21st century (or in tech speak, I just tossed my flip phone in the campfire...stby for interesting flames from the fire pit lol).

I cut my teeth on the wheels with CP DLUX and got familiar with how the product laid down and buffed off. DFB5.0 educated me on the latest and greatest products for SMR paint correction that really helped me finish off my black car that was giving me fits on the finish phase. Reflect did the job well and I thought I'd see how the Sonax Ultimate Cut/Perfect Finish would do on the Oxford White to prep for my first effort at laying down ceramic.

Bottom Line Up Front: The hardest part is prepping the car, the paint, and having the patience to not rush it.

It took me about 3 days to get 'er done. I worked in 3 (ummm nm...make that 8) phases:
1. Masking off plastics/trim/seals
2. Ultimate Cut to knock down the gnarly stuff
3. Perfect Finish to shine it up.
4. Decontaminate/strip oils
5. CQ.UK on the painted surfaces (2 coats).
6. CP Skin on the vinyl/ppf
7. CP Reload to slick it off
8. DLUX on the plastics

1. Masking. I had no idea what would happen if the CQ.UK got smeared on the unintended surfaces so I taped off the places in jeopardy. Used the 5mm masking tape from a detailing supplier and it was sufficient.

Hindsight: Probably not a factor. The product can be quickly removed on the surfaces I did smudge a little on but I'm sure you must be quick about it.

Oh yeah....forgot to mention...I did wash and clay the car b/f starting the masking portion...so I guess that makes it 9 phases.

2. Ultimate Cut was not as aggressive as I thought it was going to be with a green pad on the 6" Bigfoot & Griot's 3" ROB. Took me about 3 applications to get some of the deeper cuts on the mistress (17k miles when purchased in Nov and paint was in good shape overall with typical 'somebody set shit on it here' scars). Kept the pads clean with a pad brush and washed all the pads at the end of every day.

3. Perfect Finish did exactly that. Of course, it was all in the wrist...

4. I used 30% IPA 70% deionized water solution to decontaminate the entire car. Paint/Vinyl/Plastics.

4. Now for the easy part...after experimenting on a couple smaller spots, I was surprised how easy it was to lay down the ceramic. Almost an identical process to applying Zaino's acrylic product (read: less is more...I used approx 15ml to coat the car twice). I saw how the ceramic flashed (turned rainbowy...that is a word...well, now it is) and it was easiest to use my ceiling mounted UFO LEDs (one 250W, two 90W) to see this. Not as easy with the Scangrip light though it was a huge help in seeing any spots where I didn't completely 'level' the product. I initially just used the CP orange MF towel that comes in the box, but added a 530gm edgeless MF towel for final buff. Laid down two coats on all exterior surfaces plus door jambs/door latch face (essentially the end plate of the door).

Remember- no Miyagi-san wax-on, wax-off rotations. Uni-directional with vertical swipes on the sides and longitudinal on the horizontal/flat surfaces. Very tempting to go side to side on the sides when you're sideways to begin with but there's a refractive reason behind this. Unless you're south of the equator then reverse the wipeology...coriolis forces, you know...

I probably violated CP's marketing department rules on only using the mf applicator for 2 panels...I used one applicator for the entire car and started with a new one for the second coat.

Pro tip: that damned bottle has a curved spout on the inside of the dispensing cap. They were thinking when they designed it...rotate the bottle so it curves up and it lays down a nice line of product on the mf applicator. Flip it 180 degrees and you'll be cussing at why the shit won't come out. My favorite John Wayne quote: "Life's tough. It's tougher when you're stupid..." Lesson learned.

5. CP Skin on the vinyl/ppf. I was not as impressed with this product. I was hoping it was going to assuage some of the micro marring on the vinyl but it did not. It says not to add any other chemicals for 3-5 days after applying and, well, 2 days later I did spray some Reload on it...we'll see if they turn pink and purple, crack, and get ingested by the 5.2.

6. Reload directions says to apply, let sit for a minute, then buff off. Very easy to work with and actually didn't add much 'pop'. Then again, hard to do with white.

7. The DLUX is great stuff. Easy to work with I really like the finish it puts on the plastic trim pieces.

Gonna hit a car show tomm so maybe I'll get some glamor shots of the mistress in her element (one of them, anyhow). Cheers for now.

Sponsored

 

[DFB5.0]

Shout out in advance to the gray beards and savvy aficionados of all things *clean and swirl free* who helped propel my car care technology to the 21st century (or in tech speak, I just tossed my flip phone in the campfire...stby for interesting flames from the fire pit lol).

I cut my teeth on the wheels with CP DLUX and got familiar with how the product laid down and buffed off. DFB5.0 educated me on the latest and greatest products for SMR paint correction that really helped me finish off my black car that was giving me fits on the finish phase. Reflect did the job well and I thought I'd see how the Sonax Ultimate Cut/Perfect Finish would do on the Oxford White to prep for my first effort at laying down ceramic.

Bottom Line Up Front: The hardest part is prepping the car, the paint, and having the patience to not rush it.

It took me about 3 days to get 'er done. I worked in 3 (ummm nm...make that 8) phases:
1. Masking off plastics/trim/seals
2. Ultimate Cut to knock down the gnarly stuff
3. Perfect Finish to shine it up.
4. Decontaminate/strip oils
5. CQ.UK on the painted surfaces (2 coats).
6. CP Skin on the vinyl/ppf
7. CP Reload to slick it off
8. DLUX on the plastics

1. Masking. I had no idea what would happen if the CQ.UK got smeared on the unintended surfaces so I taped off the places in jeopardy. Used the 5mm masking tape from a detailing supplier and it was sufficient.

Hindsight: Probably not a factor. The product can be quickly removed on the surfaces I did smudge a little on but I'm sure you must be quick about it.

Oh yeah....forgot to mention...I did wash and clay the car b/f starting the masking portion...so I guess that makes it 9 phases.

2. Ultimate Cut was not as aggressive as I thought it was going to be with a green pad on the 6" Bigfoot & Griot's 3" ROB. Took me about 3 applications to get some of the deeper cuts on the mistress (17k miles when purchased in Nov and paint was in good shape overall with typical 'somebody set shit on it here' scars). Kept the pads clean with a pad brush and washed all the pads at the end of every day.

3. Perfect Finish did exactly that. Of course, it was all in the wrist...

4. I used 30% IPA 70% deionized water solution to decontaminate the entire car. Paint/Vinyl/Plastics.

4. Now for the easy part...after experimenting on a couple smaller spots, I was surprised how easy it was to lay down the ceramic. Almost an identical process to applying Zaino's acrylic product (read: less is more...I used approx 15ml to coat the car twice). I saw how the ceramic flashed (turned rainbowy...that is a word...well, now it is) and it was easiest to use my ceiling mounted UFO LEDs (one 250W, two 90W) to see this. Not as easy with the Scangrip light though it was a huge help in seeing any spots where I didn't completely 'level' the product. I initially just used the CP orange MF towel that comes in the box, but added a 530gm edgeless MF towel for final buff. Laid down two coats on all exterior surfaces plus door jambs/door latch face (essentially the end plate of the door).

Remember- no Miyagi-san wax-on, wax-off rotations. Uni-directional with vertical swipes on the sides and longitudinal on the horizontal/flat surfaces. Very tempting to go side to side on the sides when you're sideways to begin with but there's a refractive reason behind this. Unless you're south of the equator then reverse the wipeology...coriolis forces, you know...

I probably violated CP's marketing department rules on only using the mf applicator for 2 panels...I used one applicator for the entire car and started with a new one for the second coat.

Pro tip: that damned bottle has a curved spout on the inside of the dispensing cap. They were thinking when they designed it...rotate the bottle so it curves up and it lays down a nice line of product on the mf applicator. Flip it 180 degrees and you'll be cussing at why the shit won't come out. My favorite John Wayne quote: "Life's tough. It's tougher when you're stupid..." Lesson learned.

5. CP Skin on the vinyl/ppf. I was not as impressed with this product. I was hoping it was going to assuage some of the micro marring on the vinyl but it did not. It says not to add any other chemicals for 3-5 days after applying and, well, 2 days later I did spray some Reload on it...we'll see if they turn pink and purple, crack, and get ingested by the 5.2.

6. Reload directions says to apply, let sit for a minute, then buff off. Very easy to work with and actually didn't add much 'pop'. Then again, hard to do with white.

7. The DLUX is great stuff. Easy to work with I really like the finish it puts on the plastic trim pieces.

Gonna hit a car show tomm so maybe I'll get some glamor shots of the mistress in her element (one of them, anyhow). Cheers for now.

Excellent work, excellent post!

I probably violated CP's marketing department rules on only using the mf applicator for 2 panels...I used one applicator for the entire car and started with a new one for the second coat.

Carpro are probably happy to sell you additional microfiber applicators, so don't stress about that. I would say it's very temperature dependent, if it were a scorching hot day in summer, maybe replace the applicator a couple of times. But in most cases, you can get around the car with just one or two.

CP Skin on the vinyl/ppf. I was not as impressed with this product. I was hoping it was going to assuage some of the micro marring on the vinyl but it did not. It says not to add any other chemicals for 3-5 days after applying and, well, 2 days later I did spray some Reload on it...we'll see if they turn pink and purple, crack, and get ingested by the 5.2.

Those warnings are usually in relation to cleaning chemicals like soaps, APC, iron/bug/tar removers. This is to allow the coating to fully cure. Reload is more than ok, in fact it helps protect the coating during those 3-5 days as it cures. So you did the right thing.

Reload directions says to apply, let sit for a minute, then buff off. Very easy to work with and actually didn't add much 'pop'. Then again, hard to do with white.

Most of your "pop" will have been achieved during the polishing process. Polishing adds clarity, the coating adds gloss, Reload adds slickness. As you allude to, white is often not a rewarding mistress.

The DLUX is great stuff. Easy to work with I really like the finish it puts on the plastic trim pieces.

What I love about DLUX on trim is how rich it makes unpainted black plastic look. No gloss, or even a sheen, just a deep/dark tone.

 

[TeamGomez]

Got diarrhea of the American Express card and hit Autogeek up for the gallon of CP Reset and CP BlackOut Tire and Rubber coating (their 25% off sales rock...Happy St Patty's Day). Might as well go all the way with the nano products and see how well it lasts on the tires (of course, after I de-nib them...can't unsee what DFB5.0 showed me...though I think a set of flush cut side-cutters will get 'er done pronto like).

I saw a promo photo showing somebody screwing a foam cannon nozzle atop the bottle of Reset. Given its relative strength, this seems like it would toss waaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyy too much product out. Guessing a couple oz (or ml for y'all who adopted an easier way to measure stuff) in a 16oz (nearly half liter) foam cannon will suffice. What's best practice here with the Reset?

Gotta go cut some nibs...cheers!

 

[DFB5.0]

Got diarrhea of the American Express card and hit Autogeek up for the gallon of CP Reset and CP BlackOut Tire and Rubber coating (their 25% off sales rock...Happy St Patty's Day). Might as well go all the way with the nano products and see how well it lasts on the tires (of course, after I de-nib them...can't unsee what DFB5.0 showed me...though I think a set of flush cut side-cutters will get 'er done pronto like).

I saw a promo photo showing somebody screwing a foam cannon nozzle atop the bottle of Reset. Given its relative strength, this seems like it would toss waaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyy too much product out. Guessing a couple oz (or ml for y'all who adopted an easier way to measure stuff) in a 16oz (nearly half liter) foam cannon will suffice. What's best practice here with the Reset?

Gotta go cut some nibs...cheers!

Just be careful with BlackOut, you need those tires to be scrupulously clean prior to application for it to bond properly. I've seen some be impressed with it, others hated it. Maybe do a couple of practice runs on something else before going in for the kill.

With Reset, yeah, don't do that. I use a MTM foam cannon, which is a 1000ml capacity. I fill it with water first, about 900 to 950 ml of water. I then add 50 to 100 ml of soap to the bottle. I really don't accurately measure these quantities out, but with how concentrated Reset is, you can get away with the lower amounts in the cannon. I would start with 100ml in 900ml of water and see how you go.

Keep in mind, foam quality and consistency can vary depending on your water hardness, pressure washer setup and foam cannon. I also empty out the foam cannon into my wash bucket if I have any remaining, the minerals within the water will reduce the foamability if left sit for a few days.

 

[TeamGomez]

Copy all and thanks for the tipper. I did also get the CP MultiX Cleaner Concentrate to get after the tires b/f 'going in for the kill' .

I am lucky enough to have an endless supply of DI water from my Simple Chuck. Co-founded the system back in '16 along with a soap that could be used in full sun and one of the first SiO2 sealers. The one I had developed (there's actually only a couple labs in the US that produces stuff for everybody) is actually a bit slicker than the Reload but is also a bit 'finickier' (we put too much color & SiO2 in it...made for somewhat of an inconsistent finish if you didn't get it leveled to the 9's).

The DI really hotrods all soaps/cleaners. I usually cut my wheel cleaners with it in spray bottles and always keep a spray bottle on the workbench as it can also be called a 'surface decontaminator'...it wants to pull minerals in and can behave like an 'aqueous clay bar'. But it also accelerates the iron oxide conversion on the rotors so I usually heat up the brakes b/f wash then get a good brake in after wash to keep the rotors clean vice turning orange and shedding that all over the clean wheels on first brake.

Now I really am off to cut some nibs!

 

[TeamGomez]

Nib mission complete. Flush dykes got ‘er done.

 

[DFB5.0]

Nib mission complete. Flush dykes got ‘er done.

Looks so much better now doesn't it.

 

[kilobravo]

I would say it's very temperature dependent

Make that VERY, VERY temperature dependent as I discovered living in the tropics of Texas. :=)

Reload is more than ok, in fact it helps protect the coating during those 3-5 days as it cures. So you did the right thing.

Once again, I have learned something about this crazy subject, D and thanks.

Polishing adds clarity, the coating adds gloss, Reload adds slickness.

THAT says it ALL.

No gloss, or even a sheen, just a deep/dark tone.

EXACTLY what I like about DLUX.

I would start with 100ml in 900ml of water and see how you go.

I plan to try Reset on the next wash and you, as usual, answered my question about the ratio, many thanks.

I also empty out the foam cannon into my wash bucket if I have any remaining, the minerals within the water will reduce the foamability if left sit for a few days.

Learned something ELSE..DAMMIT, I've been leaving the remaining solution in the bottle for the next wash! Oh well, NBD, but I'll dump it in the bucket from now on.

I am lucky enough to have an endless supply of DI water from my Simple Chuck. Co-founded the system back in '16 along with a soap that could be used in full sun and one of the first SiO2 sealers.

First, your car looks SPECTACULAR John!

Secondly, pretty impressive to learn that you were/are actually in the manufacturing loop for detailing products. No doubt that experience gives you insight that the rest of us may not know.

As for water, you are spot on, (no pun intended,) and it is the reason chemists only use distilled water. We have very hard water and the whole house system I installed knocks the mineral content down a lot but it still hovered around 400ppm so I added a CR Spotless DIC20. That brought it down below 200 and the difference in cleaning performance and foam thickness was remarkable.

Very tempting to go side to side on the sides when you're sideways to begin with but there's a refractive reason behind this.

Now that's interesting, John. Like everyone else here, I've watched my share of polishing vids most of which have shown the operator alternating between moving up and down and left and right with the polisher. I've never heard your suggestion to stick with fore and aft movement on the sides and port to starboard on the horizontal surfaces but it KINDA makes sense to me logically.

What say you, D?

 

[TeamGomez]

First, your car looks SPECTACULAR John!
...
As for water, you are spot on, (no pun intended,) and it is the reason chemists only use distilled water. We have very hard water and the whole house system I installed knocks the mineral content down a lot but it still hovered around 400ppm so I added a CR Spotless DIC20. That brought it down below 200 and the difference in cleaning performance and foam thickness was remarkable.
...
Now that's interesting, John. Like everyone else here, I've watched my share of polishing vids most of which have shown the operator alternating between moving up and down and left and right with the polisher. I've never heard your suggestion to stick with fore and aft movement on the sides and port to starboard on the horizontal surfaces but it KINDA makes sense to me logically.

Thanks KB! Labors of love as they say.

The Simple Chuck brand is now wholly owned by CR Spotless so both machines come out of the same place. Your DIC-20 should be giving you 0 TDS water unless the resin is shot or you have blow-by at one of the seals. Be careful with resin nearing life-end; the system can safely be used up to around 20ppm but the pH begins to fall off dramatically above that and can actually etch glass (yep...it's happened).

As for the vertical/longitudinal wiping motions, that was for final finish application buff-off. Learned it off a Roadfly post about 20 years ago when I was doing some review postings for Sal Zaino's products. Still a fan but the new polishes take his Fusion polish to the next level and, well, ceramic is ceramic.

The intent on the wiping direction was to enhance visual composition of the body panels in question with the eventual valleys in the product reflecting/refracting light in a manner that enhances the appearance of the panel (I had a veritable polarizing filter stuck in my head ever since...can't prove a ding dang thing but it sounded good and I've stuck with it ever since!). This is likely OBE with the nano layer stuff so YMMV.

Here's a few shots from the show. The Acura is a USN tribute car owned by a car buddy who is a patriotic american. The back glass is adorned with the names of all the Blue Angels who died on active duty. I have flown with a couple of them so the car has a soft spot in my heart. His new addition of the AIM-9's was good for a laugh. Though the trophies were the real show winners- they're all hand made by an old gearhead.

Next effort: CP BlackOut for the tires AFTER a healthy MultiX wash. Looking forward to seeing how the Reset performs but I have faith in DFB5.0's little black book. It has yet to fail me

 

[kilobravo]

The Simple Chuck brand is now wholly owned by CR Spotless so both machines come out of the same place. Your DIC-20 should be giving you 0 TDS water unless the resin is shot or you have blow-by at one of the seals.

Interesting, I didn't know CR Spotless had acquired Big Chuck, that explains the popularity, John.

As for 0 TDS with the DIC20, that's not the case. Yes, the little digital readout says it's at zero but if you test the water properly, it's not. There are only two ways to get to zero..distillation or reverse osmosis.

So, even though my main system (10 gallon resin tank,) reduces it substantially, (and makes for much better showers, <smile>) even from there, the DIC20 only brings it down to the 100-300ppm level. However, for sure someone with much lower levels of TDS in their municipal water would do better with the same system I have.

As for the vertical/longitudinal wiping motions, that was for final finish application buff-off.

Ahhh...roger, that kinda makes sense now.

The back glass is adorned with the names of all the Blue Angels who died on active duty.

But THIS ↑ is what got my attention, what a wonderful thing to do, please thank your friend for me next time you see him. FLY NAVY!

 

[TeamGomez]

As for 0 TDS with the DIC20, that's not the case. Yes, the little digital readout says it's at zero but if you test the water properly, it's not. There are only two ways to get to zero..distillation or reverse osmosis.

So, even though my main system (10 gallon resin tank,) reduces it substantially, (and makes for much better showers, <smile>) even from there, the DIC20 only brings it down to the 100-300ppm level. However, for sure someone with much lower levels of TDS in their municipal water would do better with the same system I have.
....
FLY NAVY!

Hmmmm....I'd be curious what you're testing the water with that shows 100-300ppm TDS. Couple thoughts that I haven't thought about in quite a while:

-Our water in San Diego varies from 400-800ppm TDS. Winter water comes from the LA Water District at lower TDS levels and in the summer we get it from the Colorado River which damn near has stones coming out of the spigot...years ago I noticed my summer # of gallon output reduced significantly and got schooled by the city's water engineer and put on a monthly water report. Turns out the TDS also affects our breweries! Regardless of incoming TDS (at neutral alkalinity), a functioning ion exchange resin will bring the TDS to 0.

-The ion exchange process in a mixed bed resin that is in your CRSpotless system (and Simple Chuck) has cation and anion resin beads. The cation sheds hydrogen and anion sheds hydroxide ions in exchange for positively charged ions (i.e. minerals). The resulting resistance of the water is measured in ohms and that is converted to a total dissolved solid measurement on your TDS meter. While there are specifics on how to accurately set up a higher grade TDS meter in laboratories, the water from deionization really is 0 ppm total dissolved solids as all the minerals (solids) have been grabbed by the resin beads. There are organics in there that won't be removed, but they're not a dissolved solid so they don't count/won't spot your surface.

I did a ton of research on the subject b/f I scribed the Simple Chuck FAQ's that are now replicated on CR Spotless' website so let me know what I missed.

Fun fact (but not recommended) is that you can fill up your bathtub with said 0 TDS water, get in, then have your wife toss in a plugged-in toaster thinking about your $1M life insurance policy. Nothing happens b/c there are no minerals in the water to conduct electricity (i.e. it is 0 TDS at around 18 megaohms resistance and meets ISO Type 1 standard for laboratory reagent water). Maybe we can get Myth Busters to give it a shot LOL.

And wholeheartedly agree: FLY NAVY! I bet you see a bunch of white and red training birds flying around your neck of the woods. We won't mention the rotaries coming from the Army depot lol.

 

[kilobravo]

Appreciate the detailed reply, John. I don't believe that I am doing anything incorrectly or, inadequately with the house softener but the system will definitely not push the TDS to zero.

I'd be curious what you're testing the water with that shows 100-300ppm TDS

Multiple ways..test strips, handheld TDS meter, and I even had a friend who is in the business of maintaining cooling towers and has to deal with our very hard city water every day test it. He came by the house with his test kit and what must have been a multi-thousand dollar meter. We tested multiple times and the average was around 300. All three types of testing were within the same approximate range.

And, FWIW, in my own testing with the handheld meter, the DIC20 knocked it down to around 100 but I didn't have the foresight to get my friend to test that water sample.

..then have your wife toss in a plugged-in toaster

OMG that gave me a helluva morning fit of laughter, John! Obviously, you are correct BUT only in a perfect world as the tub would almost certainly have enough mineral content still on it when you poured in the distilled. <grin> I damn sure wouldn't try it. <laughing>

I bet you see a bunch of white and red training birds flying around your neck of the woods. We won't mention the rotaries coming from the Army depot lol.

We do indeed. MOF, our property is right at the 90 for runway 13 at Waldron, the outflying bounce field the Primary T6's use so we have them every day M-F if the weather is VMC. When we first moved here they were still flying T-28's so we've been through those noisy days as well as the much quieter T-34 that followed. The T-6 is a bit louder than the T-34 but after awhile, you don't hear them any longer although I often get a kick out watching the students airwork. <smile>

 

[TeamGomez]

I’ve done a lot of over the phone troubleshooting to solve riddles like this and one of the questions I asked was to let the system output dry on a flat piece of glass. If there are no ‘leftovers’ (i.e. spots), the total dissolved solid content was zero. If there are, the system is not producing to spec and needs to be troubleshot.

Of all the water supplies in the US, I only had one in Arkansas that we couldn’t resolve. Sent water test kits, a new system that op-checked good to go, and nearly flew out myself to see what was going on. Sometimes flow rate is too high with very hard water to give the ion exchange enough time to work (specially near end of life for the resin bed) but this one got the best of us. Refunded, of course, but chalked it up to organics in the water supply at the end of the day that left spots with 0 TDS.

I went thru Beeville back in the day of T-2’s & A-4’s and made many weekend runs to Corpus. I am jealous of the entertainment value of being at the 90 watching fledgling aviators on their first solo do t&g’s. What could go wrong? You have watched many I am sure if you saw the T-28 in the pattern…I am sorry I didn’t get to fly that beast though my right leg is probably thankful lol. X-wind landing days must be a hoot!

 

[skinnyb]

I agree about the flow rate, I am no expert but the DI setup I have has a flow "reducer" that slows the output significantly to allow the resin to reduce the TDS. Mine is not that high TDS out of the tap so it does a good job for me to be a cheap Amazon special. Resin lasts me a couple months too, I only use for rinse though, I run on bypass for wash and all other duties...

 

[kilobravo]

Sometimes flow rate is too high with very hard water to give the ion exchange enough time to work

Well John, flow rate is not something I had considered but now that you've mentioned it, that might be the issue. I have 1" PVC feeding the tanks but, no way to reduce the flow.

Resin lasts me a couple months too, I only use for rinse though

Same here, Alex, I only use the DIC20 for rinses. I would guess that I probably do at least 25 vehicle washes in a year and I get just about a year out of the two resin carts.

I went thru Beeville back in the day of T-2’s & A-4’s and made many weekend runs to Corpus.

I showed up here as a nugget in '82 then came back in '85 as an instructor to fly the T-44. Did that for 15 years or so on active duty. Got out and turned right around and came in as a Reservist.

The wife had a retirement party at the house and the Wing Commander (a dear friend and drinking buddy,) brought in a man from Beachcraft to give me a plague because I had logged more hours in the Kingair than any other Nasal Radiator. <grin>

I am sorry I didn’t get to fly that beast though my right leg is probably thankful lol. X-wind landing days must be a hoot!

Honestly John, the worst was being a nugget in that thing on takeoff. It took SO much right rudder that I wasn't sure I had the strength to keep it going straight. A "Beast" it was.

The wife on the ramp at Whiting Field circa 1977.

​

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