2018 Performance Pack - A big step BACKWARDS

[RocketGuy3]

I've got to agree with you. The Camaro was the better performer, and I don't think these changes to the '18 Mustang are going to pass it. Probably so close in a straight line that it doesn't matter, but as soon as the twisties start I'd be really surprised if the Camaro doesn't walk away, and more importantly, FEEL way better composed. If anyone is doubtful, go test drive a 1LE and thow it hard into a corner and notice how flat it is. It used to be that Camaro justified its higher price with higher performance. Well Ford just gave people on the fence another reason to seriously consider the Camaro over the Mustang because there is no longer a price difference, not a meaningful one at least.

Plus that LT1 has been around for a while and they have had a few years to work out some bugs, whereas this is the first year of the new Coyote.

At this point, I'm either looking for a great deal on a 1LE Camaro or getting a used 15-17 GT PP and waiting for a new Boss/Mach1 or a used GT350.

You're nuts if you think Ford wasn't track testing this thing against a Camaro and making the 1LE their benchmark for the performance pack.

It's possible the Camaro still beats it, but I highly doubt the difference will be at all meaningful to anybody but the most empty shill of a magazine racer.

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[Grintch]

You're nuts if you think Ford wasn't track testing this thing against a Camaro and making the 1LE their benchmark for the performance pack.

It's possible the Camaro still beats it, but I highly doubt the difference will be at all meaningful to anybody but the most empty shill of a magazine racer.

The PP didn't even beat the 5th generation 1LE, so given the new PP has no obvious changes other than price. I am betting no significant changes to the status quo.

Personally, performance is important to me when I am buying a performance car. But I know that makes me unusual.

 

[RocketGuy3]

The PP didn't even beat the 5th generation 1LE, so given the new PP has no obvious changes other than price. I am betting no significant changes to the status quo.

Personally, performance is important to me when I am buying a performance car. But I know that makes me unusual.

What exactly is "no significant changes"? They've made tons of chassis stiffening changes, refinements/tunes. These are not necessarily the kinds of things that will show up in a list of checkboxes, just like most of the performance differences between the Camaro and the Mustang currently are not obvious on paper.

The base GT for 2018 now is supposed to handle as well as the outgoing PP GT, for example. Yet there's no "significant change" that will explain that. But you can be confident that the new PP will be even better.

Will the Camaro still beat it? Maybe don't know, don't care (probably). The difference will be negligible. I pass Camaros from every generation in my Mustang when I go to the track, and some pass me. Camaro vs Mustang is and has always been 95% a drivers race.

Stop worrying about magazine numbers and pick the car you enjoy the most, then learn to drive it. If it's still not fast enough for you, modify it. But the greatest performance modifications are always made to the lump of flesh sitting behind the steering wheel.

 

[BmacIL]

You're nuts if you think Ford wasn't track testing this thing against a Camaro and making the 1LE their benchmark for the performance pack.

It's possible the Camaro still beats it, but I highly doubt the difference will be at all meaningful to anybody but the most empty shill of a magazine racer.

The gap to the 1LE is far too big. Making the GT PP faster than or as fast as the 1LE means it's as good or better on track as the GT350. That is not happening. Their benchmark for the GT PP should've been to best the SS.

 

[saf1]

Personally, performance is important to me when I am buying a performance car. But I know that makes me unusual.

No, that isn't unusual. Everybody should buy and pay for what makes sense to them. I'm still trying to wrap my head around this thread to understand what the frustration is all about. Price of base car, packages, or what have you. Not sure if that equates to performance.

On the professional front doesn't the Mustang / GT4 have additional weight and a different restrictor plate compared to the Camaro.

 

[RocketGuy3]

The gap to the 1LE is far too big. Making the GT PP faster than or as fast as the 1LE means it's as good or better on track as the GT350. That is not happening. Their benchmark for the GT PP should've been to best the SS.

I'm not sure why that's so far fetched. I would not be at all surprised if the 2018 GTPP is not terribly far behind the GT350 (non-R).

... But again, as I was getting at above, I think forum enthusiasts always exaggerate the size and importance of these performance differences. Few of us will ever really become good enough drivers to maximize the potential of either car.

 

[Dinosoar]

A10 Effect!

I am going to go out on a limb and suggest that the 2018 Mustang GT PP, with the A10 will beat the 1LE Camaro with a set of commensurate meats! Put on GT350 wheels and tires, and the A10 will smoke the 1LE. Of course, Chevy could always add the 8spd or A10 autos for the 1LE, but they've not so far.

 

[slag1911]

What exactly is "no significant changes"? They've made tons of chassis stiffening changes, refinements/tunes.

The PP is really that different in 2018? Really? What are these chassis stiffening updates? What are these refinements you speak of and what chassis tuning did they exactly make? Where are you getting your data from?

And if the PP has been updated as significantly as you elude too... has the gap been closed with the GT350? If so, where does the PP2 slot into?

My 2 cents... and I will come right out and say that it is pure speculation on my part: The PP likely remains pretty much unchanged. The PP2 will (hopefully) tighten the gap with the 1LE, but not match it, and certainly not overtake the GT350.

 

[VinnAY]

I admit it...visited Chevy.com and built a 1LE, and a Challenger SRT8.

Thanks a lot, Ford Mustang.

 

[Cardude99]

there is still a pp2 floating around in the future so it very well could keep up with the gt350, the gt350 will still sell cause its a shelby, voodoo engine, that sound, ability to hold value over time. i have a hard time believing the gt350 will be around in 2019. Lets be honest for a performance car the gt350 is starting to get long in the tooth, still a great car just getting old for a sports car. calling it, 2018 will be the last year for the gt350.

 

[Dinosoar]

I would never cross-shop for a Challenger if I was looking for a well-sorted sports car like the Mustang and Camaro. It just seems a car with very different end goals and market preferences. Cool cruising car, maybe a good drag car (Hellcat/Demon, of course), but for any real performance, it ain't that.

I do think Ford has botched the packaging and pricing. The new PP is pretty much the old PP. I think, however, one cannot underestimate that A10. I know many folks really want to row their own. So to that end, just wait for PP2...the proposed wheel/tire sizes seems pretty competitive. I know I am very curious, but am not buying a manual transmission, so...that'll determine my choice of PP1 or PP2.

 

[saf1]

A10. I know many folks really want to row their own.

The A10 Warthog will always hold its own. Oh, wait. The new transmission

Didn't it do a great job at the Ring when the Camaro did one of its fast laps?

 

[Dinosoar]

The A10 was awesome in the ZL1 at the Ring, yes. AND, it was if full auto mode, so the software knows what to do. I would prefer to tap my own, but it is a solid box. I hope reliability is there!

 

[joeyd5oh]

Was anyone else under the impression that the active exhaust was standard on the GT? Now an $895 option. Built the 18 the way I wanted came out to 54K without Magneride suspension. May as well buy a GT350 for 10 k more

 

[10splaya22]

Was anyone else under the impression that the active exhaust was standard on the GT? Now an $895 option. Built the 18 the way I wanted came out to 54K without Magneride suspension. May as well buy a GT350 for 10 k more

I always thought it was going to be an option. Easy money maker for Ford there.

You can get a GT350 for 60k easily now. But if you factor in the discounts for a GT, price difference is still around 10k.

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