2018 Mustang Performance Package Level 2 (PP2) "Tremor Package" Contents Revealed

[TomcatDriver]

3 - People who pay for a $6,500 harder core performance package with a low splitter and tires that are only suitable for track driving, are people who in general will be more likely to track the car and track the car harder, compared to the casual buyer of a $4,000 PP.

Put it all together and what you got away with on the GT PP will come back to bite you on the GT PP2.

Been there, done that.

Fixed that for ya.

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[Baron95]

Fixed that for ya.

Sorry, but no. The vast majority of GT PP owners out there bought it when it was a much cheaper package.

GTPP was a "why not" package, with zero downside.

GTPP2 forces you to make some serious compromises. Don't drive over speed bumps, steep driveways, car washes, etc. Don't drive in the rain. Etc. People don't put those types of packages in their cars lightly.

 

[stanglife]

I don't know anyone who says that.

First of all the GTPP2 can probably only run about 1 hour continuously on a track, before it needs to get off track due to being out of fuel. So ˜1hr is the maximum uninterrupted time it would need to have thermal resistance to. So your comment on "all day" is not even applicable.

What most people think when they see "track" or "track package" or "performance pack level 2" with a $6,500 price tag, and tires that are ONLY suitable for track driving", is that the car can do a normal 20min-30min HPDE session, with proper warm up and cool down laps in that time, so 15-25 min of at pace track driving.

If PP2 can't do that without extra, warranty voiding, aftermarket coolers it is a ridiculous fail.

If people jump to all of those conclusions and then complain after-the-fact, when it over heats - THAT's a fail ;)

PS - That's kinda what I was saying - people make a bunch of assumptions...put expectations and number on it (you posted some) then pretend some kind of magic should happen that prevents 4-500hp car from overheating without auxiliary coolers...then act surprised.

 

[stanglife]

3 - People who pay for a $6,500 harder core performance package with a low splitter and tires that are only suitable for track driving, are people who in general will be more likely to track the car and track the car harder, compared to the casual buyer of a $3,000 PP.

You might be overplaying that a bit. Many of us have been driving our GT350Rs on the street without significant issues (the tires are the most unfriendly but workable unless it's raining..I replaced mine).

GTPP2 forces you to make some serious compromises. Don't drive over speed bumps, steep driveways, car washes, etc. Don't drive in the rain. Etc. People don't put those types of packages in their cars lightly.

Again, it's not that bad. Except for the tires, I'd 100% DD a new PP2.

 

[Baron95]

If people jump to all of those conclusions and then complain after-the-fact, when it over heats - THAT's a fail ;)

I disagree. If the GT Performance Package Level 2 overheats on a normal 30 min track session at average summer temperatures of ~85F on the tarmac, it is a fail. Full stop. It will be perceived as a fail. The press will report it as a fail. There is no escaping it.

then pretend some kind of magic should happen that prevents 4-500hp car from overheating without auxiliary coolers...then act surprised.

There is no "magic" required. Only proper engineering. Chevy did it on their $45K SS 1LE. Ford did it on their $60K "fixed" 2017+ GT350. Porsche does it all day on all its sports cars. BMW M does it in most of theirs. Etc.

The fact of the matter is that Ford knows they have a problem with overheating on the platform. They suffered a black eye on the GT350. And yet, they are doing it again on the PP2, by not including coolers.

If they think they can hide behind that not in the owners manual they are mistaken. If the cars overheat it will be a PR nightmare for Ford.

 

[Cgocifer]

At least offer extra coolers as an option so folks who really plan to track it (80% wont) can spend the extra $. They must have a packaging issue.

 

[TomcatDriver]

Sorry, but no. The vast majority of GT PP owners out there bought it when it was a much cheaper package.

GTPP was a "why not" package, with zero downside.

GTPP2 forces you to make some serious compromises. Don't drive over speed bumps, steep driveways, car washes, etc. Don't drive in the rain. Etc. People don't put those types of packages in their cars lightly.

All I was saying is the GTPP was a $3000 package. The GTPP is a $4000 package now ($3995 if you want to get picky).

 

[stanglife]

I disagree. If the GT Performance Package Level 2 overheats on a normal 30 min track session at average summer temperatures of ~85F on the tarmac, it is a fail. Full stop. It will be perceived as a fail. The press will report it as a fail. There is no escaping it.




There is no "magic" required. Only proper engineering. Chevy did it on their $45K SS 1LE. Ford did it on their $60K "fixed" 2017+ GT350. Porsche does it all day on all its sports cars. BMW M does it in most of theirs. Etc.

The fact of the matter is that Ford knows they have a problem with overheating on the platform. They suffered a black eye on the GT350. And yet, they are doing it again on the PP2, by not including coolers.

If they think they can hide behind that not in the owners manual they are mistaken. If the cars overheat it will be a PR nightmare for Ford.

They've made no promises - in fact, they state a clear warning. I know it's arguable but IMO, they also didn't make any promises for the 16 GT350 "Tech" package. I don't know how it will perform but if, after all that has happened, I angrily posted on here about my PP2 overheating...I'd expect to be called a moron. We're kind of agreeing that it needs coolers, I know. I'm just saying that this is how Ford works.

The only part of the argument that holds water (and you didn't even make this point, I'm going to do it for you) is that it's confusing that Ford (at this point, maybe this will change) forces SC2 tires on this model...It, more than anything else, suggests that it should be more at home on the track. They offered those on the R which has full coolers...SO I expect that we might seeL
1 - Ford offers car with street tires
2 - Ford offers trans/diff coolers. (free or pay, who knows)
3 - Ford sells car with a clear disclaimer regarding cooling capacity.

I hope that it's a pleasant surprise with coolers included but even that is expensive for them and at some point, GT350 owners will feel encroached upon (some do now, not me...yet..I understand that cars improve and it is what it is...but offering a car with too many competing features in the same MY as your halo track car might start to push it with me.

I don't think it was much of a black eye...or at least, it healed fast - the continued to sell as many cars as they wanted.

 

[Lucky13Cat]

For me the PP2 is gorgeous. Best looking wheels ever put on a Mustang :love:IMO. As usual you can't always get want you want- Auto 10 speed and those wheels together, just can't have it. Can't do another 3.73 car.:frusty:

 

[Since-64']

For me the PP2 is gorgeous. Best looking wheels ever put on a Mustang :love:IMO. As usual you can't always get want you want- Auto 10 speed and those wheels together, just can't have it. Can't do another 3.73 car.:frusty:

What's wrong with a 3.73 car... Didn't like it for daily driving duties?

 

[sigintel]

Kodak moment

Ford execs need to case study Kodak.
Kodak invented the digital camera.
They wrongly concluded that developing digital imaging would cannibalize their chemical film business and ceded an entire industry they founded to their competition.
Why?
Because they acted based on what they could easily quantify instead of what they could not quantify.
They could say exactly how much less money a consumer would pay Kodak per image if chemical developing were not needed.
They could NOT quantify the opportunity lost in not pursuing todays $15 Billion digital camera market.

Ford doesn’t have time for this. Scrap the 5.2 low volume engine as a costly halo item.
Introducing the 2018 Mustang “Grassroots/trackrat/Detroit/COTA/Americas” Special:
Keep the cheaper halo items: 10qt oil pan w baffling, oil pump housing?, suspension, coolers, variable exhaust, brakes. Yes they are lower volume but much lower risk vs the 5.2 engine. Offer base interior.
Having tracked a 2015 5.0 with a Whipple during the summer, this engine is insanely durable. Just give us a base package w coolers and let us take the risk of adding low mount turbos or a Whipple or centri.

Speaking of digital cameras: where is the PDR for the Mustang?

The lost GT350 sales are easy to quantify.
The lost SS 1LE sales are difficult to quantify.

You are so close to taking the Mustang legacy to another level. You dont need to recreate previous legacies like Mach,Bullet, etc etc. - thats like saying you cant do anything unique anymore. Time for a new legend. :amen::ford:

Ford needs more concepts and something desirable as electric, hybrid or small four. Please show us a downscaled mustang shooting brake concept w lighter chassis and front wheels pushed forward w a turbo4, hybrid and electric option.
Its ok if a 5.0 could be shoe horned in later.

 

[Spirit Of Fire]

I hope that it's a pleasant surprise with coolers included but even that is expensive for them and at some point, GT350 owners will feel encroached upon (some do now, not me...yet..I understand that cars improve and it is what it is...but offering a car with too many competing features in the same MY as your halo track car might start to push it with me.

I don't think it was much of a black eye...or at least, it healed fast - the continued to sell as many cars as they wanted.

The upcoming refreshed 2019 Camaro SS, which is going to be the refreshed Mustang's main competitor, is being benchmarked against the GT350. I don't think it matters if GT350 owners feel encroached on by a more capable Mustang GT, The GT needs to be able to match the performance of its rival or be left behind.

My guess is that the 2019 PP2 will have all the cooling issues sorted out in time to go toe-to-toe with the beast Chevy will be unleashing with their upcoming refresh. Ford still has the luxury to cheap out on these things for 2018.

 

[w3rkn]

1 - To install proper differential and transmission coolers it could be very expensive, with oil lines running from the back to the front of the car, multiple hose connections.

2 - It will void your warranty to mess with diff and transmission oiling/cooling.

3 - An engine oil cooler is a little easier to install, but also likely to void your warranty.

So the cost could be a few thousand dollars (parts + labor) or $10K+ if your engine fails and warranty is denied.

Either way, ridiculous, since you just paid $6,500 for the Performance Package Level 2, with tires that are recommended for track driving only.

Do you even own a mustang, or even know what you are talking about..?

If the PP2 does not come with an oil (& tranny) cooler (which is weird, because it has a separate gauge for it), then you can add one through the Ford Performance Racing Catalog. /eos



Mustang are not BMWs, you sound a little out of step. As if nobody has installed an oil cooler on their Mustang before. Or understand anything about Ford Performance Racing and what they do on the weekends.

U sound dERP!

 

[Ace]

My guess is that the 2019 PP2 will have all the cooling issues sorted out in time to go toe-to-toe with the beast Chevy will be unleashing with their upcoming refresh. Ford still has the luxury to cheap out on these things for 2018.

GT PP2 still misses 35lbft compared to the SS 1LE, so I don't think both cars are on par. Also no trans and diff coolers, no rear brembos, etc, so the PP2 clearly misses things in comparison. With the Camaro refresh benchmarked against the GT350, I don't think the upgrades of the PP2 are big enough.

As I said, GT PP2 is still a nice package. But I just doubt that it's that good on the track.

 

[Spirit Of Fire]

GT PP2 still misses 35lbft compared to the SS 1LE, so I don't think both cars are on par. Also no trans and diff coolers, no rear brembos, etc, so the PP2 clearly misses things in comparison. With the Camaro refresh benchmarked against the GT350, I don't think the upgrades of the PP2 are big enough.

As I said, GT PP2 is still a nice package. But I just doubt that it's that good on the track.

The refresh Camaro won't come until 2019, so my guess is that Ford will offer a more track capable package PP2 for MY2019. Regardless of the lower HP, a better handling package with great cooling could still hold its own on a track.

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