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15-17 vs 18+ engines

justang

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Was anything changed internally to beef up the engine for the extra torque? Just wondering if anything mechanical was upgraded, or if the stock tune just pushes it a little harder
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rebellovw

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Was anything changed internally to beef up the engine for the extra torque? Just wondering if anything mechanical was upgraded, or if the stock tune just pushes it a little harder
Higher compression 12:1
Larger Displacement
Larger valves
There is a whole writeup on the Coyote 3 which covers all the stuff.
 
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justang

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Thanks but I was referring to the ecoboost engine
 

TorqueMan

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I haven't seen anything official from Ford, but Car & Driver reports the changes were "made possible by a few lessons learned from developing the engine for the Focus RS, including software recalibrations."
 

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Cardude99

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I believe the tune is the only difference. No engine changes. Tune allows for over boost which nets the extra tq
 

Cxp

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Ford integrated the turbo into the exhaust manifold.
 

TorqueMan

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Ford integrated the turbo into the exhaust manifold.
Hmmm. One of the hallmarks of the EcoBoost line is the integrated exhaust manifold. That is the exhaust manifold is integrated into the cylinder head so that it can benefit from the engine's cooling system, but I have never heard of an integrated turbo. This would imply the exhaust manifold and turbo are a single, integrated, part. I believe the turbo and exhaust manifold are still separate parts on the 18+ models.

The 2.3L EcoBoost has always used a twin-scroll turbo, and the exhaust manifold keeps the exhaust flow from cylinders 2 and 3 seperate from cylinders 1 and 4, channeling the respective flows to different channels in the turbo inlet. You can learn more about how it works at this link.

I suppose you might say the turbo is integrated because of the way it depends on the exhaust manifold to divide exhaust flow, but that hasn't changed in the later models, and I haven't heard that the manifold and turbo have been integrated together. Do you have a link with more information about this?
 

w3rkn

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The manifold is part of the block, thus the turbo bolts to the block, not a manifold, thus integrated....!
 

RichBrew

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The manifold is part of the block, thus the turbo bolts to the block, not a manifold, thus integrated....!
so did that change from 17 to 18?
 

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TorqueMan

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The manifold is part of the block, thus the turbo bolts to the block, not a manifold, thus integrated....!
For the 2015-2017 MY the exhaust manifold is integrated with the head, not the block. This is the engine block:



I didn't have time to track down a photo of the OEM head, but this is a Ford Performance head for the 2.3L with integrated exhaust port (where the turbo bolts on):



Are you saying the 2018+ engines are different from the 2015-2017 MY engines? If so, can you post a link to your source?

BTW, when you bolt one part to another they are not integrated. Integrated means a single part. The exhaust manifold for the 2015-2017 MY engines is "integrated" with the head; the turbo is not because it's bolted on.
 

TicTocTach

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I wish Ford would ditch the integrated exhaust manifold. I'm sure they have fiscally-valid reasons for doing it that way (emissions, fewer parts, etc), but I'm sure the cruddy ports cost the engine an easy 20hp. I would wager it's also the cause of the mushy exhaust note this car has.
 

TorqueMan

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I wish Ford would ditch the integrated exhaust manifold. I'm sure they have fiscally-valid reasons for doing it that way (emissions, fewer parts, etc), but I'm sure the cruddy ports cost the engine an easy 20hp. I would wager it's also the cause of the mushy exhaust note this car has.
It's all trade-offs. You might get better exhaust flow with a header, which might produce more horsepower, but moving the turbo farther away from the head will reduce response time. More horsepower is great when you keep the engine up around redline, but turbo lag reduces power down low, where a street car engine spends most of its life. That would make the car less driveable.
 

TicTocTach

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I think it would be an interesting comparison - I'd wager that the stock turbo is small enough that most folks wouldn't notice any additional lag during normal use, but the folks who cared to add a more efficient header type exhaust would really benefit. My previous Honda Fit also had the integrated manifold going on, but it wasn't done for performance purposes. Moot point given that Ford isn't going to change the design any time soon.
 

TorqueMan

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I think it would be an interesting comparison - I'd wager that the stock turbo is small enough that most folks wouldn't notice any additional lag during normal use, but the folks who cared to add a more efficient header type exhaust would really benefit. My previous Honda Fit also had the integrated manifold going on, but it wasn't done for performance purposes. Moot point given that Ford isn't going to change the design any time soon.
What benefit do you see with a header? As I understand it, no matter what you do with a turbocharged engine the turbo will impose a flow restriction on the exhaust. In the bad old days the biggest exhaust issue for turbocharged engines was reversion. With the exhaust system pressurized between the cylinders and the turbo there is a danger that a portion of the exhaust from one cylinder just beginning its exhaust cycle may be forced backward into the exhaust valve of another that is just beginning its intake cycle. Increasing the length of the exhaust runners via a header helped cut down on this problem via momentum. For reversion to occur with a header installed the exhaust pulse from one cylinder will have to push all the way down its own runner and all the way back up the other cylinder's. The twin-scroll turbo system in our cars are all but immune to reversion because the exhaust pulses of cylinders that overlap are divided from each other. Given that, I'm not sure I see the benefit of a header unless you use a different turbocharger.

What am I missing?
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