GT500 - Power or Weight?

Hack · Apr 17, 2018

Hi-PO Stang said:
As I recall, Ford uses the term torsional dampers to reduce the vibration associated with the FPC.

Dual mass flywheel..

nastang87xx · Apr 17, 2018

Hi-PO Stang said:
As I recall, Ford uses the term torsional dampers to reduce the vibration associated with the FPC.

And it's still lighter than a 'Yote crankshaft. I believe the Voodoo crank is something like 48lbs. The 'Yote crank is mid 50's.

nastang87xx · Apr 17, 2018

ProblemHouston said:
Nah! I don't think ford is out to redesign this whole car for an outgoing platform. They are going to use what they already know and have and make it work. Example, the headlights they didn't want to create a new support so they just used the one in the GT350 and thus we get the old style lights. I get it.

Ford changed the '18 headlights because of new Euro/world standards for safety. Otherwise I'm willing to bed the headlights would have stayed the same. Since the GT500 is a North American car, they can leave it and it's also just cool that it sets said cars apart regardless of function or form.

65Terdlingua · Apr 17, 2018

Hi-PO Stang said:
As I recall, Ford uses the term torsional dampers to reduce the vibration associated with the FPC.

As Hack said, the only damping is in the dual mass flywheel. Torsional damper does not refer to a balance shaft.

Hi-PO Stang · Apr 18, 2018

Glad you cleared that up. So, how much heavier do you think the IRS will be in a GT500 than a Mustang GT ? If the Ford engineers cant find a way to replace steel components in the IRS with high strength aluminum , I will be surprised and disappointed.

Eritas · May 16, 2018

Why would a GT500 it's be heavier than a GT or GT350 IRS?

Nameless · May 16, 2018

Eritas said:
Why would a GT500 it's be heavier than a GT or GT350 IRS?

Beefed up suspension/diff.

Hi-PO Stang · May 17, 2018

If Strange Engineering can make an aluminum center section for the 9 inch Ford rear end housing that sees extreme horsepower in drag cars, I don't see why Ford cannot offer an high strength aluminum IRS for the GT500. Just think of the number of people who would buy an aluminum IRS for their Mustang from Ford performance parts.

BmacIL · May 17, 2018

Hi-PO Stang said:
If Strange Engineering can make an aluminum center section for the 9 inch Ford rear end housing that sees extreme horsepower in drag cars, I don't see why Ford cannot offer an high strength aluminum IRS for the GT500. Just think of the number of people who would buy an aluminum IRS for their Mustang from Ford performance parts.

Are you talking about the subframe or the diff?

Nameless · May 17, 2018

Hi-PO Stang said:
If Strange Engineering can make an aluminum center section for the 9 inch Ford rear end housing that sees extreme horsepower in drag cars, I don't see why Ford cannot offer an high strength aluminum IRS for the GT500. Just think of the number of people who would buy an aluminum IRS for their Mustang from Ford performance parts.

Because it's expensive and the bean counters would allow it. If something is (for example) "one dollar" more expensive than something else and it's not extremely necessary/vital, they will leave it away.

Even if you don't see it that way, for manufacturing plants one dollar (per unit) is A LOT of money.

Darkane · May 17, 2018

Hi-PO Stang said:
If Strange Engineering can make an aluminum center section for the 9 inch Ford rear end housing that sees extreme horsepower in drag cars, I don't see why Ford cannot offer an high strength aluminum IRS for the GT500. Just think of the number of people who would buy an aluminum IRS for their Mustang from Ford performance parts.

It exists. You can literally walk into any ford parts dealer and buy one.

It’s aluminum, I calculated about 20-25lbs lighter. It’s only available on the auto GTs. I’m talking about the IRS pumpkin here. The manual cars and the 350 have the steel unit with aluminum cover.

It probably won’t hold up to slicks and clutch dumps, that’s why it’s auto only.

68fbjjz109 · May 17, 2018

Darkane said:
It exists. You can literally walk into any ford parts dealer and buy one.

It’s aluminum, I calculated about 20-25lbs lighter. It’s only available on the auto GTs. I’m talking about the IRS pumpkin here. The manual cars and the 350 have the steel unit with aluminum cover.

It probably won’t hold up to slicks and clutch dumps, that’s why it’s auto only.

I have one sitting in my garage, got it used for like 300 bucks. Just trying to decide if I keep the 3.73s or get some 3.55's and load my torsen into the aluminum Dif. I know some people have broken them so there is likely a more physics based reason. I have tossed around the thought it was to keep weight gain to a minimum on the auto cars, and you pay extra for the trans so the increased piece cost wasn't that big of a deal.

It could also be NVH issue with the manuals. We see it all the time. An OEM switches to an aluminum rear diff, ends up adding mass dampeners due to unforeseen harmonic issues associated with lightweighting.

Darkane · May 17, 2018

68fbjjz109 said:
I have one sitting in my garage, got it used for like 300 bucks. Just trying to decide if I keep the 3.73s or get some 3.55's and load my torsen into the aluminum Dif. I know some people have broken them so there is likely a more physics based reason. I have tossed around the thought it was to keep weight gain to a minimum on the auto cars, and you pay extra for the trans so the increased piece cost wasn't that big of a deal.

It could also be NVH issue with the manuals. We see it all the time. An OEM switches to an aluminum rear diff, ends up adding mass dampeners due to unforeseen harmonic issues associated with lightweighting.

Yeah I’ll buy that.

I wonder how it would hold up in a performance application with a high strength steel cover as opposed to the aluminum unit. Weight would be very similar still but increased strength on the ears.

68fbjjz109 · May 17, 2018

Darkane said:
Yeah I’ll buy that.

I wonder how it would hold up in a performance application with a high strength steel cover as opposed to the aluminum unit. Weight would be very similar still but increased strength on the ears.

I am not sure. I don't follow the failures too closely, as I don't drag race, but there seems to be a trend of bushing material changes with some of them that break, and its not just the rear ears, its also the integrated front ones.

I am not worried about it if I do swap to an aluminum unit, as my car is a street/HPDE car, not a quarter mile car. Aside from the weight savings I am actually hoping to get better cooling aswell.

BmacIL · May 17, 2018

I'd shy away from putting that aluminum housing on a manual car, even for the weight savings. Even if you don't drag race, driveline shock is a thing when shifting hard, as is cyclic fatigue.

GT500 - Power or Weight?

What would make for the best performing car? Power or Weight?

650hp & 3,640lbs

675hp & 3,780lbs

700hp & 3,920lbs

725hp & 4,060lbs

750hp & 4,200lbs

775hp & 4,340lbs

800hp & 4,480lbs

Hack

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