Hellcat Production - Lessons Learned

[shelby_r]

Thought the article below was VERY interesting, especially given what's happening with the GT350s (demand and ADM). Things I think are interesting, and could be applicable to GT350s, if Ford responds in like:

- Dodge is doubling their MY2016 production...they are also cancelling 900 MY2015 orders
- Dealers who moved Hellcats will get more, those who get a few and charged a premium above MSRP will get "penalized". Interesting.
- The ancillary affect: MY2015 Hellcats will be more rare (4000 units); which ups the value even more.

https://www.yahoo.com/autos/dodge-doubles-hellcat-production-for-2016-but-125179385757.html

I wonder what, if anything, Ford may do in response to similar demand/ADM issues with dealers. Time will tell.

:ford:

Sponsored

 

[likeaboss]

Thought the article below was VERY interesting, especially given what's happening with the GT350s (demand and ADM). Things I think are interesting, and could be applicable to GT350s, if Ford responds in like:

- Dodge is doubling their MY2016 production...they are also cancelling 900 MY2015 orders
- Dealers who moved Hellcats will get more, those who get a few and charged a premium above MSRP will get "penalized". Interesting.
- The ancillary affect: MY2015 Hellcats will be more rare (4000 units); which ups the value even more.

https://www.yahoo.com/autos/dodge-doubles-hellcat-production-for-2016-but-125179385757.html

I wonder what, if anything, Ford may do in response to similar demand/ADM issues with dealers. Time will tell.

:ford:

It's smart of Dodge and sucks for greedy dealers. They make money on units sold not ADMs like the dealer. The more Hellcats they can make the more they make. Simple economics for FCA.

As for 2015 Hellcats being more valuable. We'll have to wait about 30 years to find that out.

The GT350 does not have a set production limit like the 50thLE or 2 year run like the Boss 302. Ford has plans to make this car for a long time if it sells well. Ultimately providing better versions as time goes by. For instance it's pretty much a lock the regular 2017 GT350 will have a option that combines the best of the track and tech packs.

 

[Cruzinaround]

From what I gather based on the meetings going on and the buzz with the strategy groups....it's in the cards. Ford will follow with some type of penalization.

Dealerships are about to get a reality check.

 

[likeaboss]

From what I gather based on the meetings going on and the buzz with the strategy groups....it's in the cards. Ford will follow with some type of penalization.

Dealerships are about to get a reality check.

I've heard similar info as well. I know a lot of people at Ford Performance aren't thrilled about the dealer network making all the hard work they did to keep the price down go to waste. They certainly want dealers to get as close to MSRP as possible, but tacking $10-30K on is getting out of hand and defeats the value proposition of this car.

 

[jjw]

It seems to me I was recently blasted for saying something along these lines.
We shall see.

 

[PP0001]

The GT350 does not have a set production limit like the 50thLE or 2 year run like the Boss 302. Ford has plans to make this car for a long time if it sells well. Ultimately providing better versions as time goes by. For instance it's pretty much a lock the regular 2017 GT350 will have a option that combines the best of the track and tech packs.[/QUOTE]


When Ford started producing the new generation Boss 302's in 2010 are you telling me that they had set production numbers for the two year run?

I can tell you they did not and as we all know Ford built ~8400 Boss 302's over the two year run but had no definite number of cars in mind back in 2010.

With respect to Ford planning to produce the GT350 for a long time if it sells well, what is your source of information to substantiate that claim and how many years do they plan on building this car?

Lastly, tell me more about this 2017 option that combines the best of the track and tech packages?

This option certainly is interesting given the fact that Ford has not even confirmed that they are building a 2017 model?

Maybe you have some inside information that you want to share with the rest of us?

:shrug:

 

[ihc95]

I saw that article and thought is was very interesting as well. I wonder if all of the 900 orders will be kept by the people who ordered them, especially since those people are said to get a discount on their MY 2016 Hellcat.

Honestly though, I dont ever see GT350 demand ever being as ridiculously high as the Hellcat. There are not as many Americans that value (or even understand) the purpose of the whole FPC thing and the great handling the 350 is supposed to have as opposed to "707 HP." But that's just my opinion anyway.

 

[jjw]

Ford does not want to "overproduce" these cars. That said, there is a difference between having them sit on dealers lots and having enough to go around. I'll bet they will trickle them out slowly or at least take orders to meet demand once they meet their target numbers and anyone willing to pay MSRP over the next 2 years will be able to buy one. They probably are guessing the market is 4-5k cars per year, not saying that is the # they will limit production at.

 

[Todd15Fastback]

I saw that article and thought is was very interesting as well. I wonder if all of the 900 orders will be kept by the people who ordered them, especially since those people are said to get a discount on their MY 2016 Hellcat.

Honestly though, I dont ever see GT350 demand ever being as ridiculously high as the Hellcat. There are not as many Americans that value (or even understand) the purpose of the whole FPC thing and the great handling the 350 is supposed to have as opposed to "707 HP." But that's just my opinion anyway.

Interesting. I think the other way.

Since the FPC is thought of as exotic (think Ferrari, Lotus, etc.), I think this brings non typical Ford/Mustang owners into the picture. I think a lot of higher end foreign car buyers will be laying down money for this.

 

[jjw]

Honestly though, I dont ever see GT350 demand ever being as ridiculously high as the Hellcat. There are not as many Americans that value (or even understand) the purpose of the whole FPC thing and the great handling the 350 is supposed to have as opposed to "707 HP." But that's just my opinion anyway.

The people that typically "get it" are buying foreign cars, or something like c6 Z06's. This is exactly what Ford is going for. They checked the bragging rights HP box with the 13-14 GT500 and are moving on to something else for a while. This car is all about balance and total package. There are people who get that, and they typically buy higher end cars. I met a friend of a friend with a 991 GT3 and he could not be more excited to get his Track Pack car. There are plenty more like him who are waiting to see some reviews and #s before they order.

 

[jjw]

Interesting. I think the other way.

Since the FPC is thought of as exotic (think Ferrari, Lotus, etc.), I think this brings non typical Ford/Mustang owners into the picture. I think a lot of higher end foreign car buyers will be laying down money for this.

There are also buyers who were once "mustang guys" in their youth that moved upscale as they got older, their incomes increased etc. This is a car that will bring them back.

 

[5.0 435]

One of the problems is dealers offering to buy from others dealers over MSRP. Then they think they can turn around and jack it up even higher. Just sucks. I know they are independent dealers and why not get what you can. This has been going on for a long time. One dealer I contacted thinks they can get ---wait got it ---- $50k over.:doh:
Hell I'll go buy a Jaguar F-type conv. V/8 S 2014 for $58k. 0 to 60 3.7 yep that's what I'm doing
Hell with this ADM crap .

 

[PP0001]

Thought the article below was VERY interesting, especially given what's happening with the GT350s (demand and ADM). Things I think are interesting, and could be applicable to GT350s, if Ford responds in like:

- Dodge is doubling their MY2016 production...they are also cancelling 900 MY2015 orders
- Dealers who moved Hellcats will get more, those who get a few and charged a premium above MSRP will get "penalized". Interesting.
- The ancillary affect: MY2015 Hellcats will be more rare (4000 units); which ups the value even more.

https://www.yahoo.com/autos/dodge-doubles-hellcat-production-for-2016-but-125179385757.html

I wonder what, if anything, Ford may do in response to similar demand/ADM issues with dealers. Time will tell.

:ford:

Ruben, great job of locating this interesting information!

 

[Cruzinaround]

The GT350 does not have a set production limit like the 50thLE or 2 year run like the Boss 302. Ford has plans to make this car for a long time if it sells well. Ultimately providing better versions as time goes by. For instance it's pretty much a lock the regular 2017 GT350 will have a option that combines the best of the track and tech packs.

When Ford started producing the new generation Boss 302's in 2010 are you telling me that they had set production numbers for the two year run?

I can tell you they did not and as we all know Ford built ~8400 Boss 302's over the two year run but had no definite number of cars in mind back in 2010.

With respect to Ford planning to produce the GT350 for a long time if it sells well, what is your source of information to substantiate that claim and how many years do they plan on building this car?

Lastly, tell me more about this 2017 option that combines the best of the track and tech packages?

This option certainly is interesting given the fact that Ford has not even confirmed that they are building a 2017 model?

Maybe you have some inside information that you want to share with the rest of us?

:shrug:

The Word I get from the Commercial Strategy teams is that the Boss 302 was never intended to be a long term run since the Trinity Gt500 on the out going s197 platform and then the VooDoo GT350 on the incoming S550 chassis was already a plan in progress.

In Other words it was a planned obsolescence.

What we have in the incoming GT350 is going to proliferate into other models and actually set some new standards.

It is what they call a true proof of concept vehicle. What they prove here will carry forward and become even more affordable and accepted in lesser vehicles.

 

[PP0001]

The Word I get from the Commercial Strategy teams is that the Boss 302 was never intended to be a long term run since the Trinity Gt500 on the out going s197 platform and then the VooDoo GT350 on the incoming S550 chassis was already a plan in progress.

In Other words it was a planned obsolescence.

What we have in the incoming GT350 is going to proliferate into other models and actually set some new standards.

We all knew that the new generation Boss 302's were only going to be a 2 year build based on the heritage of the 1969/1970 Boss 302 cars but my point was that they did not initially have a set plan in terms of production numbers for the two year run.

It is also interesting to note that it has been suggested to me from inside sources that the production numbers for the "R" model in 2016 will somewhat mirror that of the Laguna Seca numbers for 2012 and 2013.

With 787 LS's built in 2012 and 765 LS's built in 2013 can we expect ~750 GT350R's in 2016?

BTW, of the total Boss 302's built for 2012 and 2013 model years the LS model represented 18.5% of total Boss 302 production.

With those numbers in mind I suggest that the GT350R model production for 2016 will be somewhat less than 18.5% as was with the LS cars but I have been wrong many times before.

Sponsored