Sponsored

MAPerformance: Ultimate R&D Thread | Air, Fuel, & Turbo Upgrades

Status
Not open for further replies.

BigCatDan

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2015
Threads
7
Messages
196
Reaction score
14
Location
Here
Vehicle(s)
mustang
The ecoboost isn't made to compete with the GT. If you wanted GT straight line performance, you should have gotten a GT lol, but with the turbo upgrade bolt on vs bolt on the ecoboost would probably pull ahead on a GT. just need to spend that extra $4-5k

lol! Wait!? Nihil are you saying that that the turbo 4 eco can't ever beat a big bad v8 off the line???;-)
Made to compete or not, it's Adam's stated goal to best a GT with the Eco. And he seems to be doing it.
I'm bringing up my concerns about the turbo lag and heat soak sitting at a stoplight next to a GT/Camaro/SRT/ in 90 degrees temps. That's where "I" want to beat them. I'll have 200 to 600 lbs on them, now I need Adam to take care of the rest!:headbang:
Sponsored

 
OP
OP
MAPerformance

MAPerformance

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2015
Threads
137
Messages
1,681
Reaction score
1,001
Location
Cottage Grove, MN
Website
www.maperformance.com
First Name
Sales
Vehicle(s)
2015 Ecoboost Base w/ Performance Package
Adam,

1) The 390/390 with the turbo kit.. is that with a stock fmic and catback?
(And yes I understand that upgrading the stock FMIC is a must regardless) :):)

2) To get to the approx. 420/420 plus, what would we need, other than the suggested upgraded head studs and valve springs?
1. It includes all our products. Turbo kit, Intercooler, Catback, Downpipe (turbo kit specific).

2. If you want to make 420/420, to put less stress on the factory engine at that power level, run a bigger turbo 6062 or bigger. It will make power at less load, require less boost, and the torque will come in later in the powerband because of the added lag. I would also suggest headstuds at that point at a minimum, we just threw a set in ours as we are going to start testing our cylinder head development. The factory head gasket is solid, so no problems there. Valvesprings would be ideal as well, but aren't required, but it should definitely show gains up top with better valvetrain.
 
OP
OP
MAPerformance

MAPerformance

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2015
Threads
137
Messages
1,681
Reaction score
1,001
Location
Cottage Grove, MN
Website
www.maperformance.com
First Name
Sales
Vehicle(s)
2015 Ecoboost Base w/ Performance Package
Just wanted to share this from another post, good info.

Correct, the commanded EQ went up significantly once we started using the RaceGas additive @405hp. There is lot's of fuel left in the tune itself, here is an example of the car running out of fuel @5000rpms, and me making the necessary adjustments to gain more fuel. You can see I overshot it a little bit as my target AFR was 11.7 at this time, just shows what you can achieve within the tune itself.





Many of you have seen the video I posted of our 5858 turbo kit on the street (if not I will post it below), here is a log from the end of that video where I was racing the GT. I cut out 2nd gear in this pull because it cluttered the graph and it was very short with tire spin included. So the graph below is 3rd and 4th, 2 people in the car, full tank of gas, and even MORE boost with a target AFR of 11.9.



Another thing I wanted to point out is the load comparison of street versus our dyno. The first graph below is on our dyno, and the second graph is on the street. You can see they are both producing ~2.7 load at 5500rpms, so the tables we are hitting on the dyno are the same tables we are hitting on the street. Boost is the same, fuel command is the same, VE is the same, STFT is the same, and the results are the same. POWER!






One trend I have noticed is that most of the people that have posted about fuel issues are running hardware other than Cobb. I think I'm going to reach out to SCT and see if they are willing to send over their software so I can tinker around with it to see if I can produce the same results as I outlined above.

The car has been everyday on the street since last Monday, with tons of abuse and it still hasn't given us a single issue.

And, for the video:

 

BigCatDan

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2015
Threads
7
Messages
196
Reaction score
14
Location
Here
Vehicle(s)
mustang
1. It includes all our products. Turbo kit, Intercooler, Catback, Downpipe (turbo kit specific).

2. If you want to make 420/420, to put less stress on the factory engine at that power level, run a bigger turbo 6062 or bigger. It will make power at less load, require less boost, and the torque will come in later in the powerband because of the added lag. I would also suggest headstuds at that point at a minimum, we just threw a set in ours as we are going to start testing our cylinder head development. The factory head gasket is solid, so no problems there. Valvesprings would be ideal as well, but aren't required, but it should definitely show gains up top with better valvetrain.
Why the need for 6062 for that power? Not arguing, i'm actually a little confused. I thought you were getting the 420/420 with the 5858.
Then there is this in the other thread:
"We have reached the limits of the 5858 on this engine, if we had the 5862 like we will be shipping with our kits we would easily be making 435-440hp."

I'm trying to find the best option for me. I don't want it to lag too much, and I prefer the power being not too high up in the rpm range. Although higher than stock, yes!

So Adam, help me please >
I don't plan on replacing the head or pistons anytime soon. head studs I can do.

5858 power realistically (approx.)
5862 power realistically (approx.)
6062 power realistically (approx.)
 

bigspoondude

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 15, 2015
Threads
1
Messages
219
Reaction score
17
Location
Oregon, USA
Vehicle(s)
2010 Scion xB
Why the need for 6062 for that power? Not arguing, i'm actually a little confused. I thought you were getting the 420/420 with the 5858.
Then there is this in the other thread:
"We have reached the limits of the 5858 on this engine, if we had the 5862 like we will be shipping with our kits we would easily be making 435-440hp."

I'm trying to find the best option for me. I don't want it to lag too much, and I prefer the power being not too high up in the rpm range. Although higher than stock, yes!

So Adam, help me please >
I don't plan on replacing the head or pistons anytime soon. head studs I can do.

5858 power realistically (approx.)
5862 power realistically (approx.)
6062 power realistically (approx.)
He said that 420/420 on the 5858 was starting to put mechanical strain on components. Strain on components is ok for race motors but its not what you want on your daily driver.
 

Sponsored

OP
OP
MAPerformance

MAPerformance

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2015
Threads
137
Messages
1,681
Reaction score
1,001
Location
Cottage Grove, MN
Website
www.maperformance.com
First Name
Sales
Vehicle(s)
2015 Ecoboost Base w/ Performance Package
Why the need for 6062 for that power? Not arguing, i'm actually a little confused. I thought you were getting the 420/420 with the 5858.
Then there is this in the other thread:
"We have reached the limits of the 5858 on this engine, if we had the 5862 like we will be shipping with our kits we would easily be making 435-440hp."

I'm trying to find the best option for me. I don't want it to lag too much, and I prefer the power being not too high up in the rpm range. Although higher than stock, yes!

So Adam, help me please >
I don't plan on replacing the head or pistons anytime soon. head studs I can do.

5858 power realistically (approx.)
5862 power realistically (approx.)
6062 power realistically (approx.)
You asked safely, so I provided you the safest option. Please refer to my statement in my last post; "It will make power at less load, require less boost, and the torque will come in later in the powerband because of the added lag." This all adds to the safety component that you were looking for. 5858 is a hair small for 420/420 but I'm able to produce those power levels with 27-28psi. Which causes more load, which in turn produces more stress.

I can't answer what the bigger turbo's will make for power, because I haven't properly tested them yet. However, as I mentioned previous we will be putting on our ported head soon, and adding a bigger turbo once we get the results from the ported head.
 

BigCatDan

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 16, 2015
Threads
7
Messages
196
Reaction score
14
Location
Here
Vehicle(s)
mustang
You asked safely, so I provided you the safest option. Please refer to my statement in my last post; "It will make power at less load, require less boost, and the torque will come in later in the powerband because of the added lag." This all adds to the safety component that you were looking for. 5858 is a hair small for 420/420 but I'm able to produce those power levels with 27-28psi. Which causes more load, which in turn produces more stress.

I can't answer what the bigger turbo's will make for power, because I haven't properly tested them yet. However, as I mentioned previous we will be putting on our ported head soon, and adding a bigger turbo once we get the results from the ported head.

Ok I see what your saying. Thanks for clarifying. I do want reasonably safe. Thank you Adam!
 
OP
OP
MAPerformance

MAPerformance

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2015
Threads
137
Messages
1,681
Reaction score
1,001
Location
Cottage Grove, MN
Website
www.maperformance.com
First Name
Sales
Vehicle(s)
2015 Ecoboost Base w/ Performance Package
Ok I see what your saying. Thanks for clarifying. I do want reasonably safe. Thank you Adam!
No problem! Let me know if you have any other questions.

-Adam
 

Juben

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 29, 2015
Threads
35
Messages
2,519
Reaction score
809
Location
Chattanooga, TN
First Name
Justin
Vehicle(s)
2015 EcoBoost Mustang (AT) w/PP
No problem! Let me know if you have any other questions.

-Adam
What's your actual fuel rail pressure (FRP Actual) look like? Do you have any logs and/or graphs of that? I wonder how similar it looks to the FoST/Fusions with bigger turbos. TIA :thumbsup:
 

Sponsored
OP
OP
MAPerformance

MAPerformance

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2015
Threads
137
Messages
1,681
Reaction score
1,001
Location
Cottage Grove, MN
Website
www.maperformance.com
First Name
Sales
Vehicle(s)
2015 Ecoboost Base w/ Performance Package
Utmost professionalism. Thank you very much for your efforts.

Sorry if it was stated previously, what turbine housing are you using on the 5858?
.63 A/R!
 
OP
OP
MAPerformance

MAPerformance

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2015
Threads
137
Messages
1,681
Reaction score
1,001
Location
Cottage Grove, MN
Website
www.maperformance.com
First Name
Sales
Vehicle(s)
2015 Ecoboost Base w/ Performance Package
OP
OP
MAPerformance

MAPerformance

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 14, 2015
Threads
137
Messages
1,681
Reaction score
1,001
Location
Cottage Grove, MN
Website
www.maperformance.com
First Name
Sales
Vehicle(s)
2015 Ecoboost Base w/ Performance Package
What's your actual fuel rail pressure (FRP Actual) look like? Do you have any logs and/or graphs of that? I wonder how similar it looks to the FoST/Fusions with bigger turbos. TIA :thumbsup:
Because this would potentially show data proprietary to my tuning strategies I don't wish to share at this time. If you want to share the FoST/Fusion data, I can let you know how they compare, however I wish to not show logs showing exact information.
 

DanFish

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 13, 2014
Threads
16
Messages
678
Reaction score
71
Location
Arizona
First Name
Dante
Vehicle(s)
2015 Ruby Red GT, 2015 Black Eco
My FRP Actual been maxing out at ~2900 with stock turbo. Don't know if that's good of bad.
Sponsored

 
Status
Not open for further replies.
 








Top