Ford Racing

[Roidrage]

You can't expect them to directly say why theirs is better. It'll just cause negative comments/arguments. You should look at the separate tuners threads to see the reviews/results.

Didn't ask why their's is better, asked about the differences between the tuning and platform methodology differences.

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[opensesame]

It is the EXACT same, no matter the software.

While I am glad to see Livernois active in this forum. A lot of mustang ecoboost owners such as myself are first time turbo owners and have no clue about the tuning market in terms of brands.

From what I've seen, you've got my respect, and if I decide to tune I would most likely purchase from you, however you should make it easier for everyone and post why your tune is better than theirs.

 

[Roidrage]

While I am glad to see Livernois active in this forum. A lot of mustang ecoboost owners such as myself are first time turbo owners and have no clue about the tuning market in terms of brands.

From what I've seen, you've got my respect, and if I decide to tune I would most likely purchase from you, however you should make it easier for everyone and post why your tune is better than theirs.

Coming from many turbo cars, tuners try not to discuss their tunes vs. other tuners because it can turn into a real shit show. I've seen fanboys and tuner reps fight it out on many forums so they try to tread lightly when discussing their tune vs other in terms of who's is better.

IHMO I think its better to understand the tuning methodologies (parameters) they tinker with vs. others (if they even know) to get a better understanding of what tuner you want to support. Ex. tuner 1 has max boost of 30PSI vs. tuner #2 who uses 25 psi but has higher timing etc.This is a VERY generic and simplistic example please don't quote me or something lol.

Personally, I would tend to gravitate to a tuner who can mange a decent bump in power without increasing boost from was 20 to say 30. Again, just a very simple example.

 

[mbreinin]

I wonder how much a stock ECU is. If you are that worried, you can just buy a stock ECU, take your original out and keep it safe, and then tune the one you bought, if you need any warranty work, pop your original back in and slide on in the DM's.

The ECU needs to be "married" to the engine. You don't just swap it out and go. The dealer has the hardware to do this.

 

[EcoSwag1990]

That's cool, i just hate to see vendors argue. I'm going to H&R block in an hour. If it's better than expected I may order a tuner tonight lol. Ford racing is just too slow. I'm honestly completely satisfied with my current power levels.. just want to do something else to my car. Out of curiosity how easy/long does it take to flash back to stock with the LMS tuner?

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

"...From what I've seen, you've got my respect, and if I decide to tune I would most likely purchase from you, however you should make it easier for everyone and post why your tune is better than theirs."

Thank you, even if you do not decide to do anything we are still here to help you with anything that you need.

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

Coming from many turbo cars, tuners try not to discuss their tunes vs. other tuners because it can turn into a real shit show. I've seen fanboys and tuner reps fight it out on many forums so they try to tread lightly when discussing their tune vs other in terms of who's is better.

IHMO I think its better to understand the tuning methodologies (parameters) they tinker with vs. others (if they even know) to get a better understanding of what tuner you want to support. Ex. tuner 1 has max boost of 30PSI vs. tuner #2 who uses 25 psi but has higher timing etc.This is a VERY generic and simplistic example please don't quote me or something lol.

Personally, I would tend to gravitate to a tuner who can mange a decent bump in power without increasing boost from was 20 to say 30. Again, just a very simple example.

100% agreed. But, there is no argument over who is better. All I said was that ALL tuning is detectable. Nobody can create a tune that is undetectable by a software engineer.

As per your example, we do not deviate far from stock boost levels with any of our tuning. Normally >2% boost. We take advantage of the logic of the ECU.

 

[Roidrage]

100% agreed. But, there is no argument over who is better. All I said was that ALL tuning is detectable. Nobody can create a tune that is undetectable by a software engineer.

Please don't misunderstand I am not saying you said your tune is better in anyway. I just want to understand the key tuning differences between all the tunes out there. But it seems like this is going to be hard to find. Therefore I just wanted to start with the tune I am most likely going to support. Which is yours

Feel free to PM me what you know if you prefer the information to stay private.

I've seen quite a bit of battles between APR, REVO & UNITRONIC over at the GTI forums haha.

 

[wireless]

I've seen quite a bit of battles between APR, REVO & UNITRONIC over at the GTI forums haha.

That's completely different! I used to tread on golfmk6 quite frequently, and I ultimately decided on Unitronic. I saw it mostly between Uni/APR -- and it was generally APR bashing everybody else. John was quite professional all the time lol.

Honestly, I think it's going to be the same here -- pick a tuner you like and can stand behind, someone with good support, etc. I don't think you can go wrong with any of them. Are the results going to be different? Yes... but that's for someone to decide.

We have a much more "open" arena for tuners than the VW's do, due to a much less complicated ECU architecture, not to mention the fact that these aren't nearly as heavily encrypted and integrated into a million other things. I like them discussing stuff, as long as it doesn't turn into bashing & as long as they don't put their trade secrets into public domain.

For example -- say Unleashed receives a customer who is having issues with their tune. They determine it is caused by, say, JJ, Adam, FFTEC, etc.'s tune. They will not post the info -- however, it is very probable that the customer will.

I think this is fine. Let the customer's post their testimony... but the vendor's should not do any sort of "bashing" yet I haven't seen any here. I like these discussions.

 

[Roidrage]

For me it's hard to go with a specific tuner without at the very least understanding what they "tuned". The ecoboost has so many different turners available it's a mindfuck just trying to differentiate them from each other. Which is my issue here haha. The vw community made it simple cause there were only three real options. Any who I think we are getting off track. I'll create a separate thread later for this particular discussion.

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

"...The ecoboost has so many different turners available it's a mindf--- just trying to differentiate them from each other. Which is my issue here haha...."

Totally understandable, there are about 18k different tables inside of the EcoBoost ECU! The biggest differentiating factor between us and all of the other tuners out in the marketplace is simple.

We do not use any of the 3 big 3rd party tuning companies...we have developed our own proprietary tuning software in-house. We wanted to have more access to the ECU, and what parameters we had access to. The tuning companies that you made reference to all use the same 3rd party tuning companies for their tuning, so all share the same limitations when it comes to tuning.

We have numerous world records and claims to firsts in the EcoBoost category alone. Take our 2.3L Mustang for example, we did not take delivery of our vehicle until 2 weeks after the car came out. We did some scientific testing;


Hit the dyno, and started tuning away;


We were first to market with tuning, first into the 12's, first in the 11's, quickest tune only EcoBoost S550 out there. The only car quicker than ours is a completely gutted car, with a larger turbo, 3.73 gears and a roll cage. Versus our full car minus the passenger seat and exhaust, stock engine and turbo, 3.15 gears and stock chassis. The trick is in the tuning, experience when it comes to the EcoBoost cars is EVERYTHING. We have proven this on every single EcoBoost platform that we offer tuning for, since 2009.

Now, unfortunately something called winter :tsk: has us in its grips and we are in a holding pattern. Our testing track opens back up in around 3 weeks so we have a few days scheduled for test and tune with a few cars that we have been tinkering with the past few months. So there will be news in the coming weeks, stay tuned!

 

[Ron@cp-e]

Totally understandable, there are about 18k different tables inside of the EcoBoost ECU! The biggest differentiating factor between us and all of the other tuners out in the marketplace is simple.

We do not use any of the 3 big 3rd party tuning companies...we have developed our own proprietary tuning software in-house. We wanted to have more access to the ECU, and what parameters we had access to. The tuning companies that you made reference to all use the same 3rd party tuning companies for their tuning, so all share the same limitations when it comes to tuning.

We have numerous world records and claims to firsts in the EcoBoost category alone. Take our 2.3L Mustang for example, we did not take delivery of our vehicle until 2 weeks after the car came out. We did some scientific testing;


Hit the dyno, and started tuning away;


We were first to market with tuning, first into the 12's, first in the 11's, quickest tune only EcoBoost S550 out there. The only car quicker than ours is a completely gutted car, with a larger turbo, 3.73 gears and a roll cage. Versus our full car minus the passenger seat and exhaust, stock engine and turbo, 3.15 gears and stock chassis. The trick is in the tuning, experience when it comes to the EcoBoost cars is EVERYTHING. We have proven this on every single EcoBoost platform that we offer tuning for, since 2009.

Now, unfortunately something called winter :tsk: has us in its grips and we are in a holding pattern. Our testing track opens back up in around 3 weeks so we have a few days scheduled for test and tune with a few cars that we have been tinkering with the past few months. So there will be news in the coming weeks, stay tuned!

tough to argue with that!!

 

[Livernois Motorsports]

tough to argue with that!!

Thank you.

 

[dragonacc]

Totally understandable, there are about 18k different tables inside of the EcoBoost ECU! The biggest differentiating factor between us and all of the other tuners out in the marketplace is simple.

We do not use any of the 3 big 3rd party tuning companies...we have developed our own proprietary tuning software in-house. We wanted to have more access to the ECU, and what parameters we had access to. The tuning companies that you made reference to all use the same 3rd party tuning companies for their tuning, so all share the same limitations when it comes to tuning.

We have numerous world records and claims to firsts in the EcoBoost category alone. Take our 2.3L Mustang for example, we did not take delivery of our vehicle until 2 weeks after the car came out. We did some scientific testing;


Hit the dyno, and started tuning away;


We were first to market with tuning, first into the 12's, first in the 11's, quickest tune only EcoBoost S550 out there. The only car quicker than ours is a completely gutted car, with a larger turbo, 3.73 gears and a roll cage. Versus our full car minus the passenger seat and exhaust, stock engine and turbo, 3.15 gears and stock chassis. The trick is in the tuning, experience when it comes to the EcoBoost cars is EVERYTHING. We have proven this on every single EcoBoost platform that we offer tuning for, since 2009.

Now, unfortunately something called winter :tsk: has us in its grips and we are in a holding pattern. Our testing track opens back up in around 3 weeks so we have a few days scheduled for test and tune with a few cars that we have been tinkering with the past few months. So there will be news in the coming weeks, stay tuned!

How can you be sure your tuning software is superior to Cobb's? We all know you've been in the game longer so it could just be your experience that sets you apart right now. But the head start won't last forever. Personally I'm a "show me" kind of guy. What actually is better about your software compared to Cobb? Serious question, if its really better I think we'd all like to know why.

 

[opensesame]

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