Ohlins Road and Track s550

[Bluemustang]

I'm trying to keep the wheel suspension geometry to 27.3 inch diameter from factory as much as possible. I have the 18x9 +40 or 44 (24lb per wheel 5-spoke OEM) at the moment.
As i said, bone stock for the past 6 years.

What I'm talking about is something different. The wheels won't affect the geometry of the suspension - more particularly, the angle of the front control arms. Different wheels/tires will affect the ride height (how low the car is to the ground) and so does running shorter springs. However, running shorter springs will change the angle of the control arms i.e. how the suspension system was designed from factory. Idk how the Mach1 for example is setup - does it have different control arms or does it use a "minimum drop" type of spring. You won't be able to use the rear springs from the Mach1 for sure because it was designed for Magneride. The front springs probably you could... I just don't know that for certain.

I post about this a lot because most people don't consider it... if you drop the car 1 inch you won't ruin the car... but there is an effect from changing the suspension geometry. When I started 8 years ago I knew nothing. But I learned through trial and error. The more informed you are about suspension dynamics the better you can engineer it to work the best.

You have the right mindset though. There is always a compromise. Although, IMO, the Mustang is too soft and I'd trade for firmer ride that is controlled and predictable enabling me to be confident in any corner I go into.

***One thing though. If you have a Mustang from 2018 and up, you would unfortunately need to modify the rear lower control arm to accommodate the Ohlins spring. 2018+ has updated control arms from 2015-17 years. The Ohlins was originally designed for the 2016 car and the rear spring cup/seat and is designed for that hole shape. @bnightstar has done it on his. It's doable, but definitely something you need to be aware of. Everything else will bolt on besides that one headache. 2015-2017 cars all have the same rear lower control arm and it will bolt on.

I do understand where Bnightstar is coming from. Suspension and ride quality and all that is subjective to the person. As good as the Ohlins are, I think even he feels that are a little too firm for his liking at times. But his preferences and the roads he drives on will be different from yours. So I don't blame him for his opinions, because well, they're his. And he has a lot of experience with the setup.

I will say, the good thing about the Ohlins - you can dial them down to be more compliant on the street and then dial them up for canyons or the track and they will work. In my limited testing in a month or so, adjusting the damping - it does a lot. Every click makes a difference. You can dial them up and down I'm pretty confident to suit your preferences. I am pretty picky lol. If you check out my build thread you'll see haha. And, there is room for you to go up in spring rate later. There is a lot of damping force. They're a lot more capable than the typical shocks and struts you can buy off the shelf from FP, Bilstein, Koni or Steeda.

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[guitrflip]

What I'm talking about is something different. The wheels won't affect the geometry of the suspension - more particularly, the angle of the front control arms. Different wheels/tires will affect the ride height (how low the car is to the ground) and so does running shorter springs. However, running shorter springs will change the angle of the control arms i.e. how the suspension system was designed from factory. Idk how the Mach1 for example is setup - does it have different control arms or does it use a "minimum drop" type of spring. You won't be able to use the rear springs from the Mach1 for sure because it was designed for Magneride. The front springs probably you could... I just don't know that for certain.

I post about this a lot because most people don't consider it... if you drop the car 1 inch you won't ruin the car... but there is an effect from changing the suspension geometry. When I started 8 years ago I knew nothing. But I learned through trial and error. The more informed you are about suspension dynamics the better you can engineer it to work the best.

You have the right mindset though. There is always a compromise. Although, IMO, the Mustang is too soft and I'd trade for firmer ride that is controlled and predictable enabling me to be confident in any corner I go into.

***One thing though. If you have a Mustang from 2018 and up, you would unfortunately need to modify the rear lower control arm to accommodate the Ohlins spring. 2018+ has updated control arms from 2015-17 years. The Ohlins was originally designed for the 2016 car and the rear spring cup/seat and is designed for that hole shape. @bnightstar has done it on his. It's doable, but definitely something you need to be aware of. Everything else will bolt on besides that one headache. 2015-2017 cars all have the same rear lower control arm and it will bolt on.

I do understand where Bnightstar is coming from. Suspension and ride quality and all that is subjective to the person. As good as the Ohlins are, I think even he feels that are a little too firm for his liking at times. But his preferences and the roads he drives on will be different from yours. So I don't blame him for his opinions, because well, they're his. And he has a lot of experience with the setup.

I will say, the good thing about the Ohlins - you can dial them down to be more compliant on the street and then dial them up for canyons or the track and they will work. In my limited testing in a month or so, adjusting the damping - it does a lot. Every click makes a difference. You can dial them up and down I'm pretty confident to suit your preferences. I am pretty picky lol. If you check out my build thread you'll see haha. And, there is room for you to go up in spring rate later. There is a lot of damping force. They're a lot more capable than the typical shocks and struts you can buy off the shelf from FP, Bilstein, Koni or Steeda.

Thank you so much! This is a million bucks! Appreciate everyone’s inputs. Did you have to pair this up with Stop-the-hop? Or is this good enough by itself with maybe sway bars. Can’t wait to get my hands on these.

 

[Bluemustang]

My thoughts are the same as yours, these cars are HEAVY, so there's a need of extra effort of making them better handlers.
I honestly, don't want to lower my car, I could careless about that. Let's just say I'm planning on pairing up these with either 20x10 Volks TE37 (+30 - 24lbs/wheel ) or Advan GT 20x10 +35mm (21 lbs/ wheel - YAY less unsprung weight). I may go 18x10 or 19x10.

The Ohlins coilovers will lower the car ~1" out of the box using the recommended preload. This is what I did. But you have some leeway to raise it a bit if you choose. Probably another 1/4" back up at least I'd say. I'm sticking with this for now. BUT, remember the front spring is 515#. That's a ton of roll resistance added back into it. This more than makes up for losing some anti-roll from geometry change. That's why I mention that. And you can run a lot more negative camber up front too which help keep the tire flat during hard cornering i.e. more leeway so it won't roll over. That is the main issue with the Mustang front suspension design - the MacPherson strut. The solutions are to add anti-roll with springs and bars and more negative camber. Then it will grip.

 

[Bluemustang]

Dude, it's about bloody time! I overhauled the suspension on my car within 6 months of buying it, it's deficiency was that obvious.

My bone stock 2015 GT used to get outhandled by Camrys and mini-vans! How embarrassing! Not even joking.

 

[Bluemustang]

Thank you so much! This is a million bucks! Appreciate everyone’s inputs. Did you have to pair this up with Stop-the-hop? Or is this good enough by itself with maybe sway bars. Can’t wait to get my hands on these.

Welcome! I would. I HIGHLY recommend you do some things to modify the chassis/bushings. Especially the rear IRS. This is maybe the worst problem this car has. It may sound like I'm trying to get you to spend money but I'm not lol. It really needs it if you want it to handle like you expect it to. The IRS subframe is the biggest culprit. I can help you with the most important items to address as can a lot of other users on here.

 

[guitrflip]

Welcome! I would. I HIGHLY recommend you do some things to modify the chassis/bushings. Especially the rear IRS. This is maybe the worst problem this car has. It may sound like I'm trying to get you to spend money but I'm not lol. It really needs it if you want it to handle like you expect it to. The IRS subframe is the biggest culprit. I can help you with the most important items to address as can a lot of other users on here.

Actually I do sense and hear some creaking from the IRS subframe and Bushing which I suspect is either wheel bushings or suspension chassis/bushings related. I’m okay with the spending as long as it gives me peace of mind when I take enthusiastic turns with confidence in the car. I’m overhauling the car with suspension and clutch upgrades early next year.

 

[Bluemustang]

@guitrflip - The main issue is with the IRS subframe bushings. They're big and soft and flex everywhere. So the subframe moves up and down, side to side and forward and back. And this is the foundation of the rear suspension... not exactly what you want to have happen driving it hard. It causes all sorts of weird handling issues and it makes the front and rear feel disconnected.

This is what I would do: (and then you can decide for yourself and solicit other opinions). *What I highly recommend to do and then other things you can do which will also help. You decide.

- *Caster/camber plates for up front

- *IRS subframe bushing mod/lock-out
I use the BMR CB005 but the Steeda solution will work too. Or you can just swap out the bushings themselves for polyurethane

- *Steeda IRS alignment dowels. This will center the rear subframe under the car. If you're dropping the subframe to install rear springs it makes sense to do. Often times it is not centered and can make one wheel stick out more than the other. And you know it will stay in the same place every time you need to drop it again.

- *Ford Performance toe-knuckle bearing

- *Upgrade front sway bar (decide later on the rear. Most ppl keep the rear stock - use this for final tuning)

- Upgrade vertical links (limit wheelhop)
- Rear lower control arm bushing (upgrade to Superpro poly bushing) or swap in a bearing. I use a bearing but the Superpro is cheap and works really well. Less NVH than a bearing.

I've even gone further than all this but I only listed things I think will help you most.

 

[Bluemustang]

Actually I do sense and hear some creaking from the IRS subframe and Bushing which I suspect is either wheel bushings or suspension chassis/bushings related.

Definitely check it out. You don't want that pop up after you do a lot of modifications and then have take the car apart again. Hard to say what the culprit could be.

 

[guitrflip]

@guitrflip - The main issue is with the IRS subframe bushings. They're big and soft and flex everywhere. So the subframe moves up and down, side to side and forward and back. And this is the foundation of the rear suspension... not exactly what you want to have happen driving it hard. It causes all sorts of weird handling issues and it makes the front and rear feel disconnected.

This is what I would do: (and then you can decide for yourself and solicit other opinions). *What I highly recommend to do and then other things you can do which will also help. You decide.

- *Caster/camber plates for up front

- *IRS subframe bushing mod/lock-out
I use the BMR CB005 but the Steeda solution will work too. Or you can just swap out the bushings themselves for polyurethane

- *Steeda IRS alignment dowels. This will center the rear subframe under the car. If you're dropping the subframe to install rear springs it makes sense to do. Often times it is not centered and can make one wheel stick out more than the other. And you know it will stay in the same place every time you need to drop it again.

- *Ford Performance toe-knuckle bearing

- *Upgrade front sway bar (decide later on the rear. Most ppl keep the rear stock - use this for final tuning)

- Upgrade vertical links (limit wheelhop)
- Rear lower control arm bushing (upgrade to Superpro poly bushing) or swap in a bearing. I use a bearing but the Superpro is cheap and works really well. Less NVH than a bearing.

I've even gone further than all this but I only listed things I think will help you most.

J&M includes caster/ camber plates with their customs. So that’s done. Yes! I might as well do all that you said when upgrading my entire suspension.

 

[Bluemustang]

J&M includes caster/ camber plates with their customs. So that’s done. Yes! I might as well do all that you said when upgrading my entire suspension.

I'm sure those are great. I have seen only positive reviews. I opted for stock Ohlins kit. When I spoke to Jason @ Vorshlag, that's what he recommended for me. Vorshlag sells custom rate Ohlins as well. They did a lot of testing on this kit on the track with 200tw tires as well as full slicks.

 

[guitrflip]

I'm sure those are great. I have seen only positive reviews. I opted for stock Ohlins kit. When I spoke to Jason @ Vorshlag, that's what he recommended for me. Vorshlag sells custom rate Ohlins as well. They did a lot of testing on this kit on the track with 200tw tires as well as full slicks.

Thoughts? I think this is everything that you mentioned.

 

[bnightstar]

***One thing though. If you have a Mustang from 2018 and up, you would unfortunately need to modify the rear lower control arm to accommodate the Ohlins spring. 2018+ has updated control arms from 2015-17 years. The Ohlins was originally designed for the 2016 car and the rear spring cup/seat and is designed for that hole shape. @bnightstar has done it on his. It's doable, but definitely something you need to be aware of. Everything else will bolt on besides that one headache. 2015-2017 cars all have the same rear lower control arm and it will bolt on.

I have a plan to test if the Mach 1 RLCA's fix this issue as the cup there seams to be round and I have a friend who has spare set of this that have bushing issues so considering what we were discussing with you regarding RLCA bearings maybe I can kill 2 birds with 1 stone.

I do understand where Bnightstar is coming from. Suspension and ride quality and all that is subjective to the person. As good as the Ohlins are, I think even he feels that are a little too firm for his liking at times. But his preferences and the roads he drives on will be different from yours. So I don't blame him for his opinions, because well, they're his. And he has a lot of experience with the setup.

I will say, the good thing about the Ohlins - you can dial them down to be more compliant on the street and then dial them up for canyons or the track and they will work. In my limited testing in a month or so, adjusting the damping - it does a lot. Every click makes a difference. You can dial them up and down I'm pretty confident to suit your preferences. I am pretty picky lol. If you check out my build thread you'll see haha. And, there is room for you to go up in spring rate later. There is a lot of damping force. They're a lot more capable than the typical shocks and struts you can buy off the shelf from FP, Bilstein, Koni or Steeda.

I think my original post was a bit to harsh to Ohlins so will try to elaborate:

1. I get tons of compliments even from non car people on how well my car rides. This is actually very good considering the crapy roads we have here.

2. My lap times improved by a lot when I got them also the car is very predictable on the limit and you can really feel what each wheel is doing

3. Car is controllable on the limit something that the OEM suspension was not.

The Downsides as I see them:

1. The RLCA's fix is a pita and my rear springs are making annoying noises over small bumps with slow speed. This is something I suspect helper springs or Mach 1 RLCA's or Steeda rear ride hight system could solve.

2. I forget to change the OEM ruber spring insulators when installing the Coilovers this are now making annoying sounds when parking. So will need to take the Ohlins out.

3. The Maintenance interval is a PITA (especially if you like me can't remove suspension at home).

4. Ride over bumps is a bit harsh at least for me and as I said my streets have a lot of this. But this might be in part because of the spring insulators issue.

Overall the ride of them on the street made me wanting to drive her less on street for few reasons:

1. The noises (I'm very sensitive on any noises in car) that this suspension makes are not always pleasant especially the thud sounds over bumps.

2. The Ohlins make the car insanely fast in turns which is very dangerous when around you you have family saloons and SUV's which are doing way slower turning than you. I know this is a first world problem but it is a problem.

So what I tried to do is point OP in a more street friendly direction as I know that even with simple mods like Steeda Front bar and proper alignment the car could be super fun on canyons (I drive it like that on stock PP1 springs for 2 seasons and ones it was dialed the car was super fun). Is it more fun now in turns ? Yes it is. Does it has compromises ? Yes it does.

 

[bnightstar]

Thoughts? I think this is everything that you mentioned.

If there is an option for the rear springs to be 800 instead of 900 will be better though this are probably individually valved. Also will check if this comes with camber plates. I suggest you get camber plates regardless.

 

[Bluemustang]

I have a plan to test if the Mach 1 RLCA's fix this issue as the cup there seams to be round and I have a friend who has spare set of this that have bushing issues so considering what we were discussing with you regarding RLCA bearings maybe I can kill 2 birds with 1 stone.



I think my original post was a bit to harsh to Ohlins so will try to elaborate:

1. I get tons of compliments even from non car people on how well my car rides. This is actually very good considering the crapy roads we have here.

2. My lap times improved by a lot when I got them also the car is very predictable on the limit and you can really feel what each wheel is doing

3. Car is controllable on the limit something that the OEM suspension was not.

The Downsides as I see them:

1. The RLCA's fix is a pita and my rear springs are making annoying noises over small bumps with slow speed. This is something I suspect helper springs or Mach 1 RLCA's or Steeda rear ride hight system could solve.

2. I forget to change the OEM ruber spring insulators when installing the Coilovers this are now making annoying sounds when parking. So will need to take the Ohlins out.

3. The Maintenance interval is a PITA (especially if you like me can't remove suspension at home).

4. Ride over bumps is a bit harsh at least for me and as I said my streets have a lot of this. But this might be in part because of the spring insulators issue.

Overall the ride of them on the street made me wanting to drive her less on street for few reasons:

1. The noises (I'm very sensitive on any noises in car) that this suspension makes are not always pleasant especially the thud sounds over bumps.

2. The Ohlins make the car insanely fast in turns which is very dangerous when around you you have family saloons and SUV's which are doing way slower turning than you. I know this is a first world problem but it is a problem.

So what I tried to do is point OP in a more street friendly direction as I know that even with simple mods like Steeda Front bar and proper alignment the car could be super fun on canyons (I drive it like that on stock PP1 springs for 2 seasons and ones it was dialed the car was super fun). Is it more fun now in turns ? Yes it is. Does it has compromises ? Yes it does.

All well taken sir! I can't blame you on any of that. Totally get where you're coming from. And you are right to point that there are compromises. You don't want some dude to be surprised when it is not what he thought he was buying. Over the years of modifying my suspension I have come across all sorts of noise gremlins and it definitely takes a lot of the fun out of it. Latest one was a rear camber arm. Luckily that's been solved for now and no noises at all.

Worth a shot on the Mach1 RLCA. Can you swap in a 15-17 LCA or no? Might be easy to find a used one and have it shipped and then you can gut the bushings anyway since you were thinking of modifying it. I wish I had the straight answer for you on that.

All good points regarding doing simple mods. Front bar, camber and better shocks would make a big difference for him.

I am coming from 6-7 years of modifying my suspension lol. So it's hard to remember what stock was like anymore. Especially if you do a lot of mods at once it makes hard to pinpoint exactly what did what.

 

[Bluemustang]

Thoughts? I think this is everything that you mentioned.

I can't help a whole lot on spring rates, except to say that is close to what I was running before with BMR/FP shocks. It worked well. I have no reason to think it won't work here.

I opted for the stock Ohlins rates of 515/800. They took longer than most in development and finally releasing this kit and I decided to go with the manufacturer here. They've been tested. And another reason is I wanted to jump up big time in front spring rate. I've come to the belief that the Mustang needs a big front spring. Front heavy, MacPherson strut... all those reasons. Talking to Vorshlag steered me this direction. Do they do this to err on the side of track handling? Maybe so. At least that's my suspicion. But as I said the stock dampers from Ohlins can handle more. @bnightstar contacted them and said they can do 650/1200 no problem. I believe it. There's a lot of damping force available.

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