Coyote engine oil for the track?

[JohnD]

5-50 is a upgrade and you want an oil for track work. That's what this oil was designed for, in opinion it is superior to mobil one.

JD unless you had an oil analysis done you have no idea if you were breaking down that oil. Do a search an read that 14 page report on all different brands and you'll find that 5-50 motorcraft is one the very best oils for racing.

No that are not totally different engines, coyote and voodoo

I have no doubt that "5-50 motorcraft" is a very good oil for racing. Racing being the key word there. I'm not racing. I used to road race, and actually won 3 championships, and found out the hard way why you need real good racing oil for real racing. But these days I'm doing HPDEs which are not even close to real road racing in terms of engine abuse.

The next time I turn 8250rpm with my Coyote :lol:, or decide to do real racing, I'll be putting in real racing oil. Hell, I havent even hit 6500 rpm yet, there's just no need for what I'm doing! For now, I'm going with Ford's recommendation to use 5W-20 synthetic that meets their standard, and I'll keep the evidence of my oil changes so there will be no dispute about complying with their recommended oil if I ever have an engine problem. Running a different weight oil than Ford calls for can have side effects with the phasers, oil flow volumes, return flow rate, bearing temperatures and many other things so I think I'll just take Ford's word on what oil I need.

Ford's oil change monitor in my car is monitoring the temps, rpms, engine loads all the time to figure out when I have abused my oil enough to need to change it. Right now, at 5400 road miles and about 120 miles of HPDE I'm at exactly 50%, so I'm pretty sure we're good.

Might do that oil analysis as you suggested, it can't hurt. Thanks for the idea on that.

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[Eritas]

What championships?

If you haven't hit 6,500 and you think the factory computer is the best determination for oil longevity, you probably should stick with the factory fill.

 

[Norm Peterson]

Running a different weight oil than Ford calls for can have side effects with the phasers, oil flow volumes, return flow rate, bearing temperatures and many other things so I think I'll just take Ford's word on what oil I need.

Does Ford's 5W20 recommendation specifically include track day driving? Even hint at it?

I'm sure that HPDE driving gets the oil a good bit hotter (and less viscous on an absolute scale) than was the basis for selecting 5W20 as being acceptable. Near as I can tell from a brief search, the viscosity of 30-weight oil at 250°F matches the viscosity of 20-weight oil at 230°F . . . a 20° improvement with respect to viscosity at operating temperature.

http://www.velcon.com/industrial/images/Graph1.jpg


Norm

 

[sigintel]

Dunno, but if you check the link to Ford from my previous post it is very clear the oil passage restrictions in the heads are very different between coyote and voodoo.
The oil pump housing geometry and oil filter bypass pressures are also higher flow oriented in the voodoo.
I am running a 5.2 oil pump and pan on my 5.0 with 5.0 restrictors. I would never run 5w-50 street as I never see 240CHT street.

I just run oil weight to match CHT on track.
195-210 (Reische 170 TSTAT and cooling mods) 5w-20
215-230 (Summer w Reische 170) 5w-30 or 0w-40
235-250 (Whipple 160 TSTAT lower flow) 5w-50

Oil gets changed after track weekends. Cant see any reason to run higher than 5w-30 on the street as its hard to get above 230 CHT even horsing around in stop go traffic with 170 tstat.

If making cold motor passes at drag strip, I would be very carefull w 5w-50 and suspect we have seen 1 or 2 broken opg on cold loaded pumps w heavy oil. The bypass setup and flow restrictors in our 5.0 heads are different for a reason. I would stick to 5w-20 for strip unless getting above CHT 235 by end of the quarter(doubtful).


I have found that switching back to higher temp TSTAT helps to oxidize back down any carbon deposits in cylinders.

 

[HeelToeHero]

Does Ford's 5W20 recommendation specifically include track day driving? Even hint at it?

I would say it does. The maintenance section in the owners manual gives special recommendations for track use and does not mention a viscosity change.

 

[DarkestHour]

Although it's not the same as the Gen 2 Coyote, the Gen 3 does call for 5W30 for HPDE type events.

 

[EFI]

Although it's not the same as the Gen 2 Coyote, the Gen 3 does call for 5W30 for HPDE type events.

Where does it say that? In the manual or a bulletin?

 

[HeelToeHero]

Where does it say that? In the manual or a bulletin?

Agree please post the document.

I've looked through the manual, searched the odd and nothing about this. I even downloaded the Australian manual and they don't even give viscosity recommendation.

 

[EFI]

Agree please post the document.

I've looked through the manual, searched the odd and nothing about this. I even downloaded the Australian manual and they don't even give viscosity recommendation.

Well he mentioned the Gen III Coyote, which is in the 18 MY...so it wouldn't be in your manual.

 

[HeelToeHero]

Well he mentioned the Gen III Coyote, which is in the 18 MY...so it wouldn't be in your manual.

I wasn't thinking 18...my mistake.

5w30 doesn't really get you much gains. I'm almost done the analysis I just need time to prepare all the data.

 

[Norm Peterson]

Well he mentioned the Gen III Coyote, which is in the 18 MY...so it wouldn't be in your manual.

This ↑↑↑

What it does suggest by being spec'ed for the newer, more complex, and slightly more powerful engine version is that 5W30 is good for a higher level of abuse (for lack of a better term) than 5W20.


Norn

 

[Crossroads]

Heavier weight means more friction, also less viscious, so less flow @ startup, and less trips through the oil cooler and filter.

While I have seen others complain of higher temps using heavier racing oil, I can only say running 5W 20 where the ambient temperature was 90 to 100 degrees, my factory oil temp indicator never ran above 55% even on cool down. It normally runs about 50% with spirited driving on the street. So only 5% more with 6-8 runs per day @ 4-6500K.

So 5W20 seems to be working for me.

 

[Optimum Performance]

Heavier weight means more friction, also less viscious, so less flow @ startup, and less trips through the oil cooler and filter.

While I have seen others complain of higher temps using heavier racing oil, I can only say running 5W 20 where the ambient temperature was 90 to 100 degrees, my factory oil temp indicator never ran above 55% even on cool down. It normally runs about 50% with spirited driving on the street. So only 5% more with 6-8 runs per day @ 4-6500K.

So 5W20 seems to be working for me.

Higher oil temps from the OEM gauge which is a calculation based on rpm v. oil pressure...possibly. A heavier oil will build more heat at some point but I have seen the gauge in the yellow on OE weights. A 5W-30 or 5W-50 will give you some margin if the oil gets hot enough.

 

[DarkestHour]

Where does it say that? In the manual or a bulletin?

http://www.fordservicecontent.com/F...icHRef=G1927731&div=f&vFilteringEnabled=False

5.0L: Prior to the track event, drain the engine oil, replace the oil filter and change the engine oil to 5W-30. After the track event, drain the engine oil, replace the oil filter and refill the engine oil with 5W-20.See Capacities and Specifications.

Page 243 - http://www.fordservicecontent.com/F...g-Owner-Manual-version-1_om_EN-US_09_2017.pdf

 

[EFI]

That's interesting.

So for the 2018 MY they increased both the capacity (to 10 quarts) and viscosity of the oil (at least for the track).

I wonder what prompted these changes.

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