Next mod?? Any recommendations

[KadenW23]

[MENTION=23881]KadenW23[/MENTION] I was looking at the Snow Performance Boost Cooler Stage 2 with the Snow Boost Juice. Now do you know if i need a throttle body spacer for this kit? are u able to active or deactivate this kit when needed? Let's say if i ran out of juice and don't got any in hand?

Yeah, I actually have the stage 2 kit siting at home right now waiting to be installed. and yes, you can activate and deactivate it, but you have to make sure you have some sort of hand held tuner that will allow you to switch back to a regular tune that will not require a meth inject. I believe that it was huge advantage to the stage 3 kit though, if you were to ever run low on fluids, it will automatically down tune the car, or something along those lines. basically preventing you to go into boost or strain your engine. I'm not 100% sure, so do not quote me on that. but I could see spending $400 more on a kit when I could save that and it may just take a little more time and force me to be a little more careful.

Also I would say the easiest way is to just order a spacer to install with the kit, otherwise you will have to drill/cut into a factory hose somewhere to install the injectors. the spacers are just a thread-and-go design making it extremely easy to install the injectors before the throttle body. If you ever need any help with the install just shoot me a PM, I would be more than happy to help in any way.

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[v8440]

I think unleashed has a kit designed specifically for our cars. By that, I mean it has pump and reservoir mounting brackets that bolt to specific places in our cars without any drilling, as well as an ecoboost-specific throttle body spacer that provides both boost reference for the meth pump control module as well as the place for the injection nozzle to be screwed in. I may be wrong about who has it, it might be Tune+. If I have the vendor wrong, I apologize. The price was $710 for the entire kit when I looked. This kit injects it where I would if I were rigging one up myself-after the turbo. I have two reasons for that: first, fine mists can indeed erode the fins on turbo compressor wheels over time. Second, injecting after the turbo allows you to get the full benefit of the charge cooling because you're injecting into hotter air than you are if you inject pre turbo. In fact, I'd wager that it's probably better to inject pre intercooler for that reason-you max out the cooling benefit of the meth mist and reduce the amount of heat the intercooler must deal with. This effect is pronounced enough that some people use meth injection instead of intercooling. The obvious downside to that is that the system won't be as reliable as an intercooler. The benefits would be reduced plumbing complexity and maybe upfront cost in some applications.

*EDIT* I was indeed wrong about the vendor, it IS Tune+ that offers the meth injection system I was talking about. Furthermore, he has reduced the price of the kit to $520 because it no longer includes the throttle body spacer, relay, and a switch.

 

[v8440]

Lexman, what does an aftermarket wastegate actuator do for our cars, assuming that the stock one is capable of reaching the boost that the ecm is calling for?

 

[KadenW23]

I think unleashed has a kit designed specifically for our cars. By that, I mean it has pump and reservoir mounting brackets that bolt to specific places in our cars without any drilling, as well as an ecoboost-specific throttle body spacer that provides both boost reference for the meth pump control module as well as the place for the injection nozzle to be screwed in. I may be wrong about who has it, it might be Tune+. If I have the vendor wrong, I apologize. The price was $710 for the entire kit when I looked. This kit injects it where I would if I were rigging one up myself-after the turbo. I have two reasons for that: first, fine mists can indeed erode the fins on turbo compressor wheels over time. Second, injecting after the turbo allows you to get the full benefit of the charge cooling because you're injecting into hotter air than you are if you inject pre turbo. In fact, I'd wager that it's probably better to inject pre intercooler for that reason-you max out the cooling benefit of the meth mist and reduce the amount of heat the intercooler must deal with. This effect is pronounced enough that some people use meth injection instead of intercooling. The obvious downside to that is that the system won't be as reliable as an intercooler. The benefits would be reduced plumbing complexity and maybe upfront cost in some applications.

I totally agree with this, I don't think I would ever do it pre turbo, but I have seen it done in some instance. as for pre-intercooler, yes it would help my cooling it more while going through the intercooler, but I wonder if you would lose that octane jump that everyone is looking for by going with a meth kit. Like I said, I'm no expert, just throwing around ideas. But from doing research I would say that just doing it right before the intake manifold, or even doing a manifold spacer between the blocking and intake would be two of the best places to do this install. when paired with an aftermarket FMI I believe these meth injection kits could see some massive gains when tuned properly.

Maybe someone who has some more experience in this field of modding will chime in with some solid info.

 

[v8440]

It's funny that I mentioned doing it between the turbo and intercooler-Adam's revised commentary on the new version of the kit seems to be saying exactly that-one of the places he recommends putting the nozzle is in the hot side of the intercooler itself. That would accomplish what I was thinking of-injecting the meth into the hottest section of the intake tract so that it absorbs the most heat possible from the charge air. Done pre-intercooler like this, it effectively helps the intercooler by removing a bunch of heat due to evaporation of the meth. I think the technical name for this is latent heat of evaporation. Anyway, I might have to see about rounding one of these up for my car.

 

[KadenW23]

It's funny that I mentioned doing it between the turbo and intercooler-Adam's revised commentary on the new version of the kit seems to be saying exactly that-one of the places he recommends putting the nozzle is in the hot side of the intercooler itself. That would accomplish what I was thinking of-injecting the meth into the hottest section of the intake tract so that it absorbs the most heat possible from the charge air. Done pre-intercooler like this, it effectively helps the intercooler by removing a bunch of heat due to evaporation of the meth. I think the technical name for this is latent heat of evaporation. Anyway, I might have to see about rounding one of these up for my car.

I wonder if it is possible to do some sort of dual stage injection where you have a larger injector pre intercooler for heat absorption, but then have another injector post intercooler for even further cooling and octane boost. this may be a bad idea and hard to calculate the correct flow amount for each injector due to their distance apart from each other. because I have seen people do dual injectors, but they are typically right next to each other.

 

[v8440]

I don't see any reason to do a pre and a post. I think pre will absorb the most heat possible. If you were to put a 2nd injector in the system, you'd still want to do it pre intercooler so that it would be injecting into the hottest possible air. As far as octane boost, that isn't related to where in the system it's being injected, it's due to the chemical properties of what you're injecting.

 

[KadenW23]

I don't see any reason to do a pre and a post. I think pre will absorb the most heat possible. If you were to put a 2nd injector in the system, you'd still want to do it pre intercooler so that it would be injecting into the hottest possible air. As far as octane boost, that isn't related to where in the system it's being injected, it's due to the chemical properties of what you're injecting.

Here is a solid forum topic on this exact discussion. It will save us the back and forth typing. but just like everything, each location has its advantages and disadvantages. I would still never put one pre intercooler if I had the ability to put one pre-intake extremely as easily as we have the ability to.

http://ls1tech.com/forums/forced-induction/1052698-spray-meth-before-intercooler.html

 

[v8440]

I see what they're saying. I don't believe corrosion would be a problem inside the intercooler, as the stuff won't just be sitting around in there. When it stops spraying, air will still be rushing through there. But, I think I was probably wrong on where to put the nozzle from a thermal standpoint. Some of those guys let the intercooler do most of the cooling, and then got iat's below ambient by injecting the meth post intercooler. That's awesome.

 

[TurboGlen]

Strictly speaking form a physics and heat transfer aspect I would do post intercooler. The latent heat of evaporation of the water/meth will remove a fixed amount of heat from the charge based on the amount of water/meth you inject assuming that all of it fully evaporate. If all ambient air conditions are the same (temperature, humidity, pressure, and flow across the IC...) the intercooler will transfer more heat out of the charge air the higher the temperature difference between the air charge and the aluminum in the intercooler is. You would get a lower charge temp if you placed the water/meth after the intercooler.

 

[v8440]

Ah, thanks for clarifying that. I knew the intercooler would remove more heat the higher the charge temperature is relative to ambient, but I thought the water/meth would also remove more heat when spraying into hotter air. Now that I know the amount of heat the mixture removes is essentially constant, I see that it makes much more sense to spray post intercooler.

 

[shelbywannabe]

i just installed the tune+ pre-gapped plugs yesterday afternoon and the car immediately accelerated smoother

Did you try regapping the stock plugs before buying the new ones as I hear they are often off right from the factory ?

 

[Djmike408]

[MENTION=23728]v8440[/MENTION] [MENTION=17913]TurboGlen[/MENTION] [MENTION=23881]KadenW23[/MENTION] so after reading all your comments and somewhat the external link it is better to use the methenol kit after the intercooler due to evaporation and it's healthier for the vehicle. I'm I correct?

 

[v8440]

I think so.

 

[Djmike408]

Does anyone know if the Water Methanol injection kit it's just bolt onso or you have to mess with the stock car wiring like the AEM kit

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